Transcript of the 10th RA meeting of 22 October 2014 5:30PM

Announcements by the Leader of the Representative Assembly

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Tor Karlsvalt
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Transcript of the 10th RA meeting of 22 October 2014 5:30PM

Post by Tor Karlsvalt »

Transcript of the RA meeting of 22 October 2014 at 5:30 PM SLT

RA Members Present: Gwyneth Llewelyn, Rosie Gray and Tor Karlsvalt, LRA pro Tempor
Absent: Cadence Theas, LRA; and CLEOPATRA Xigalia who had offered her resignation.

Agenda is at: http://forums.slcds.info/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=5961

Cadence Theas requested a 7-day vote.

Summary: This is the first meeting of the RA since Chancellor Ceasar Xigalia and Cleopatra Xigalia, RAM, resigned their posts and left CDS. The RA voted to accept the resignation of Cleopatra Xigalia. The RA passed a resolution commending the EO for appointing temporary EMs. Three members present at this meeting voted to amend the Constitution, Article II, in order to resolve an issue concerning the term of the Chancellor. Final ratification of the amendment is pending the 7-day vote of Cadence Theas. The RA enacted the Tier Collection and Land Reclamation Bill at 19:02:00. The RA discussed creating a caretaker Chancellor during this period after the resignation. Consensus was that a caretaker was not needed.

The Tier Collection and Land Reclamation Bill is at: http://forums.slcds.info/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=5735

The amendment to Article II is at: http://forums.slcds.info/viewtopic.php? ... 887#p35927

[17:33:30] Tor Karlsvalt: Welcome to this meeting of the CDS RA.
As you know, RA must address the recent resignation of our Chancellor, Ceasar Xigalia and a member of this body, Cleopatra Xigalia.
[17:33:33] Gwyneth Llewelyn: I see there is still a seat left.... to the right of Delia, front row...
[17:33:36] Gwyneth Llewelyn: (sorry)
[17:33:47] Tor Karlsvalt: But before we begin, I would like to pay our respects to our dear friend Molly Medier. Molly passed this Monday. Some of you have known her much longer than I. Yet I came to love Molly as a friend and enjoyed her light hearted humor and happy disposition. She was always a peacemaker in CDS.
She will be missed but long remembered.
[17:33:48] Gaius Tiberius Curio (Guillaume Mistwalker): Wow, this is the most people I've ever seen here!
[17:33:53] Leslie Allandale: can sit on the ground
[17:33:59] Tor Karlsvalt: Let us observe a moment of silence for Molly.
[17:34:45] Baron Klaus Wulfenbach (KlausWulfenbach Outlander) bows his head
[17:35:15] Zantabraxus (Zantabraxus Aristocarnas) entered chat range (13.92 m).
[17:35:25] Tor Karlsvalt: Thank you for your observance.
[17:35:31] Rosie Gray: well said, Tor
[17:35:36] Delia Lake: thank you Tor
[17:35:42] Widget Whiteberry puts a few cushions down front
[17:35:43] Tor Karlsvalt: ok
[17:35:45] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Thank you..
[17:35:54] Tor Karlsvalt: The agenda is in the box.
[17:36:17] Tor Karlsvalt: The URL is http://forums.slcds.info/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=5961
[17:36:35] Leslie Allandale: oh well
[17:36:46] Widget Whiteberry: there you go
[17:36:56] Leslie Allandale: ty Widget
[17:37:33] Tor Karlsvalt: The agenda is mostly an attempt to catch up with our business and address issues relsated to the resignation of our chancellor.
[17:37:42] Tor Karlsvalt: Is there a motion to approve the agenda?
[17:37:58] Rosie Gray: I would motion to accept the agenda with a revision
[17:38:13] Gwyneth Llewelyn: .... hehe I was going to type that. Go ahead, Rosie :)
[17:38:22] Tor Karlsvalt: What is the revision?
[17:38:24] Rosie Gray: that we address the subject of CLEOPATRA Xigalia as an RA member
[17:38:43] Gwyneth Llewelyn: I second Rosie's motion to amend the agenda.
[17:38:49] Rosie Gray: I think it should be put near the top
[17:38:52] Rosie Gray: thank you Gwyn
[17:38:54] Gwyneth Llewelyn agrees
[17:38:58] Gaius Tiberius Curio (Guillaume Mistwalker) left chat range.
[17:39:14] Tor Karlsvalt: ok, we can put that next.
[17:39:18] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Good.
[17:39:27] Rosie Gray: thank you
[17:39:51] Gaius Tiberius Curio (Guillaume Mistwalker) entered chat range (10.17 m).
[17:39:54] Rosie Gray notes that we cannot use the speaking stick since Tor cannot control it
[17:40:04] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ah.
[17:40:04] IrahGrimObscurity Resident: brb loo
[17:40:13] Catz Jewell Lane (Catz Jewell): lol
[17:40:27] Tor Karlsvalt: So can we vote on the amended agenda to include the issue of Cleopatra's resignation as item 1.3
[17:40:37] Rosie Gray: aye
[17:40:37] Gwyneth Llewelyn: aye
[17:40:43] Tor Karlsvalt: aye
[17:40:46] Tor Karlsvalt: Motion carries.
[17:41:07] Rosie Gray raises a hand
[17:41:10] Tor Karlsvalt: Alas, I am caught off guard so I do not have the minutes for last meeting completed.
[17:41:12] Tor Karlsvalt: Rosie
[17:41:14] Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods*
[17:41:35] Rosie Gray: ah, I thought we were going to move on to 1.3
[17:41:41] Tor Karlsvalt: we will
[17:41:46] Tor Karlsvalt: I was just stating that
[17:41:52] Rosie Gray: okay
[17:42:09] Tor Karlsvalt: Rosie do you have a statement?
[17:42:12] IrahGrimObscurity Resident: kb
[17:42:17] IrahGrimObscurity Resident: bk*
[17:42:17] Rosie Gray: yes
[17:42:40] Rosie Gray: I would like to raise the point that an RA member is required to be a citizen in order to remain in office
[17:43:09] Rosie Gray: and that an RA member that loses citizenship is automatically removed from the RA
[17:43:37] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Clarification: is that the proposal of a new bill?
[17:43:54] Tor Karlsvalt: ok, do you need a motion to expel Cleo or is it a new bill?
[17:44:01] Rosie Gray: since that isn't in the laws, yes, I would propose that as a new bill
[17:44:04] Lilith Ivory raises her hand
[17:44:06] Rosie Gray: sorry, having a lot of chat lag
[17:44:15] IrahGrimObscurity Resident: no its a law ya?
[17:44:41] Rosie Gray: done
[17:44:44] Tor Karlsvalt: ok
[17:44:47] Gwyneth Llewelyn *raises hand*
[17:44:49] IrahGrimObscurity Resident: -thought outloud-
[17:44:56] Tor Karlsvalt: Gwyn?
[17:45:06] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok — shouldn't we add that as an amendment to the agenda? I'm fine with the general idea
[17:45:22] Rosie Gray: ah, okay probably
[17:45:26] TimLight Resident: raises hand
[17:45:26] Gwyneth Llewelyn: But I would like to clarify that we have this notion of 'temporary citizens' who have all rights
[17:45:31] Tor Karlsvalt: Can we merely expel Cleopatra?
[17:45:37] Gwyneth Llewelyn: and thus would like to discuss this properly :) Thanks done.
[17:45:48] Lilith Ivory raises her hand again with some important info
[17:45:57] Tor Karlsvalt: The floor is open for discussion
[17:46:04] TimLight Resident: Raises hand
[17:46:14] Tor Karlsvalt: Do the RA members have any point to make. Then Tim
[17:46:24] Lilith Ivory raises her hand higher
[17:46:26] Gaius Tiberius Curio (Guillaume Mistwalker): Lilith, Tor...
[17:46:33] Rosie Gray notes she hasn't made an actual motion yet
[17:46:41] Tor Karlsvalt: ok
[17:46:56] Gwyneth Llewelyn grins
[17:47:03] Tor Karlsvalt: My view is we don't need a law.
[17:47:03] IrahGrimObscurity Resident: >.>
[17:47:05] Tor Karlsvalt: We can merely expel her.
[17:47:17] Tor Karlsvalt: Lilith?
[17:47:17] TimLight Resident: Raises hand
[17:47:18] Delia Lake raises her hand
[17:47:22] Rosie Gray: may we hear what Lilith has to say?
[17:47:25] Rosie Gray: and other citizens
[17:47:38] Lilith Ivory: I just wanted to point out that Cleo has resigned as member of the RA
[17:47:43] Tor Karlsvalt: then Tim, then Delia
[17:47:50] Lilith Ivory: both to Calli and Cadence
[17:47:56] Lilith Ivory: it can be found here
[17:47:57] Lilith Ivory: http://forums.slcds.info/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=5919
[17:48:08] TimLight Resident: I am a witness that she has uttered that she has left her citizenship for good.
[17:48:17] TimLight Resident: I can testify that she swore this
[17:48:31] TimLight Resident: i think she has expelled herself.
[17:48:31] Tor Karlsvalt: ok Delia?
[17:48:37] TimLight Resident: No need to expel her.
[17:48:37] Gaius Tiberius Curio (Guillaume Mistwalker): Few of us believe her word, Tim...
[17:48:53] TimLight Resident: i think we are safe to say she is a non-person her by her own hand
[17:49:19] Delia Lake: there is a law that says a person has to be a citizen to run for office
[17:49:36] Delia Lake: and a law that says that a person has to be a citizen to vote
[17:49:36] TimLight Resident: i can testify she said this and I think we can act accordingly.
[17:49:36] Gwyneth Llewelyn: yes
[17:49:56] TimLight Resident: It is not a kind thing to kick someone when they have already left
[17:49:58] Delia Lake: we have no law that states a person has to remain a citizen in order to remain in office

[17:50:33] Delia Lake: this is a hole that really needs to be filled imo and right now. hopefully this situation will never happen again but without such a law it could
[17:50:46] Soro (Soro Dagostino) entered chat range (18.52 m).
[17:50:55] Delia Lake: it is simple, reasonable, logical and follows our other cds policies
[17:51:04] Delia Lake: done for now
[17:51:11] Tor Karlsvalt: ok
[17:51:14] Tor Karlsvalt: thank you
[17:51:27] TimLight Resident: done for now
[17:51:28] Tor Karlsvalt: It would seem tho we don't have to expel Cleo.
[17:51:47] Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods* — but I'm still fine to address Rosie's proposed bill later
[17:52:00] Tor Karlsvalt: I motion we accept the resignation of Cleopatra Xigalia.
[17:52:07] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Seconds the motion.
[17:52:13] TimLight Resident: Seconds
[17:52:23] Tor Karlsvalt: I think we should have a simple vote
[17:52:25] Gwyneth Llewelyn grins @ Tim
[17:52:29] Tor Karlsvalt: vote
[17:52:29] Rosie Gray: (Tim, only RA members can do that)
[17:52:30] Gwyneth Llewelyn: aye on the motion
[17:52:32] Rosie Gray: aye
[17:52:33] Tor Karlsvalt: aye
[17:52:46] TimLight Resident: Ok, I stand corrected
[17:52:50] Gwyneth Llewelyn: :-D
[17:52:50] Tor Karlsvalt: The RA accepts Cleopatra's resignation.
[17:52:51] Gaius Tiberius Curio (Guillaume Mistwalker): clap clap clap
[17:52:51] IrahGrimObscurity Resident: -throughs ole confetti up in the air and silently starts dancing-
[17:52:52] Pip Torok: atm we do not have a law that legitimises expulsion / banishment
[17:52:54] Gaius Tiberius Curio (Guillaume Mistwalker): clap clap clap
[17:53:00] Gaius Tiberius Curio (Guillaume Mistwalker): clap clap clap
[17:53:11] Pip Torok: APPLAUSE
[17:53:18] Tor Karlsvalt: Do we need to continue to address this Rosie?
[17:53:23] Rosie Gray: yes
[17:53:47] Rosie Gray: I move that it is a requirement of office that an RA member be a citizen in good standing.
[17:53:58] Tor Karlsvalt: second?
[17:54:01] StarLight (Jasmine Lordenwych): define good standing
[17:54:23] Rosie Gray: good standing is owning a parcel within the CDS, and paid up tier on that same property
[17:54:42] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Indeed. We can add that as clarification (although it's mentioned elsewhere)
[17:54:44] StarLight (Jasmine Lordenwych): what about attending meetings for the RA
[17:54:46] Gaius Tiberius Curio (Guillaume Mistwalker): Can we all follow the established rules for speaking?
[17:55:24] Gwyneth Llewelyn: I second Rosie's motion with the added line as clarification (and yes G, we already have a black cylinder for adding people to the list of speakers)
[17:55:52] Tor Karlsvalt: For clarification, speakers should touch the column on the table in order to be placed on the list.
[17:56:12] Tor Karlsvalt: ok we have discussion.
[17:56:17] Tor Karlsvalt: Gaius.
[17:56:54] Lilith Ivory left chat range.
[17:57:01] Gaius Tiberius Curio (Guillaume Mistwalker): I believe it is only proper that an RA member or any member of government should be in good standing as a citizen by having no parcels in arrears and owning both the parcel and paying tier into the Hippo system.
[17:57:11] Gwyneth Llewelyn: hear, hear
[17:57:18] Widget Whiteberry: well said
[17:57:18] Rosie Gray: clap clap clap
[17:57:47] Gaius Tiberius Curio (Guillaume Mistwalker): The SC has decided in the past that citizens whose citizenship lapses during the election period are no longer able to vote or stand for office.
[17:58:20] Gaius Tiberius Curio (Guillaume Mistwalker): One CLEOPATRA Xigalia argued this at the SC and it was accepted by the members there. The same principle should apply to the RA and the entire government.
[17:58:23] Gaius Tiberius Curio (Guillaume Mistwalker): Done.
[17:58:32] Tor Karlsvalt: thank you G
[17:58:34] Tor Karlsvalt: Soro?
[17:58:58] Lilith Ivory entered chat range (9.66 m).
[17:59:12] Soro (Soro Dagostino): A point. In the ancient past, in the age of factions, the RA member could be replaced by the faction.
[17:59:15] Gwyneth Llewelyn: G: CDSL 16-04 Citizenship membership publication for election purposes, preamble: "It is the law of the CDS that citizens must hold the title to their land for more than 28 days, and have tier payed in full to qualify to vote or to run for office."
[17:59:17] Gwyneth Llewelyn: (sorry)
[17:59:51] Soro (Soro Dagostino): No Gwyn, its relevant.
[18:00:01] Tor Karlsvalt: ok
[18:00:07] Gwyneth Llewelyn: (sorry for interrupting; it was meant as a clarification to G's comment)
[18:00:21] Tor Karlsvalt: Soro do you have more/
[18:00:32] Soro (Soro Dagostino): Mayhap, that replacement power should be with the RA.
[18:01:01] Tor Karlsvalt: Done Soro?
[18:01:07] Josie Cooperstone (Josephine Fotherington) entered chat range (9.22 m).
[18:01:09] Soro (Soro Dagostino): No 7 day votes.
[18:01:35] Soro (Soro Dagostino): Just a suggestion. A matrix.
[18:01:43] Soro (Soro Dagostino): done
[18:01:49] Tor Karlsvalt: ok, thanks
[18:01:59] Tor Karlsvalt: Gaius again.
[18:02:04] Gaius Tiberius Curio (Guillaume Mistwalker): Sorry!
[18:02:18] Tor Karlsvalt: Gwyn?
[18:02:31] Gwyneth Llewelyn: ok
[18:02:38] Gaius Tiberius Curio (Guillaume Mistwalker): Gwyn was right to point out that law, but the SC decision I referenced meant that citizens must keep up their citizenship during those 28 days.
[18:02:49] Gwyneth Llewelyn: yes, exactly
[18:03:01] Gwyneth Llewelyn: I wanted only to say 2 things...
[18:03:04] Gaius Tiberius Curio (Guillaume Mistwalker): The same principle should apply to RA members whose citizenship lapses.
[18:03:12] Gaius Tiberius Curio (Guillaume Mistwalker): Done
[18:03:21] Gwyneth Llewelyn: 1) The law has a loophole, it determines the qualification requirements for getting elected.
[18:03:29] Tor Karlsvalt: Gwyn has the floor
[18:03:38] Gwyneth Llewelyn: But it doesn't say anything on what happens if the RA member, after having been elected,
[18:03:41] Gwyneth Llewelyn: has payments in arrears
[18:03:57] Gwyneth Llewelyn: So I like Rosie's proposal, and encourage the RA to approve it :)
[18:04:01] Gwyneth Llewelyn: 2)
[18:04:08] Gwyneth Llewelyn: While I recognize the importance of replacing RA members easily (or, for
that purpose, having the ability to appoint an 'interim Chancellor'), I
would really prefer that we don't discuss this in such a short time. This is
a complex thing. RA members are elected.
[18:04:33] Gwyneth Llewelyn: That means that there is an expectation from citizens,
[18:04:38] Gwyneth Llewelyn: who elected a specific RA member,
[18:04:50] Gwyneth Llewelyn: that this RA member — and not a different one — represents them.
[18:04:51] Widget Whiteberry nods
[18:05:01] Gwyneth Llewelyn: So I would suggest that we discuss the best way to do this on the forums first, and not today
[18:05:05] Widget Whiteberry blinks
[18:05:05] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Or even on a commission.
[18:05:07] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Done, thanks
[18:05:11] Tor Karlsvalt: thanks
[18:05:16] Tor Karlsvalt: Rosie?
[18:05:18] Ariel Lancaster left chat range.
[18:05:33] Rosie Gray: I believe we have by-election laws to cover this scenario
[18:05:37] Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods*
[18:05:47] Rosie Gray: although I can't put my finger on the number at the moment
[18:06:12] Rosie Gray: so I don't think we need to concern ourselves with this aspect at the moment
[18:06:13] Rosie Gray: done
[18:06:22] Tor Karlsvalt: ok
[18:06:51] IrahGrimObscurity Resident: ?
[18:06:56] Tor Karlsvalt: So do I hear a motion then to refer this question to the forum for public discussion?
[18:07:07] Rosie Gray: ahem
[18:07:12] Rosie Gray: there is already a motion on the floor
[18:07:16] Rosie Gray: and seconded
[18:07:21] Gwyneth Llewelyn: yes, that one first!
[18:07:29] Tor Karlsvalt: yes, do we want to refer that motion to the forum?
[18:07:30] IrahGrimObscurity Resident: :)
[18:07:41] Gwyneth Llewelyn: No... wait... lol
[18:08:04] Rosie Gray: no
[18:08:07] Gwyneth Llewelyn: [17:53] Rosie Gray: I move that it is a requirement of office that an RA member be a citizen in good standing.
[18:08:23] Gwyneth Llewelyn: That's the motion. I suggested adding the clarification on 'good standing'.
[18:08:36] Gwyneth Llewelyn: (and seconded it)
[18:08:38] Rosie Gray: [17:54:24] Rosie Gray: good standing is owning a parcel within the CDS, and paid up tier on that same property
[18:08:43] Gwyneth Llewelyn: thanks Rosie!
[18:08:46] Rosie Gray: ㋡
[18:08:55] Tor Karlsvalt: I have this as the total motion:
I move that it is a requirement of office that an RA member be a citizen in good standing. good standing is owning a parcel within the CDS, and paid up tier on that same property.
[18:09:02] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Aye, seconded
[18:09:08] Rosie Gray nods
[18:09:39] IrahGrimObscurity Resident: :)
[18:10:04] Tor Karlsvalt: Do we want to vote, or put it on the forum for discussion/
[18:10:10] Rosie Gray: vote
[18:10:17] Gwyneth Llewelyn: I think we already had enough discussion. Vote, please!
[18:10:21] Tor Karlsvalt: ok Vote
[18:10:21] Soro (Soro Dagostino): Point of order
[18:10:24] Rosie Gray: aye
[18:10:31] Gwyneth Llewelyn: aye.... oops. Soro first? :D
[18:10:32] Soro (Soro Dagostino): Calli is the next speaker.
[18:10:44] Tor Karlsvalt: sorry
[18:10:55] Gwyneth Llewelyn left chat range.
[18:11:00] Rosie Gray: eh?
[18:11:04] Rosie Gray: Calli isn't here
[18:11:07] Gwyneth Llewelyn entered chat range (4.27 m).
[18:11:17] Tor Karlsvalt: Yeah I don't see Calli.
[18:11:24] Widget Whiteberry: the speaker object is confusing
[18:11:26] Rosie Gray: Calli is on holiday somewhere
[18:11:27] Delia Lake: Calli is not in sl this week
[18:11:30] Bells Semyorka: i think she is away this week
[18:11:31] Soro (Soro Dagostino): then the machine calling speakers is out of order!
[18:11:33] Soro (Soro Dagostino): :D
[18:11:39] Widget Whiteberry: we should not be using itt
[18:11:42] Widget Whiteberry: today
[18:11:47] Gaius Tiberius Curio (Guillaume Mistwalker): We are using the black column, not the white (which is in the floor)
[18:12:04] Gwyneth Llewelyn: hehe move it outside the room, Tor....
[18:12:08] Gwyneth Llewelyn: I don't have permissions....
[18:12:14] Rosie Gray moves it down further
[18:12:16] Soro (Soro Dagostino): LOL
[18:12:18] Gwyneth Llewelyn: There! Thanks
[18:12:34] Baron Klaus Wulfenbach (KlausWulfenbach Outlander) chuckles
[18:12:35] Soro (Soro Dagostino): Call the Question.
[18:12:36] Tor Karlsvalt: ok
[18:12:42] Tor Karlsvalt: Technical problem
[18:12:49] Tor Karlsvalt: I vote aye
[18:12:49] Gwyneth Llewelyn *chuckles*
[18:12:51] Gwyneth Llewelyn: aye
[18:12:54] Rosie Gray: we've already voted!
[18:12:57] Gwyneth Llewelyn: LOL
[18:12:58] Tor Karlsvalt: motion carries.
[18:12:59] IrahGrimObscurity Resident: ty for the laugh
[18:13:00] Rosie Gray: but aye, again
[18:13:01] Gwyneth Llewelyn: hahahaha
[18:13:23] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok, next :D
[18:13:32] Rosie Gray: did you vote, Tor?
[18:13:40] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Yes... he did
[18:13:40] Tor Karlsvalt: I did
[18:13:46] Rosie Gray: sorry, didn't see that
[18:13:46] Gwyneth Llewelyn: [18:12] Tor Karlsvalt: I vote aye
[18:13:47] Rosie Gray: ㋡
[18:13:50] Tor Karlsvalt: ok Citizens Concerns
[18:13:54] IrahGrimObscurity Resident: i cant yet :3
[18:14:25] Tor Karlsvalt: Does anyone have any concerns or statements?
[18:14:39] IrahGrimObscurity Resident: :)
[18:14:42] Tor Karlsvalt: Please touch the column if you want to speak.
[18:14:46] Tor Karlsvalt: Gwyn.
[18:14:53] Tor Karlsvalt: oh sorry
[18:14:57] Gwyneth Llewelyn: :-D
[18:15:09] Tor Karlsvalt: I see your crosshairs on the column.
[18:15:14] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Oh!
[18:15:21] Gwyneth Llewelyn: wow. You have X-Ray vision!
[18:15:32] Tor Karlsvalt: Ok if not citizen concerns, then we move to RA concerns.
[18:15:36] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok
[18:16:07] Tor Karlsvalt: Any RA concerns?
[18:16:33] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Do we need to formally acknowledge the Chancellor's resignation? I think not, it's a SC thingy, right?
[18:16:45] Tor Karlsvalt: I think not.
[18:17:00] Tor Karlsvalt: I suppose my opening comment might be enough.
[18:17:08] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Good, then i don't think I have any concerns.... well... a few philosophical ones, but I'll remain silent.
[18:17:12] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok, thanks.
[18:17:19] Rosie Gray grins at Gwyn
[18:17:20] Tor Karlsvalt: :)
[18:17:24] Tor Karlsvalt: ok
[18:17:24] Gwyneth Llewelyn: ;-)
[18:17:34] Tor Karlsvalt: Item 4.1
[18:17:35] Rosie Gray raises a hand
[18:17:40] Rosie Gray: sorry
[18:17:44] Gwyneth Llewelyn: :D
[18:17:48] Tor Karlsvalt: Rosie?
[18:17:52] Rosie Gray: thank you
[18:18:38] Rosie Gray: since we were left in a bit of a vulnerable position, the EO has given permissions to some previous EM's to be temporary EM's now
[18:19:08] Rosie Gray: I would like to move that we endorse the temporary EM's for now, until the next Chancellor is in place
[18:19:16] Tor Karlsvalt: ok
[18:19:25] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Hm.
[18:19:25] Tor Karlsvalt: Second?
[18:19:27] Rosie Gray: I guess I should say who they are... one moment please
[18:20:10] Rosie Gray: Rudeen, in her role as Estate Manager
[18:20:12] Rosie Gray: Manager*
[18:20:56] Rosie Gray: has added Delia Lake, Lilith Ivory, Widget Whiteberry, Tor Karlsvalt and Rosie Gray as temporary estate managers
[18:21:17] Rosie Gray: all are experienced.
[18:21:18] Rosie Gray: done
[18:21:33] Tor Karlsvalt: thank you
[18:21:37] IrahGrimObscurity Resident: :)
[18:21:52] Tor Karlsvalt: Did we have a second for this motion.
[18:22:15] Gwyneth Llewelyn points at the column
[18:22:24] Tor Karlsvalt: gwyn?
[18:22:27] Gwyneth Llewelyn: thank you hehe
[18:22:37] Gwyneth Llewelyn: This is one of those clear cases where technically the RA has nothing to say
on this subject. Estate Managers do administrative and executive duties. The
RA has nothing to say on that subject — technically. We can approve a motion
that we agree with Rudeen's choices. But AFAIK there is no way for the RA to
interfere in Executive duties — even without a Chancellor.

So I'd be fine in approving a motion saying that the RA recognizes the new
EMs etc. but we technically cannot 'endorse' or 'appoint' them.
[18:23:05] Gwyneth Llewelyn: But i cannot in good faith second a motion that pulls some executive powers out of the Executive. Thanks. done.
[18:23:16] Tor Karlsvalt: ok
[18:23:48] Gwyneth Llewelyn: So would you like to rephrase that motion, Rosie?
[18:23:57] Tor Karlsvalt: Rosie why do we want to endorse them?
[18:24:08] Rosie Gray shrugs
[18:24:11] Gaius Tiberius Curio (Guillaume Mistwalker) coughs.
[18:24:12] Soro (Soro Dagostino): Grumble.
[18:24:20] Rosie Gray: okay we can say 'agrees' if that makes you happier
[18:24:37] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Well,we aren't even supposed to agree :)
[18:24:53] Rosie Gray: that's rather silly, don't you think?
[18:25:01] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Nope! Separation of powers!
[18:25:07] Rosie Gray: but let's hear citizen comments
[18:25:10] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Sure :D
[18:25:13] Gaius Tiberius Curio (Guillaume Mistwalker): Aye.... Let's....
[18:25:14] Tor Karlsvalt: Can I suggest perhaps we commend Rudeen for appointing temporary EMs?
[18:25:20] Gwyneth Llewelyn: That works, Tor!
[18:25:22] Leslie Allandale: Yes applaud
[18:25:36] Gwyneth Llewelyn: I'd second that motion, Tor.
[18:25:40] Rosie Gray: lol, okay
[18:25:49] Rosie Gray: I accept that as a friendly amendment
[18:25:49] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Commend.... thank.... acknowledge.... taht's all fine
[18:25:55] Tor Karlsvalt: ok vote?
[18:25:57] Gaius Tiberius Curio (Guillaume Mistwalker) coughs VERY loudly.
[18:25:59] Gwyneth Llewelyn: aye :)
[18:26:05] Gwyneth Llewelyn: haha sorry G
[18:26:08] Soro (Soro Dagostino): Dammit Tor.
[18:26:09] Rosie Gray: wait... comments from the floor
[18:26:16] Tor Karlsvalt: ooo
[18:26:16] Tor Karlsvalt: aye
[18:26:18] Tor Karlsvalt: sorry
[18:26:20] Tor Karlsvalt: Soro?
[18:26:21] Gwyneth Llewelyn: ㋡
[18:26:29] Gaius Tiberius Curio (Guillaume Mistwalker): If you have a speaking column, why not use it?
[18:26:33] IrahGrimObscurity Resident: -facepalms-
[18:27:00] Soro (Soro Dagostino): The commendation ought to recognize that the EO Sudane, has authority to appoint LM's.
[18:27:24] Soro (Soro Dagostino): And commend that act.
[18:27:26] Soro (Soro Dagostino): done.
[18:27:51] Tor Karlsvalt: ok, do we accept that amendment to the motion?
[18:27:56] Gwyneth Llewelyn: No!
[18:28:04] Rosie Gray: more speakers Tor
[18:28:09] Tor Karlsvalt: Gaius
[18:28:12] Gaius Tiberius Curio (Guillaume Mistwalker): Thank you.
[18:28:24] Garnet Psaltery left chat range.
[18:28:51] Gaius Tiberius Curio (Guillaume Mistwalker): Gwyneth can disagree as she pleases with the virtues of the Constitution, but the Constitution also hardly accepts the possibility of the estate being without a Chancellor.
[18:29:07] Gaius Tiberius Curio (Guillaume Mistwalker): I think that Soro's recommendation is apt.
[18:29:42] Gaius Tiberius Curio (Guillaume Mistwalker): The CDS is meant to be a democracy! How can it be a democracy if the people's representatives can not accept and approve of the Executive's decisions?
[18:29:44] Tor Karlsvalt: Soro?
[18:30:17] Gaius Tiberius Curio (Guillaume Mistwalker): Gwyn can disagree, but likewise she can not veto... The rest of the RA should approve of Sudane's decisions.
[18:30:19] Gaius Tiberius Curio (Guillaume Mistwalker): Done.
[18:30:37] Soro (Soro Dagostino): I ask madame Gwyn to cite her authority that the EO does not have authority to appoint EM.
[18:31:14] Soro (Soro Dagostino): Em's*
[18:31:50] Tor Karlsvalt: Gwyn can you answer?
[18:32:04] Tor Karlsvalt: Soro asked a question.
[18:32:12] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Sure, I'm on the list to answer
[18:32:32] Gwyneth Llewelyn: ) Resignation is followed by by-elections. I'm sorry, but that's how it works.
We have no other mechanism. It's tough, but that's what it is.

2) Separation of powers is something that I personally take VERY seriously,
and I'm sure that the SC will, too. The temptation to allow the RA, just
because it was democratically elected, to subtract powers from the other
branches without checks, is too great — that way lies disaster.

3) There is no law that forbids or allows the EO to appoint EMs. What there
is a provision in the constitution where the RA does not interfere in the
Exec's powers, and the Exec doesn't legislate.
[18:32:37] Soro (Soro Dagostino): Done
[18:33:06] Gwyneth Llewelyn: In fact, one of the things that the LV/CDS Group Commission figured out is that we need to appoint a new commission to decide over EMs.
[18:33:12] Gwyneth Llewelyn: That's it, thanks. DOne.
[18:33:27] Tor Karlsvalt: Irah?
[18:34:51] IrahGrimObscurity Resident: can we make it an amendment to say stop being a Cleo when is necessary? clarification when some one is being a cleo.
[18:35:08] Josie Cooperstone (Josephine Fotherington) bursts out laughing
[18:35:16] Gwyneth Llewelyn *scratches head*
[18:35:16] Spider22997 Upshaw: lol
[18:35:25] Catz Jewell Lane (Catz Jewell): omg,lol
[18:35:27] IrahGrimObscurity Resident: just thought to lighten the mode a bit
[18:35:30] Gwyneth Llewelyn: ㋡
[18:35:36] Tor Karlsvalt: G
[18:35:37] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Mission accomplished :-)
[18:36:10] Pip Torok: a new verb! "to be a CLEO" ... hmmm!
[18:36:20] Tor Karlsvalt: Gaius?
[18:36:48] Gaius Tiberius Curio (Guillaume Mistwalker): I do not believe that it would an overreach of the RA's consitutional powers to approve of EMs in this case.
[18:37:15] Gaius Tiberius Curio (Guillaume Mistwalker): The constitution already does not apply, and it IS a power of the RA to provide oversight over the work of the Chancellor.
[18:37:34] Tor Karlsvalt notes these are strange times.
[18:37:56] Soro (Soro Dagostino) raises hand..
[18:38:16] Tor Karlsvalt: Gaius then Soro.
[18:38:31] Tor Karlsvalt: Then Gwyn.
[18:38:31] Gaius Tiberius Curio (Guillaume Mistwalker): That is a part of the separation of powers, Gwyn, and I must categorically reject the argument that the RA would overstep its boundaries when its capacity as a legislature, by nature, makes it slower to govern than an Executive. In this case, the RA must provide a check on executive power.
[18:38:32] Gaius Tiberius Curio (Guillaume Mistwalker): Done.
[18:39:28] Soro (Soro Dagostino): I think G's pronouncement should change to substitute Approve to "Commend the EO's appointment"
[18:39:36] Gaius Tiberius Curio (Guillaume Mistwalker): ㋡
[18:39:48] Soro (Soro Dagostino): Something in accordance with the SL TOS's
[18:40:07] Pip Torok left chat range.
[18:40:26] Soro (Soro Dagostino): And renders it in compliance with the CDS Constitution.
[18:40:31] Soro (Soro Dagostino): done/
[18:40:35] Tor Karlsvalt: thanks
[18:40:37] Tor Karlsvalt: Gwyn?
[18:40:43] Soro (Soro Dagostino): Enough said.
[18:40:44] Gwyneth Llewelyn grins. Gaius, you might not believe it, but I do :) And there is a method in the Constitution to provide such oversight: the Chancellor has to come before the RA every month; and the RA approves the Exec's budget. The good news, gaius, is that this is just my opinion, and next term some other RA member might have a different opinion :) Anyway, I'm fine with Soro's amendment as well, and I think I've made my point; I'm fine with 'commend', 'thank Sudane', 'acknowledge' etc. so long that it doesn't imply that the RA has to be asked for permission or something like that
[18:40:48] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Thanks, done.
[18:41:17] Soro (Soro Dagostino): Clap, clap, clap!!
[18:41:36] Soro (Soro Dagostino): Jeeze, I approved of a statement by Gwyn!!
[18:41:43] Rosie Gray: hahahha
[18:41:50] Gwyneth Llewelyn: I'm utterly shocked, Soro!
[18:41:53] Soro (Soro Dagostino): Done
[18:42:00] Gwyneth Llewelyn ducks before the ceiling starts to cave in
[18:42:24] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Sorry, I was out of order :)
[18:42:25] Soro (Soro Dagostino): But keep it to two sentences?
[18:42:27] Soro (Soro Dagostino): LOL
[18:42:33] Gwyneth Llewelyn: But I agree with Irah, I like to lighten the mood. hehehehe
[18:42:37] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Anyway, I'm done
[18:42:37] Soro (Soro Dagostino): Sorry, could not resist!
[18:42:49] Gwyneth Llewelyn: ㋡
[18:42:54] Rosie Gray: ㋡
[18:43:01] Tor Karlsvalt: okk
[18:43:10] Tor Karlsvalt: ok do we have to restate this motion?
[18:43:19] Gwyneth Llewelyn notes that Rosie is still on the list to speak
[18:43:55] Tor Karlsvalt: Rosie
[18:44:00] Rosie Gray: thanks
[18:44:49] Rosie Gray: I would like it noted in the Minutes, that I appreciate that the Estate Owner has stepped in during this critical time to ensure the safety of our estate, by appointing some trustworthy estate managers.
[18:45:08] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok, I'm fine in seconding that request.
[18:45:27] Rosie Gray: and I'm fine with amending the motion to say thank you, instead of whatever it was I said in the first place
[18:45:29] Rosie Gray grins
[18:45:34] Tor Karlsvalt: I don't think that needs discussion.
[18:46:14] Tor Karlsvalt: vote on Rosie's motion regarding the minutes
[18:46:18] Widget Whiteberry hopes any act will be stated clearly in the minutes in the language the RA approves
[18:46:21] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Aye on that
[18:46:25] Tor Karlsvalt: aye
[18:46:28] Widget Whiteberry: for the sake of future readers
[18:46:46] Tor Karlsvalt: Ok I don't think the first motion was settled.
[18:47:01] Rosie Gray: I was just going to say!
[18:47:16] Tor Karlsvalt: ok let me see if I have it correctly
[18:47:20] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Maybe: 'The RA commends the EO for i's appointment of the following EM members.... [insert names here]'?
[18:47:26] Tor Karlsvalt: We commend Rudeen, with the authority of the EO of the CDS for the appointment of temporary EMs.
[18:47:42] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok, and list them. I'm fine in second that motion.
[18:47:50] Tor Karlsvalt: ok
[18:47:59] Rosie Gray: I would like to move that we commend Rudeen for appointing the temporary EM's for now, until the next Chancellor is in place.
[18:48:18] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok.... sorry.... I'll second Rosie's motion instead.
[18:48:25] Gwyneth Llewelyn: I have a reason for that :D
[18:48:37] Rosie Gray: what's your reason???
[18:48:58] Gwyneth Llewelyn: It's the wording. Tor's wording implies that the EO has teh authority of appointing EMs.
[18:49:03] Gwyneth Llewelyn: We have no such law :)
[18:49:09] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Your own motion is neutral.
[18:49:25] IrahGrimObscurity Resident: beautiful!
[18:49:45] Tor Karlsvalt: ok
[18:49:46] Rosie Gray: okay! ㋡
[18:49:56] Tor Karlsvalt: so we have two motions
[18:50:12] Gwyneth Llewelyn: I have seconded Rosie's, and withdrawn my seconding of Tor's.
[18:50:17] Rosie Gray: do we? what is the second?
[18:50:30] Tor Karlsvalt: Rosie can you state your motion?
[18:50:40] Gwyneth Llewelyn: [18:47] Rosie Gray: I would like to move that we commend Rudeen for appointing the temporary EM's for now, until the next Chancellor is in place.
[18:50:44] Rosie Gray: : I would like to move that we commend Rudeen for appointing the temporary EM's for now, until the next Chancellor is in place.
[18:51:01] Rosie Gray: make that "I move...."
[18:51:05] Tor Karlsvalt: ok
[18:51:09] Tor Karlsvalt: Vote
[18:51:09] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Right, Rosie :) hehe
[18:51:11] Gwyneth Llewelyn: aye
[18:51:14] Rosie Gray: aye
[18:51:21] Tor Karlsvalt: aye
[18:51:25] Gwyneth Llewelyn: whew
[18:51:28] Tor Karlsvalt: ok
[18:51:36] Rosie Gray: :D
[18:51:42] Soro (Soro Dagostino): Congratulations a Cleo Moment.
[18:51:48] IrahGrimObscurity Resident: -looks at sun dial-
[18:51:51] Tor Karlsvalt: Now to an important matter.
[18:51:58] Tor Karlsvalt: 4.1
[18:52:12] Tor Karlsvalt: *4.1) Motion: That the Constitution, Article II, Section 5.2 be amended to read:

“Chancellor terms begin on June 1 and December 1, concurrent with the term of the RA. In the event of a bi-election, the Chancellor takes office immediately upon election. If the Chancellor resigns later than the beginning of the Period of Declaration for Chancellor for the upcoming Term and there is no by-election, the next Chancellor shall take office immediately upon election.” http://forums.slcds.info/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=5887
[18:52:20] Widget Whiteberry: yay!
[18:52:42] Gwyneth Llewelyn seconds the motion provided that 'bi-election' is spelt 'by-election'
[18:52:55] Rosie Gray: hehehe
[18:52:59] Gwyneth Llewelyn: *spelled
[18:53:01] Tor Karlsvalt: Note that this was amended since the last meeting to account for the situation we find ourselves in.
[18:53:04] Gwyneth Llewelyn whispers: grr I cn't spell either!
[18:53:40] Gaius Tiberius Curio (Guillaume Mistwalker) would personally prefer "bi-election" ...
[18:53:51] Gwyneth Llewelyn: 'get elected twice?' :-)
[18:54:06] Baron Klaus Wulfenbach (KlausWulfenbach Outlander) thought it might be 'bye-election'.
[18:54:08] Gaius Tiberius Curio (Guillaume Mistwalker): I was making a bisexual joke, Gwyn. ㋡
[18:54:21] Gwyneth Llewelyn: I thought as much, but I didn't want to be too obvious ;)
[18:54:24] Vic Mornington (Victor1st Mornington) left chat range.
[18:54:37] Tor Karlsvalt: ok is see it spelled by-election
[18:54:42] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Anyway — Mr Pro-Tem LRA, is there really any discussion on this?
[18:54:43] Vic Mornington (Victor1st Mornington) entered chat range (7.81 m).
[18:54:49] Tor Karlsvalt: no
[18:54:56] Gwyneth Llewelyn: As said, I'm more than happy to second it. And good. :)
[18:55:00] Tor Karlsvalt: vote
[18:55:03] Gwyneth Llewelyn: aye
[18:55:04] Rosie Gray: aye!
[18:55:05] Tor Karlsvalt: aye
[18:55:08] Tor Karlsvalt: good
[18:55:18] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Good, another flaw fixed forever. Whew.
[18:55:22] Tor Karlsvalt: next item
[18:55:30] Tor Karlsvalt: 4.2
[18:55:44] Tor Karlsvalt: 4.2) Motion: To adopt the Tier Collection and Land Reclamation Bill.
viewtopic.php?f=7&t=5735 .
[18:56:59] Tor Karlsvalt: one sec, that url didn't work
[18:57:08] Gwyneth Llewelyn: http://forums.slcds.info/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=5735
[18:57:24] Rosie Gray: thanks Gwyn
[18:57:29] Tor Karlsvalt: thank you Gwyn
[18:57:31] Rosie Gray was struggling with it
[18:58:15] Tor Karlsvalt: This bill had been seconded.
[18:58:27] IrahGrimObscurity Resident: noooo
[18:58:32] IrahGrimObscurity Resident: PIP BACK
[18:58:40] IrahGrimObscurity Resident: COME BACK
[18:58:41] Tor Karlsvalt: It was proposed at an earlier meeting.
[18:58:48] Rosie Gray: has this bill been made a motion?
[18:59:02] Gwyneth Llewelyn points: ' 4.2) Motion: To adopt the Tier Collection and Land Reclamation Bill.'
[18:59:05] Tor Karlsvalt: And amendments added to account for a compassionate allowance.
[18:59:08] Gwyneth Llewelyn: It says 'motion' :)
[18:59:16] Rosie Gray: okay, but whose motion?
[18:59:24] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Oh! Good point :D
[18:59:29] IrahGrimObscurity Resident: >:)
[18:59:49] Tor Karlsvalt: This was submitted by the Powers Commission at an earlier meeting
[18:59:56] dj Zemenis: Beethoven's last.....
[18:59:59] Rosie Gray thinks perhaps Tor could make this motion since he was on that commission
[19:00:01] Gwyneth Llewelyn: well, on 4.1 we also didn't have a 'person' proposing the motion, so I'm assuming it's the LRA proposing the motion
[19:00:07] Gwyneth Llewelyn: right, Rosie
[19:00:20] Tor Karlsvalt: and submitted to the the forum for comment and also for amendment to allow for a compassionate allowance.
[19:00:30] Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods*
[19:00:39] Tor Karlsvalt: Well wouldn't it still have been on the table?
[19:00:40] Rosie Gray: yes, just dotting the eyes and crossing the tees
[19:00:43] Tor Karlsvalt: ok
[19:00:48] Gwyneth Llewelyn beams at Rosie :)
[19:01:04] Tor Karlsvalt: I motion we adopt the Tier Collection and Land Reclamation Bill
[19:01:15] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Final text here: http://forums.slcds.info/viewtopic.php? ... 735#p35451
[19:01:20] Rosie Gray: second the motion
[19:01:26] Gwyneth Llewelyn thirds it.
[19:01:30] Gwyneth Llewelyn: :-)
[19:01:32] Tor Karlsvalt: ok
[19:01:33] Tor Karlsvalt: vote
[19:01:47] Gwyneth Llewelyn: ha :) No discussion! I like it! :-)
[19:01:50] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Aye :-)
[19:01:51] Rosie Gray: aye!
[19:01:56] Tor Karlsvalt: aye
[19:02:02] Gwyneth Llewelyn grins and claps
[19:02:11] Tor Karlsvalt notes this law has been discussed to near death.
[19:02:14] Gaius Tiberius Curio (Guillaume Mistwalker): clap clap clap
[19:02:14] Widget Whiteberry exhales
[19:02:19] Gaius Tiberius Curio (Guillaume Mistwalker): clap clap clap
[19:02:26] Tor Karlsvalt: ok
[19:02:27] Rosie Gray: lol
[19:02:35] Tor Karlsvalt: that brings us to 4.3
[19:02:37] IrahGrimObscurity Resident: aye don't know why i vote when it doesn't count but aye like it XD
[19:02:44] Gwyneth Llewelyn: I propose a motion to commend the Commission for its wonderful job. Well Done, guys!
[19:03:08] Rosie Gray: now Gwyn, are you sure it's allowed within our mandate!
[19:03:10] Rosie Gray: ;)
[19:03:20] Tor Karlsvalt: Thanks Gwyn, and commends the members of the commission, Delia, Widget, Covey and Mizou.
[19:03:24] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ha! Yes it is :) We can pat on our own shoulders for sure :)
[19:03:26] IrahGrimObscurity Resident: -facepamls-
[19:03:33] Tor Karlsvalt: ok
[19:03:44] Tor Karlsvalt: Item 4.3
[19:03:56] IrahGrimObscurity Resident: -facepalms harder-
[19:03:58] Tor Karlsvalt: Gwyn this is your issue.
[19:04:06] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Eeek. Lol
[19:04:17] Tor Karlsvalt: Do you want to discuss it now, or save it for next week?
[19:04:31] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Next week. I do apologize. I should have prepared that, and I didn't.
[19:04:44] Tor Karlsvalt: no problem
[19:05:01] Tor Karlsvalt: OK on to new business
[19:05:06] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Thanks :)
[19:05:34] Tor Karlsvalt: This is something we tossed around briefly.
[19:05:46] Tor Karlsvalt: 5.1) Motion to that the RA to elect a Caretaker Chancellor pending the election the election of a Chancellor during the upcoming election.
[19:06:04] Tor Karlsvalt: This is a but awkward
[19:06:16] Gwyneth Llewelyn: You don't say...
[19:06:25] Tor Karlsvalt: 5.1) Motion that the RA elect a Caretaker Chancellor pending the election the election of a Chancellor during the upcoming election.
[19:06:38] Catz Jewell Lane (Catz Jewell): raises hand
[19:06:48] Gwyneth Llewelyn: (Catz, click on the black cylinder)
[19:06:53] Catz Jewell Lane (Catz Jewell): k
[19:06:57] Gwyneth Llewelyn: (thanks!)
[19:07:05] IrahGrimObscurity Resident: -double face palms to the face, with a clean whip down the middle-
[19:07:11] Tor Karlsvalt: 5.1) Motion that the RA elect a Caretaker Chancellor pending the election of a Chancellor.
[19:07:14] Tor Karlsvalt: sorry
[19:07:18] Rosie Gray: is this your motion, Tor?
[19:07:28] Tor Karlsvalt: I was in a rush.
[19:07:36] IrahGrimObscurity Resident: me tooo's
[19:07:58] Tor Karlsvalt: yes
[19:08:49] Tor Karlsvalt: Is there a second?
[19:08:59] Rosie Gray: second the motion
[19:09:13] Tor Karlsvalt: Discussion
[19:09:42] Tor Karlsvalt: I am going to reset the column.
[19:09:47] Catz Jewell Lane (Catz Jewell): me
[19:09:50] Catz Jewell Lane (Catz Jewell): ok
[19:09:52] Gwyneth Llewelyn: ok
[19:10:12] Tor Karlsvalt: Catz
[19:11:03] Isa of Chaeronea (Isabelle Inkpen) entered chat range (19.54 m).
[19:11:03] Catz Jewell Lane (Catz Jewell): who is next in line after the chancellor? In the US and im not sure about other countries, but if the President and Vice president are out of office, The next choice is speaker of the house
[19:11:43] Catz Jewell Lane (Catz Jewell): could we make a law that gives the power to maybe LRA or someone?
[19:11:50] Tor Karlsvalt: We don't have an order of succession.
[19:12:34] Catz Jewell Lane (Catz Jewell): you understand what im talking about right? Might take care of future problems like we are in now
[19:12:47] Tor Karlsvalt nods
[19:12:57] Tor Karlsvalt: are you done Catz?
[19:13:08] Catz Jewell Lane (Catz Jewell): yes sorry
[19:13:14] Baron Klaus Wulfenbach (KlausWulfenbach Outlander) mutters, 'Newton forbid future problems like now.'
[19:13:34] Tor Karlsvalt: Gwyn?
[19:13:40] Gwyneth Llewelyn: thank you
[19:13:42] Gwyneth Llewelyn: While I acknowledge the *need* of a Caretaker Chancellor, this is a VERY
sensitive issue. It's been YEARS since we've abolished the RA's election of
a Chancellor. Chancellors are elected separately, possibly by completely
different votes than the votes which elected the RA. So the RA cannot really
override that.
[19:13:44] Zantabraxus (Zantabraxus Aristocarnas) smiles dryly
[19:13:59] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Then there is the issue of what powers such a 'Caretaker Chancellor' would
have. This gives the room for interpreting the possibility that future RA's
will use this bill, if approved, to get rid of Chancellors they dislike, by
pushing them out of the CDS, and just appoint someone they like.

But Catz is absolutely right: we could approve such a law. Currently we haven't
that.
[19:14:16] Gwyneth Llewelyn: On the other hand, the Chancellor can, in fact, delegate all its powers
to anyone they like. Theoretically they could empower a Vice-Chancellor to
work as 'acting Chancellor' while they resign. It's not the current
situation, but it would work.
[19:14:25] Gwyneth Llewelyn: What I suggest for now...
[19:14:35] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Is that we drop the designation 'Caretaker Chancellor'
[19:14:46] Gwyneth Llewelyn: but just name it 'Caretaker'
[19:14:53] Gwyneth Llewelyn: and delegate a limited amount of powers,
[19:15:00] Tor Karlsvalt nods.
[19:15:02] Gwyneth Llewelyn: namely, dealing with land sales/tier
[19:15:12] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Events, for instance, can be held by anyone, no need for a PIO etc
[19:15:25] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Sudane technically can act as Janitor
[19:15:27] IrahGrimObscurity Resident: -sneases-
[19:15:40] Gwyneth Llewelyn: she's Janitor-by-default :)
[19:15:49] Gwyneth Llewelyn: So maybe that is enough. Just a suggestion. Thanks. Done.
[19:15:53] Soro (Soro Dagostino): Admted!!ti
[19:16:03] Soro (Soro Dagostino): Admitted*
[19:16:09] Widget Whiteberry wonders where she stashed her janitor tee
[19:16:16] Tor Karlsvalt: soro
[19:16:41] Soro (Soro Dagostino): Yield to Delia -- the wisest one here.
[19:17:01] Delia Lake: pfft.
[19:17:10] Gaius Tiberius Curio (Guillaume Mistwalker): ㋡
[19:17:13] Gaius Tiberius Curio (Guillaume Mistwalker): Haha
[19:17:16] IrahGrimObscurity Resident: oh modest to i read
[19:17:19] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Flattery will get you a long way, Soro
[19:17:21] Gwyneth Llewelyn: :-)
[19:17:32] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Not that you're wrong, mind you.... hehe
[19:17:47] Tor Karlsvalt: Delia
[19:17:49] Delia Lake: Since we do not have any succession plan for Chancellor and have had 2 Chancellors resign within the past 6 mos
[19:18:07] IrahGrimObscurity Resident: X.X
[19:18:22] Delia Lake: we might want to consider and discuss in the near future making a position of Vice Chancellor an official one
[19:18:26] Delia Lake: that being said
[19:18:39] IrahGrimObscurity Resident: -brb shawer-
[19:18:54] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Hear, hear!
[19:19:24] Delia Lake: I don't really see the need nor the legal path for the RA appointing a Caretaker at this point
[19:19:37] Delia Lake: we already have people declaring to run for office
[19:19:43] Soro (Soro Dagostino): Agree
[19:19:44] Delia Lake: the polls open on 1 Nov
[19:20:05] Delia Lake: and the essentials can be done, are being done by Sudane with helpers
[19:20:32] Delia Lake: the only thing that might fall off is getting entertainment paid for
[19:20:47] Isa of Chaeronea (Isabelle Inkpen) left chat range.
[19:20:51] Tor Karlsvalt nods
[19:21:04] Delia Lake: other than that we can have the land set for sale like we used to do
[19:22:03] Delia Lake: and I agree with Gwyn tht it would be really touchy and perhaps an overstep for the RA to appoint Chancellor at this point what ever name its called
[19:22:06] Delia Lake: done
[19:22:12] Tor Karlsvalt: I just want to interject that Sudane suggested that the temporary EMs take a very limited role and only assist when needed to help with private sales and citizen issues with hippo.
[19:22:44] Widget Whiteberry: and stray prims and security
[19:22:49] Tor Karlsvalt: Also there is at present no exec that can spend money appropriated by the RA.
[19:23:02] Tor Karlsvalt: Tandra
[19:23:03] Gwyneth Llewelyn yields to Delia's wise words and withdraws her suggestions.
[19:23:06] Tandra Jupiter: Thank you
[19:23:25] Soro (Soro Dagostino): I agree with Delia, done.
[19:24:05] Tandra Jupiter: I was about to say something but Del hit the nail right on the head. We do need someone elceted to step up as chancellor at anytime to carry on the role when we are left without a chancellor. I hope how soon this all works out.
[19:24:22] Tandra Jupiter: done
[19:24:30] Tor Karlsvalt: ok
[19:25:13] Tor Karlsvalt: I am wondering how, without an exec we can spend money for events? We would have to rely on donations.
[19:25:20] Tor Karlsvalt: done
[19:25:44] Soro (Soro Dagostino): In this situation that's easy . . ask.
[19:25:46] Catz Jewell Lane (Catz Jewell): Im paying for Halloween
[19:25:52] Leslie Allandale: raises hand
[19:26:02] Tor Karlsvalt: G has the floor
[19:26:16] Gaius Tiberius Curio (Guillaume Mistwalker): Leslie, click the column
[19:26:16] Tor Karlsvalt: please use the column.
[19:27:21] Tor Karlsvalt notes we are coming up on two hours.
[19:27:31] Gaius Tiberius Curio (Guillaume Mistwalker): In these times of a constitutional crisis, where the constitution does not provide a legitimate procedure on what and how to do things and we NEED an executive, I believe it is democratic that the RA should step up and vote to act as executive until a time that a new chancellor has power. Done.
[19:28:09] Gwyneth Llewelyn notes that there is a budget and a Treasurer. There is oversight by the RA. There just isn't anyone to approve each individual payment. However, we might recommend that the next Chancellor reimburses expenses made by people today regarding events. It makes some sense: the Executive might be different, but it's the same Government, and technically people have an agreement with the Government, not a specific person or persons in the Government. Thank you, done.
[19:28:10] Leslie Allandale: I don't think the citizens need help having a good time. and everything else can wait.
[19:29:02] Catz Jewell Lane (Catz Jewell): as far as events go
[19:29:23] Catz Jewell Lane (Catz Jewell): Shep, and I planned Halloween before all this mess
[19:29:48] Widget Whiteberry: hear, hear, Les
[19:30:19] Rosie Gray agrees with Leslie
[19:30:37] Catz Jewell Lane (Catz Jewell): I hired A dj and we have Thunderstruck coming with Alice Cooper. Im paying for it all
[19:30:45] Leslie Allandale: yay
[19:30:55] Baron Klaus Wulfenbach (KlausWulfenbach Outlander) applauds
[19:31:03] Tor Karlsvalt eagerly awaits.
[19:31:06] Catz Jewell Lane (Catz Jewell): contest was my idea
[19:31:19] Catz Jewell Lane (Catz Jewell): Im forking out the prize
[19:31:32] Catz Jewell Lane (Catz Jewell): I want Hallowwen to be special
[19:31:45] Tor Karlsvalt: Ok I withdraw the motion and not that the EMs will be taking a very limited role with regard to land sales in the next five weeks.
[19:31:54] Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods*
[19:32:05] Catz Jewell Lane (Catz Jewell): done
[19:32:06] Soro (Soro Dagostino): And if any future chancellor should refuse payment, I move s/he be impeached -- immediatly!!!
[19:32:11] Soro (Soro Dagostino): :D
[19:32:12] Gwyneth Llewelyn: ha!
[19:32:13] Baron Klaus Wulfenbach (KlausWulfenbach Outlander) chuckles
[19:32:14] Tor Karlsvalt: haha
[19:32:17] Catz Jewell Lane (Catz Jewell): lol
[19:32:27] Rosie Gray: :D
[19:32:44] Tor Karlsvalt: ok Commission reports or do we want to plan for a next meeting?
[19:32:50] Soro (Soro Dagostino): Done
[19:32:55] Gwyneth Llewelyn is fine eithe way, Tor
[19:32:57] Widget Whiteberry: coughs
[19:33:18] Rosie Gray notes the time and hasn't had dinner yet and her husband is getting antsy
[19:33:22] Gwyneth Llewelyn: awww
[19:33:35] Tor Karlsvalt looks for cough drops.
[19:33:38] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok! Let's adjourn then. We did good work today.
[19:33:47] Tor Karlsvalt: I motion we adjourn
[19:33:50] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Second
[19:33:53] Tor Karlsvalt: we accomplished a lot.
[19:33:55] Tor Karlsvalt: vote
[19:33:56] Rosie Gray: yes
[19:33:56] Gwyneth Llewelyn: Agreed!
[19:33:56] Soro (Soro Dagostino): Hear the pending speakers first!!
[19:33:59] Gwyneth Llewelyn: aye
[19:34:02] Rosie Gray: aye
[19:34:05] Tor Karlsvalt: aye
[19:34:11] Rosie Gray: sorry everyone, I really have to go
[19:34:13] Soro (Soro Dagostino): You denigrate the people

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Cadence Theas
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Re: Transcript of the 10th RA meeting of 22 October 2014 5:3

Post by Cadence Theas »

Hi,
I agree with the votes taken in this session of the RA that I could not attend personally. It might be worth while considering an order of assumption of duties when the chancellor or the LRA resigns their positions. In the case of the chancellor, it is more than obvious that the LRA assume the post of the chancellor pro-tem until a by-election or the start of a new term. And in the case of the resignation of the LRA, I would suggest that the person with the most first votes assume the LRA position until the next election. These are constitutional amendments, so it is worthwhile to begin to pursue the language now to approve rapidly to protect CDS from so many executive renunciations in such a short time.

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