Region: Alpine Meadow (246528, 249856)
Local-Position: (244, 104, 96)
Meeting on 2008-09-07
Those present:
Justice Soothsayer is in the chair.
Justice Soothsayer: Since we have a quorum, I think I will call the meeting to order.
Arria Perreault: ty Gwyn
Justice Soothsayer: Everyone isrezzing very slowly for me, so I've asked Gwyn to distrubte the notecard with our agenda
Arria Perreault: ok
Bells Semyorka: Thank you Gwyn
Bells Semyorka: Hello Everyone
Justice Soothsayer: Please note that the first item is consent to recording; please click on the recording device on the table to indicate consent.
Arria Perreault: Hi Bells 
Arria Perreault has indicated consent to be recorded.
Bells Semyorka has indicated consent to be recorded.
Pip Torok has indicated consent to be recorded.
Gwyneth Llewelyn clicked (she thinks) and gives consent of course
Patroklus Murakami has indicated consent to be recorded.
Rubaiyat Shatner: I believe I did as well
Patroklus Murakami: i've consented to be recorderd
Justice Soothsayer: You should have the agenda; any recommended changes?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: hmm
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I don't think so
Gwyneth Llewelyn: welcome Jamie!
Arria Perreault: Hi Jamie
Bells Semyorka: Hello Jamie
Jamie Palisades: Jamie Palisades: thank you - pardon me while I mute the rooster
zephyru Zapedzki: hi all
Justice Soothsayer: Item I. c. Inquite for any speakers on agenda items. Anyone other than RA members (and Jamie, of course, on the Chancellor's report)
Patroklus Murakami: i'd like to speak on II b and c when the time comes
Justice Soothsayer: OK, noted, Pat.
Bells Semyorka: Hi Mt!
MT Lundquist: hi all
Pip Torok: hi mt
Arria Perreault: Hi MT
Jamie Palisades: And I may also have somethign to say if permitted on the CSDF Commerce Commission bill
Jamie Palisades: I made my comments about MT's appointment last week, I think -- as did several
Justice Soothsayer: Hi MT, thanks for joining us
Gwyneth Llewelyn: hi MT!
MT Lundquist: sorry i've been away and traveling for over 24 hours
MT Lundquist: just got back
MT Lundquist: and i'm tired
Justice Soothsayer: I'm moving on to "future RA meeting times"
Arria Perreault: Hi Naftali
Naftali Torok: aha
Naftali Torok: hi all
Gwyneth Llewelyn waves at Naf
Naftali Torok: waves to the crowd
MT Lundquist has indicated consent to be recorded.
Justice Soothsayer: I am not available next Sunday, so we could either skip that meeting or we could designate someone to preside in my absence
MONASTERY AMPHORA: Oups...
Naftali Torok: lol heheheh i was first jon
Justice Soothsayer: what's your pleasure?
Naftali Torok: so rry
Jon Seattle: lol
Rubaiyat Shatner: is there pressing business for next week? if not then lets skip
Jon Seattle has indicated consent to be recorded.
Gwyneth Llewelyn has no real problem in skipping ? gives us more time to plan
MONASTERY AMPHORA: May the Gods protect you from further stupidity
Bells Semyorka: I agree with Rubaiyat on that one, personally I would rather have the LRA available.
MONASTERY AMPHORA: Oups...
Jamie Palisades smiles - I think Ms Llleewlyn ghere told a commisison yesterday that it;s illegal to have a substitute LRA in most cases
Gwyneth Llewelyn *coughs*
Justice Soothsayer: heh
Justice Soothsayer: I think I'll need to read that tanscript *carefully*
Gwyneth Llewelyn: definitely a non-binding opinion of course 
Gwyneth Llewelyn: hehe
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I might write the summary... one day!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: anyway
Gwyneth Llewelyn: can we agree on a friendly date, or shall we vote to skip (or not) the next meetin g?
Justice Soothsayer: there is a possibility that my trip may be pushed backa week, but I will know for sure by Tuesday; I;ll let you all know by email
Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods* that's fine.
Justice Soothsayer: I just wanted to alert you to the possibility today
Bells Semyorka: sound great Justice
Justice Soothsayer: Item I .f. on the agenda: consent items. I don' thave any.
Gwyneth Llewelyn remains silent too
Justice Soothsayer: So that leads to Item II, Old Business, and the Chancellor's report we deferred from out last meeting.
Justice Soothsayer: Jamie, that means you are up.
Jamie Palisades: Thank you
Gwyneth Llewelyn claps
Justice Soothsayer: (giving MT a chance to catch his breath)
Jamie Palisades: IAs this is the monthly report, I will have some reports to make, and then reserve time for questions on anything .. as I serve at your pleasure.
MT Lundquist smiles in thanks
Jamie Palisades: First, appointments and cololary stipends.
Jamie Palisades: *corrolary
Jamie Palisades: ALl executive branch appointmentsd are announced on the Forum in the exec page.
Jamie Palisades: Along with positions not yet filled.
Jamie Palisades: You will see that we have 6 authorized funded positions, and I have asked you to approve a 7th.
Jamie Palisades: (August 14 post on that last - the second PIO.)
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (do you have a link, please?)
Jamie Palisades: (The RA indicated that they woudl take it up when we discussed budget - thus, presumably, later today.)
Jamie Palisades: Gwyn, not if I keep typing I will send all that towards the end of this presentation
Gwyneth Llewelyn: ok sorry ...
Jamie Palisades: Let's stop for Qs at the end fo each topic.
Jamie Palisades: Positions, Hm.
Jamie Palisades: OK.
Jamie Palisades: We are luckly to have our Treasurer and Content Archivist continue.
Jamie Palisades: We have two PIOs, which we need, assuming you agree to let me pay for them.
Jamie Palisades: (For those not familiar with the law, there is an Civil Servant act which requires that the RA approve any newly created stipended positions.)
Jamie Palisades: I am not yet filled the Events Coordinator or Land Caretaker posts, though I expect that to be done shortly -- and in the latter case ..
Jamie Palisades: .. I have suggested that the caretakers (there are 2 authorized) we drawn from the new Guild BAC.
Jamie Palisades: I will return to appointments and stipens when we discuss budget in a few moments.
Jamie Palisades: Abny questiosn on appointments?
Jamie Palisades looks around, sees none
Gwyneth Llewelyn: loll
Jamie Palisades: ah ha - typey noises ...?
Arria Perreault: well I have expected a position for the portal
Rubaiyat Shatner: can you talk about how the new positioin impacts the budget, or should that wait
Gwyneth Llewelyn seconds Arria
Jamie Palisades: OK ... let's do Rubiyat first (easier for now) then Arria
Jamie Palisades: Rubiyat, I will give you the numbers for the run rate when we get to topic 4 which is budget - so let me know if I do not answer you by then please
Jamie Palisades: Arria, do you mean ... hm.. a funded webmaster stipend?
Naftali Torok: better gwyn
Arria Perreault: yes, an official position
Jamie Palisades: ah
Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods*
Jamie Palisades: well it;s possible
Jamie Palisades: right now we do this
Rubaiyat Shatner: (sorry I do not have a topic 4 on my agende is there a revised one?)
Jamie Palisades: a. USD 10/month for ISP costs (a reimbursement to Alexicon who hosts it)
Jamie Palisades: b. A PIO (Brian L) in charge of it
Jamie Palisades: c. Arria and Alexi who generously did most of the work last term, in connnection with thier positions at that time, have been assisting into the new term.
Jamie Palisades: Our official plan, as previously posted, was to annouce it as complete at Oktobergest ...
Jamie Palisades: ... which is report item 2 ...
Naftali Torok: guys, pip is appologizing, he crashed again...cant come online right now
Arria Perreault: I think that portal is more complex and supposes some responsibilities: access to the system, domain name, hosting, ...
Jamie Palisades: .. by which time I hope to have a few more details worked out .. which include ...
Moon Adamant: hello everyone
Naftali Torok: hi moon
Arria Perreault: PIO is responsible for the content
Jamie Palisades: ... integration with the Forums and the slcds.info domain owner as appropriate ... and
Jamie Palisades: ... finalizzation of responsibilities ...
Jon Seattle hugs Moon
Moon Adamant hugs Jon
Moon Adamant has indicated consent to be recorded.
Jamie Palisades: .. on which topid Brian has been holding meetings, which I understand you and others attend
Jamie Palisades: so my expectation about creating a webmaster position is as follows:
MONASTERY AMPHORA: May the Gods protect you from further stupidity
Arria Perreault: we have to insure the functionning of the portal over the terms
Jamie Palisades: If Brian recommends it, I expect to bring it here for approval
Jamie Palisades: which I expect would be this calendar month.
Jamie Palisades: Arria, did that answer you?
Arria Perreault: not totally
Jamie Palisades: what else, then?
Arria Perreault: I have made a description of the job
Arria Perreault: I will give you it as a notecard
Jamie Palisades: Very grateful. But, i'm sorry, in this meeting, should I see that as a question to me which I have not answered?
Arria Perreault: system and content are at different levels
Arria Perreault: it's ok if we can still discuss the task of a webmaster
Arria Perreault: later
Jamie Palisades: I eblieve it;s both feasuible, and likely desirable - but believe that good management requires we consult with the person in charge of it Brian
Gwyneth Llewelyn: ah.
Jamie Palisades: next item then? done with appointments?
Jamie Palisades: OK
Jamie Palisades: #2 Oktoberfest
Jamie Palisades: which as you know is our 4th anniversary of CDS as well
Gwyneth Llewelyn: hehe
Jamie Palisades: Subject to the budget -- which is item 4 in my report
MONASTERY AMPHORA: Oups...
Jamie Palisades: Here is what we plan.
MONASTERY AMPHORA: Now look what you did!
Jamie Palisades: I will make several Forunm postings later today about this, after taking on any feedback we get here
Jamie Palisades: September 20
CDS Anniversary.
10:45 Flag ceremony, anniversary speeches?
Opening of street market,10 prims per booth, n/c Polka
Carnival (all continuous through festival)
12 pm Soccer Game 1
SLT evening - music event
Naftali Torok: wow soccer again,
Gwyneth Llewelyn: heh Naf
Jamie Palisades: well
Jamie Palisades: Naf
Naftali Torok: i was wondering when that field was to be used again, in nfs
Naftali Torok: lol
Gwyneth Llewelyn: me too
Jamie Palisades: the credit for this planning goes to our possibly-ramining-on-if-paid PIO, Rose ...
Naftali Torok: lol
Jamie Palisades: ... but the failure to call it "football" can be chalked up to me
Justice Soothsayer: lol
Naftali Torok: hehehe
Gwyneth Llewelyn: 
Jamie Palisades: Sept 21
10 am Parade through all sims to Marktplatz.
{possible additional recreational event]
Jamie Palisades: there will be considereble info about the parade posted today
Jamie Palisades: it's goign to be fun
Naftali Torok: i bet
Gwyneth Llewelyn: will we sing the Proposed Anthem? lol
Jamie Palisades: many clever scripting and attachment plans
MONASTERY AMPHORA: Hildegarde, watch your step
Jamie Palisades: AIiyyii anthem. Has it been approved by you lot yet? If so that douns like an Opening Ceremony thing
Gwyneth Llewelyn: no no
Gwyneth Llewelyn: not even finished, much less approved.
Jamie Palisades: and was there a competition? Or is that a Fiat Anthem? Never mind
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (yes, that's it, Jamie )
MONASTERY AMPHORA: May the Gods protect you from further stupidity
Naftali Torok: is there any sheetmusic available of that draft anthem?
Jamie Palisades: .. the carnival .. which involves some fun rides ... and the booths ... will continue all 2 weeks of course.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (Naf: yes!)
Naftali Torok: i saw something from cindy but could not read at alla
Naftali Torok: or maybe a draft mp3?
Jamie Palisades sits back and waits, smiling
Justice Soothsayer: LEts try to keep the conversation directly to Jamie's report for now, please.
Jamie Palisades: .. and whistling something from 'Cabaret' faintly ...
Jamie Palisades: thanks
Gwyneth Llewelyn:
Justice Soothsayer: Jamie, a couple more items before your time runs out, please.
Jamie Palisades: There are a variety of open mic and social events trhoughout the two week period planned:)
Jamie Palisades: culminating in
Jamie Palisades: Sunday October 5
2 pm Anniversary Ball, dj 2 hours
Jamie Palisades: that's all I have for now on Oktoberfest
Jamie Palisades: Item 3
Jamie Palisades: briefly than you think
Gwyneth Llewelyn: "all" is quite a LOT, thank you Mr Chancellor!
Arria Perreault: great programm! congratulation
Jamie Palisades: thank Rose by approving her stipend
Gwyneth Llewelyn: any plans for Christmas yet?
Gwyneth Llewelyn *snickers*
Jamie Palisades: item 3 - NOT a big item for now - but worth a note
Jamie Palisades: land expansion
Naftali Torok: yes
Naftali Torok: hourah more AM
Jamie Palisades: you will see in item 4 that it is my proposal to run CDS recurring expenses mostly from current income
Jamie Palisades: which means, essentially, that our reserve kitty (last reported as approx. USD 4500) ...
Jamie Palisades: kitty = English colloquial for a purse ...
Jamie Palisades: can be used for prudence reserves and investments in expansion.
Jamie Palisades: so for example we will spend, out of that, this next week, for the delivered Locus Amoenus builds ...
Gwyneth Llewelyn listens with a smile to see where this is leading...
Jamie Palisades: alreday provdied by Guild memebrs and budgeted and approved .. hmm .. in late July.
Jamie Palisades: So our quetsion will be whether there are other investments we can make to grow, that will result in a net positive income back to CDS over time.
Jamie Palisades: There are abotu four ways to do that.
Jamie Palisades: I have posted about these, here:
Jamie Palisades: Sim and City Planning Board =
Jamie Palisades: title "How sim expansion decisions wotk in CDS"
Jamie Palisades: I expect to bring several proposals forward to the RA this calendar month.
Jamie Palisades: so that you are aware, there are at least three possibilities active at the moment.
Rubaiyat Shatner: can you post the full URL?
Jamie Palisades: At the end, Rubi, sorry. Not enough fingers typing at once
Jamie Palisades: thre possibilities:
Jamie Palisades: 1. More full sims. Let me say, I am interested in seeing how the sale of LA completes before any such proposal is made.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: aha
Jamie Palisades: It's possible. But land markets in SL are .. just ... weird right now.
Jamie Palisades: I am VERY interested to see how successfully we use OFest and our new CIO team to promote LA.
Arria Perreault: http://forums.slcds.info/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=2067 (I'm multi task )
Jamie Palisades: And not typing
Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods* and understands... it will be a 'test' so to say
Jamie Palisades: thanks Arria
Jamie Palisades: Exactly, Gwyn
Jamie Palisades: we are not expanding in the market that grew Caledon, Antiquity, SLNE, Azure, Winterfell, etc.
Naftali Torok: thxs
Jamie Palisades: For whatever reason .. and I have my own views ... CDS missed all that.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: 'missed'...?
Naftali Torok: mmm
Jamie Palisades: In my government capacity I prefer to focus on a reasonably well planned future.
Naftali Torok: is that wrong or good?
Jamie Palisades: Oh yes, Gwyn but as I said - in my capacity as government offiial I will focus on the future
Jamie Palisades: Our coalition requires everyone's assent to success well
Jamie Palisades: So asking why things didn;t happen in the past? heh - not the way forward
Naftali Torok: ok
Naftali Torok: agree
Jamie Palisades: however, as a side note gwyn, I will be happy to provide my statistical case that it was missed later, and only as a citizen opinion
Naftali Torok: but still interesting from historical point of view, so maybe later..
Jamie Palisades: now
Jamie Palisades: indeed
Jamie Palisades: In fact Naf I may make a board game out of it
Naftali Torok: hehe
Gwyneth Llewelyn: a board game?? lol
Jamie Palisades: "WoS"
Jamie Palisades: later
Naftali Torok: thats the right thing to relativate
Gwyneth Llewelyn: ah yes 
Jamie Palisades: Where we are now: community decisions abotu growth, ahem
Jamie Palisades: I said there were 3 paths
Gwyneth Llewelyn: but ok, I'd love to see those statistics, and I understand that you can show them in a future date.
Jamie Palisades: the second is private initiatives
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (sorry)
Jamie Palisades: Please note that we have received a proposal from Arria already
Jamie Palisades: I anm inclinced to agree and recommend we go forward with it, and will post a rection and solict further comments this week.
Jamie Palisades: I had to do some calculations to figure out whether it was sensible - I thikn it is - but expect more of a numbers case when it comes to you
Jamie Palisades: It's my take that anythign that adds a sim to CDS owned or contolled land requires RA approval
Jamie Palisades: (Not that our laws are that clear - but that's how I am proceeding, in any case)
Justice Soothsayer: Reasonable assumption, Jamie
Jamie Palisades: There will be more p[roposals like Arria's
Jamie Palisades: But none are yet mature
Jamie Palisades: Last tiem is #4 budget
Jamie Palisades: item
Naftali Torok: short definition of arriasproposal??
Jamie Palisades: let me forge on then see if there are questions
Jamie Palisades: Arria, can you send Naf your Forum URI, or paste it here into chat?
Jamie Palisades: budget
Naftali Torok: great thaks
Naftali Torok: i missed that
Jamie Palisades: mostly, see the latest posting in "Business, Commerce & Economy"
Naftali Torok: aha
Naftali Torok: thx anyway
Justice Soothsayer: Interesteing selection of place for the budget discussion, Jamie.
Jamie Palisades: here: http://forums.slcds.info//viewtopic.php?f=20&t=2108
Jamie Palisades: Well, Justice,consider this:
Jamie Palisades: a. All should be entitled to comment
Jamie Palisades: b. It's of acute coisequence to our economy
Jamie Palisades: c. It;'s not legislation
Jamie Palisades:
Jamie Palisades: to summarize:c
Justice Soothsayer: d. Having a budget is itself an event?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: hmm *approving the budget* is a bill, though.
Jamie Palisades: un
Jamie Palisades: hahahaha
Jamie Palisades: let me take both those implied quetsions
Jamie Palisades: they're too good to pass up
Gwyneth Llewelyn:
Jamie Palisades: (You guys shoudl know better than to throw me straight lines)
Jamie Palisades: @Justice
Gwyneth Llewelyn: yes, we should
Jamie Palisades: yes - it IS an event. WE have OFTEN operated without a budget.
Jamie Palisades: That's BAD
Jamie Palisades: so
Jamie Palisades: Now we have one
Gwyneth Llewelyn totally agrees
Jamie Palisades: @Gwyn
Gwyneth Llewelyn: yay
Jamie Palisades: approving a budget oculd be a bill if oen of two things happened -
Jamie Palisades: (1) CDS Law requires the RA to approve bvudgets -- and it does not.
Jamie Palisades: or
Gwyneth Llewelyn: uh?...
Jamie Palisades: (2) RA changed the law to constrain the executive further
Jamie Palisades: Feel free to disagree Here is my view: WE have been operating without a approved budget rather consistently .. and yet the executive spwends .. consistently .. so there WAS in fact a budget
Jamie Palisades: it was just the aggregate vector sum of spend decisions
Jamie Palisades: not a good way to proceed .. BUT no allegeatio fo illegality was ever suggsted
Jamie Palisades: nwo
Jamie Palisades: shall we take *this term budget plans* or *budget process* ?
Jamie Palisades: (two threads really)
Jamie Palisades: if no suggestions, I plan to describe this terms' plans first
Jamie Palisades: :)_ and the RA can consier what it want to do to ap[prove or thwart them, after thart
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok, I see what I was missing. When the "Old Guild" was eliminated, we 'forgot' to update the Constitution to say that the Executive proposes a budget for the RA to approve with a majority vote.
Jamie Palisades: As I said
Jamie Palisades: I took this job after a careful reading of the law
Gwyneth Llewelyn: yes, you're right.
Justice Soothsayer: Well, Gwyn, the constitution does constrain the exec to spend "pursuant to" laws passed by the RA.
Jamie Palisades: May I go ahead with budget plans for now? I would be happy to disuss whetehr the RA wanst to re-take-over day to day management issues .. but suggets that come later
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Yes, it does.
Jamie Palisades: siiiigh
Gwyneth Llewelyn: sure lol
Jamie Palisades: which justice means you can veto me, basically
Jamie Palisades: whgich is what a legislature should do
Jamie Palisades: so
Jamie Palisades:
Jamie Palisades: In a nutshell
Jamie Palisades: All interested parties shoudl, as I have posted, look at Sudane's presentation that we solicited and she garcuiously provided to last term's RA
Jamie Palisades: Everthign I say now is also provided here: http://forums.slcds.info//viewtopic.php?f=20&t=2108
Jamie Palisades: so I;ll only do the very brief version in chat here
Jamie Palisades: We collect about USD 310/month per rented sim
Jamie Palisades: that takes into account the odd collection discount
Jamie Palisades: so our steady state w 4 sims will be USD 1240
Jamie Palisades: (for those who do not keep their nose in the law we do have some legislation about accounting in US Dollars)
Jamie Palisades: Our payment to Linden Labs for tier for four sims is USD 980 / month.
Jamie Palisades: WHat I have posted is this:
Jamie Palisades: 1. I have authority to pay six, and wan tto pay a seventh, L$1000/mo stipend(s).
Jamie Palisades: I will ask you to approve the seventh at the end of my remarks today.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: hmm
Jamie Palisades: All as posted Gwyn
Jamie Palisades: SO that's about USD 44 / month
Gwyneth Llewelyn: yes, I know... please do go on
Jamie Palisades: Sudane suggested last term that we routinely save 25 of the rent income over fixed expenses per month.
Arria Perreault: is the opeinig ball in your budget?
Jamie Palisades: Let me just finish
Jamie Palisades: AS we're voer time
Arria Perreault: ok
Jamie Palisades: I endorse her view, for now, so that's another USD 58 / month to the kitty.
Justice Soothsayer: Indeed
Jamie Palisades: Which, at USD 4500 or so is our war chest for emergencies and any expansion.
Jamie Palisades: We also have a USD 10 / month ISP portal obligation.
Jamie Palisades: I expect that to grow, by the way, as we consildate and rationalise our web resources.
Justice Soothsayer: 2 minutes more, please, Jamie, then we will open for *brief* q & a.
Jamie Palisades: For eaxmaple we get free hosting now from Beta Tech
Gwyneth Llewelyn: uh, no
Jamie Palisades: WHich seems wrong to me
Gwyneth Llewelyn: from gwyn really
Jamie Palisades: Oh? I have approved nothing talk laterm, perhaps?
Jamie Palisades: ahem
Gwyneth Llewelyn: it's still wrong, I know.
Jamie Palisades: That leaves "available" funds after automatic reserves of about L$46,425 (USD 175) per month.
Jamie Palisades: I have plans for some of that, which involve PR and other possible citizen enrichment opportunities.
Jamie Palisades: beraing in mind that I propsoe to fun any "growth" to new sims or etc. out of reserves instead.
Jamie Palisades: I might also mention that a few RA memebs last term had a completely different idea about what to do with "extra" funds
Jamie Palisades: I do not agree at this time -- insufficient data -- but let me mention it anyway for completelness --
Gwyneth Llewelyn whistles innocently
Jamie Palisades: some felt we should use it to subsidize & thus lower soem or all rents.
Jamie Palisades:
Jamie Palisades: which leaves the last expense plan I am reporting to you as a budget at this time
Jamie Palisades: Events
Jamie Palisades: See the URI please
Jamie Palisades: Essentially I propose that we spend about ...
Gwyneth Llewelyn actually wanted more sims, and not lower rents, but that's irrelevant ? sorry, just to clarify my position
Jamie Palisades: (I was paraphrasing FlyingRoc's views, not yours Gwyn)
Justice Soothsayer: Time, please
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (I know, but it might not have been obvious )
Jamie Palisades: ... 44 USD / month on events as detailed in the Forum post
Justice Soothsayer: OK, thanks, Jamie.
Jamie Palisades: Done, and thank you, and I am happy to answer questions at your option.
Justice Soothsayer: I have two suggestions in response on budget.
Justice Soothsayer: First, I don't think we should approve a proposed budget today, as I would think we would like a
little time to digest the numbers, and see if there is any public comment.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: thank you Jamie ? very very throrough
Justice Soothsayer: Second, I do think we could go ahead and approve Jamie's recommendation to fund a 2nd member of the PIO team.
Jamie Palisades smiles and raises his hand for a question
Gwyneth Llewelyn seconds that recommendation
Rubaiyat Shatner: I agree Justice.
Arria Perreault: I agree too
Jamie Palisades: that's what I was going to ask
Justice Soothsayer: OK, taking that as a motion, any discussion on the 2d PIO slot? (hold for a moment, please, Jamie)
Arria Perreault: as I was PIO myself, I can say that there is enough work for two
Gwyneth Llewelyn: well, we need more events: assuming those require more people to plan and coordinate, I'm naturally ok in approving larger budgets for that (and another PIO won't hurt ) I would be fine approving the US$ 44/mo. budget for events as well, of course.
Arria Perreault: so I agree with a second PIO
Justice Soothsayer: All in favor of the motion to approve creation of a second PIO stipend position?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: aye!
Arria Perreault: aye
Bells Semyorka: Aye
Justice Soothsayer votes Aye
Rubaiyat Shatner: yes
Justice Soothsayer: The motion carries. Jamie, you had a question?
Jamie Palisades: Tjhanks for that . I suggest that before a budget bill is formulated .. as it might act to create a significant new constraint on yoru government, who is likely to react to it ... we might chat, Justice
Justice Soothsayer looks at his watch
Gwyneth Llewelyn: ok, well, if both LRA& Chancellor prefer to talk first before having a motion to approve the whole budget today...
Gwyneth Llewelyn *shrugs* who am I to propose any other thing?
Justice Soothsayer: Past RAs have approved budgets, usually a month or so into the new term.
Jamie Palisades: I am unaware of any legal need for it .. and concerne dthat it would have effects you have not yet considered
Justice Soothsayer: In any event, we are WAY past the time alotted for this discussion today, so I suggest we move on to the very patient MT.
Justice Soothsayer: Any objection?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Yes, sadly, as said, that was dropped from the Constitution (you're right on that, Jamie), although I don't understand *why* since there used to be an "all-embracing clause": 'any issue that was formerly dealt by the Old Guild is now done by the Executive', and this would include the budget I guess. I can't find the reference though.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: and no objections
Patroklus Murakami: Art II S9 "Any power or responsibility assigned to the Artisan's Collective by the constitution and precedent that overlaps those provided to the Chancellor in this amendment will be assigned to the Chancellor."
Gwyneth Llewelyn: so for clarification ? the budget approval will be on the next RA meeting, right? (either next week on in the other week)
Gwyneth Llewelyn: thank you Pat, that's it
Justice Soothsayer: Yes, I will include the budget as a continuing item at our next meeting.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: thank you Justice
Justice Soothsayer: Moving on, I move that we reconsider our decision last week on MT's nomination to the Scientific Council.
Jamie Palisades has indicated consent to be recorded.
Justice Soothsayer: As I mentioned in the forums, it's my fault for the mixup on dates, as MT had said he was unavailable until 7 September, and I apologize.
MT Lundquist accepts
Justice Soothsayer: Please note MT has responded to the various questions posted in the forums
MT Lundquist: http://forums.slcds.info/viewtopic.php? ... 059#p12059
ThePrincess Parisi: /raises her hand
Justice Soothsayer: but first, I need a second to my motion to reconsider so as to reopen this item.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I definitely accept the reasoning behind having discussed it at the *wrong date* as previously agreed. Also, I find it uncomfortable to raise questions without a nominated SC member to be present to discuss them. So I'm fine in disregarding last week's discussion + vote and do it today again, specially because MT has answered all questions we've asked him.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: So that's a second, yes, Justice.
ThePrincess Parisi: never mind
Justice Soothsayer: Thanks, Gwyn. All in favor of reopening the question, please say aye.
Bells Semyorka: Aye
Justice Soothsayer votes Aye.
Arria Perreault: aye
Gwyneth Llewelyn: aye on reopening the question.
Rubaiyat Shatner: yes
Justice Soothsayer: The ayes havce it, and we will reconsider.
Justice Soothsayer: I'll let MT have the floor, then I think thePrincess has asked to speak.
Justice Soothsayer: MT, it's all yours.
MT Lundquist: ty
MT Lundquist: i will copy some sections ofmy post for the record
MT Lundquist: 1) What is the proper role of the Scientific Council in our democracy? Its governmental role is to interpret and enforce the constitution. Its service roll is to resolve citizen disputes and moderate user forums and events.
MT Lundquist: 2) How is the role of a member of the SC different from the role of member of the RA? A RA member is an elected official selected by citizen votes for factions. RA members typically design , debate and vote on legislation. A SC professors are chosen at the recommendation of current (SC) members based on demonstrated skill and desire to uphold the constitution without bias. SC members interpret and uphold the constitution.
MT Lundquist: 3) What qualities should we look for in a member of the SC, and how do you possess those qualities? The three qualities specified by the existing SC are 1) A diversity of opinions My role as an RA member has demonstrated this 2) Members who can think Again my work in the RA has demonstrated this, together with a set of reasoned posts in the forums on a number of topics 3) Level heads. In RL I'm a senior manager in government service. I manage, at times, over 100 staff running a complex IT infrastructure environment for an organisation of 18,000 staff. I have chaired internal meetings and appeal hearings, where I have had to interpret law and internal policies and procedures.
MT Lundquist: 4) Shortly after the last election, you asked the SC to order an entirely new election. Please explain why this action would not have been inappropriately "activist" of the SC. There was a question over the type of count method used and a great deal of confusion from a number of people involved with that process as to how the count was/should be made. Given the confusion and the effect that the two methods would have on the election results i.e. two different results it seemed more aligned with democratic principles that the election be set aside and a new election ordered following clarification of the counting method. The election result may well have been exactly the same as the method chosen by the SC (in reality) but the method of getting to it would have been beyond reproach. Therefore I fell in that circumstance it wouls not have been inappropriately activist.
MT Lundquist: by Dnate Mars on Tue Sep 02, 2008 9:44 pm I am glad that this matter has been resolved the way it has. MT will get to defend himself now. However, not everyone may know who MT is, I for one think he should post and take questions from the citizens. With SLCC and RL going on, not everyone can make it to the RA meeting. Perhaps he would like to post here and take questions. MT if you would like, could you tell us why you want to be part of the SC? I did not directly seek nomination to the SC, in fact I was surprised to learn of my nomination. That said I do believe I can make an effective contribution and do have the ability to interpret the constitution and uphold it.
MT Lundquist: I believe that the work I have done for CDS both before I was elected to the RAand during the last term demonstrates my commitment to CDS, democracy and the constitution. All the actions I have taken in those capacities have been in accordance with the constitution and I have at times refered to it to confirm this. I believe therefore I have demonstrated skill. I refer also to my comments above about my RL responsibilities which also accord with this. With regard to your hypthetical about a nomination of 'someone' who does not demonstrate the full skills then I would seek to establish how critical that missing skill was, as a requirement for nomination and allow it to weight my decision accordingly.
MT Lundquist: I alsonote for the record that the constitution lays out clear guidelines as to the roles of the variuos bodies in agreeing members of the SC Section 2 - The Scientific Council Body The SC is comprised of Professors, Chairs, and a single SC Dean. Professors are chosen at the recommendation of current members based on demonstrated skill and desire to uphold the constitution without bias. Chairs are nominated by the Dean and approved by a simple majority vote. Section 7 - Powers of the RA In regards to the Philosophic branch: The RA provides a vote of confidence on candidates to the Philosophic branch. This vote is in regards to their perceived likelihood to uphold the constitution.
MT Lundquist: Clearly the role of the Sc has already been performed in nominating and unanimously accepting that nomination they agreed the 'demonstrated skill and desire to uphold the constitution without bias. ' The role of the RA is equally clear 'This vote is in regards to their perceived likelihood to uphold the constitution.' So the RA simply has to be assured that I will will be likely to uphold the constitution. I can assure you that I willand can say,catagorically, that there is no time when I haven't upheld the constitution since becoming a citizen of CDS.
MT Lundquist: this last part is i think important
Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods*
MT Lundquist: as you asked me about the constitution
MT Lundquist: the role of the RA in decidding about memebrs of the SC is clear
MT Lundquist: and that should form the basis for your decision today
MT Lundquist: i also wish to stress that I have always worked for aCDS
MT Lundquist: and within the constitution
MT Lundquist: even when i have differing views to some of you
Justice Soothsayer: MT, my question about the proper role of the SC is a bit deeper than just reciting what the Constitution says. For example, should the SC be guided by the text of the Constitution (the letter of the law) or the intent (spirit of the law) in interpreting the Constitution?
MT Lundquist: ty
MT Lundquist: i'm happy to take questions
MT Lundquist: where the letter of the law is very clear
MT Lundquist: then any amendment to it is a matter for the RA
MT Lundquist: a change in the law if you will
MT Lundquist: where the SC takes its role i believe
MT Lundquist: is where the law is less than clear and needs interpreting
MT Lundquist: does that help
Rubaiyat Shatner: /I have what I hope is a brief question, forgive me if I missed your answer in the forums previously: has the issue with the election been resolved, and if so when was it resolved in your mind?
MT Lundquist: yes it was resloved in my mind
Rubaiyat Shatner: Let me note that I am interested in your preceptions of the machinations of this government.
Rubaiyat Shatner: can you say when or what resolved it?
MT Lundquist: I happen to believe privately that calling a new election would have been a better course for democracy
MT Lundquist: BUT
MT Lundquist: the SC has ruled finally on it
MT Lundquist: and they are the arbiters
MT Lundquist: so the matter is dealt with
Rubaiyat Shatner: thank you, I am done.
Justice Soothsayer: Any other RA questions before I recognize thePrincess?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I might ask one afterwards;
MT Lundquist:
Justice Soothsayer: Princess, did you want to add somethng here?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: it takes some time to type
Gwyneth Llewelyn: so, yes, Princess first.
ThePrincess Parisi: oh im not intersted in speaking, you said what i wanted to say gwyen
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I did?
ThePrincess Parisi: that justice made a mistake on MTd date
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ah yes, I think that was clear.
Justice Soothsayer: Anyone else?
Patroklus Murakami: i have a question
Jamie Palisades smiles faintly
Justice Soothsayer: Go ahea, Pat
Patroklus Murakami: MT, when you raised the issue of the Borda count in the last elections Cindy posted several well-reasoned explanations of why your call to run the election again was unnecessary. Why did you persist in making a case which advantages your faction after it had been explained that there was no confusion over how the count should be made?
Jamie Palisades raises his hand, what the heck, hate to see pat all alone as a concerned citizen
Soro Dagostino: Excuse me please
Justice Soothsayer: MT's reply first, then Jamie, then Soro.
MT Lundquist: I still believe there was sufficient confusion amongst significant people involved in the count that the matter should be raised before the SC
Moon Adamant: you will pardon me, but i need to leave to attend matters and prepare Guild's meeting
Patroklus Murakami: who exactly?
Moon Adamant: thank you everyone
MT Lundquist: I believe that democracy would have been better served if the course i had suggested had been taken
Patroklus Murakami: who was confused?
MT Lundquist: however its a matter of record now
MT Lundquist: initially Claude
MT Lundquist: and Jon
Justice Soothsayer: Thanks, MT. Jamie?
Jamie Palisades: thanks ...
MT Lundquist: it was in im to the whole CDS group at the time
Jamie Palisades: MT, I attended what I think was the SC meetign in quetsion, a d the RA meeting we held beforehand at which there was also some disussion,. Just for clarity: I didn't think your argument was about the math. ... I *thought* your argument was that no election should as a policy matter take place when the rules have nto yet been fully specified. Which was it?
Bells Semyorka: WB Pip
Jamie Palisades: (the math itelf loses me, frankly)
MT Lundquist: the second about specifying the rules
Pip Torok: tks
Jamie Palisades: thank you. Done.
MT Lundquist: i think its important that the rules for the count be established before the votes
Jon Seattle raises his hand
Bells Semyorka raises her hand
MT Lundquist: the answer may well have been the same in a second vote
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Hmm they were though...
Bells Semyorka: I have a question
MT Lundquist: but it would have been clear
Justice Soothsayer: OK, Bells, as an RA member, then Soro, then Jon.
Gwyneth Llewelyn *raises hand* next
Justice Soothsayer: then Gwyn. and maybe then a vote?
Soro Dagostino: Hmmm, just a second.
Justice Soothsayer: Bells?
Bells Semyorka: well I'm slightly confused. If it was clear as to how we were voting, why did we have to vote as an RA for future Borda
Bells Semyorka: the first Ra session we had seemed to caarify it
Bells Semyorka: so to me it seemed that it wasnt clear before
MT Lundquist smiles
Bells Semyorka: why did we vote?
Justice Soothsayer: WEll, Bells, the amendment we passed certainly would remove anyone's doubt. And I think it was better for the RA to do it than for the SC to do so.
Rubaiyat Shatner: was that a question for MT?
Bells Semyorka: no not for mt, just more of a statment I suppose
Bells Semyorka: but thanks for the clarification justice
Justice Soothsayer: OK, Soro, you are next.
MT Lundquist: but i do think that helps answer Pats question
Soro Dagostino: NO need now. Jamie said what I wanted to note.
Justice Soothsayer: OK, Jon, then Gwyn,
Justice Soothsayer: Then time is nearly up.
Jon Seattle: Yes, MT, had the SC agreed with you it would have reversed the basis for every election we have had up to that point. 1. Do you think such a reversal is accetable -- that we igore precident. Also 2. What were you trying to acheive with a re-run of the data collection portion or the election when that had nothing to do with the way seats are allocated? Was it intended as a penalty? Or did you actually expect the result to be different. If the latter, why?
Justice Soothsayer: MT, a response?
MT Lundquist: Dealing with historical elections
MT Lundquist: they had gone past and could not be changed even if the method was flawed
MT Lundquist: at the point i raised the isssue with the SC the current RA had not started
MT Lundquist: however the main point here Jon
MT Lundquist: is that the rules should be known ahead of the election
MT Lundquist: as Bells pointed out that has now been clarified
MT Lundquist: as to whether the result would have been different
Jon Seattle: They were.. as we had established, but that is avoiding an answer.
MT Lundquist: who knows
Justice Soothsayer: OK, Gwyn is next, then we are out of time.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Just a comment (and not quite a question), the SC *did* point us out what was correct; the RA just *reinforced* the SC's words and made it into a *law*... anyway... to me the issue here is really discussing 'past behaviour' vs. trying to figure out future behaviour of a candidate to the SC, so...
Gwyneth Llewelyn: First, I really would like to thank MT for the patience in answering quite thoroughly on the forums. It was quite enlightening. As you very well said, MT, the vote of confidence on the RA is based just on the 'likelihood' of upholding the Constitution. Now, since the RA cannot know what lies in the future, we can only look at past examples. As Rubaiyat mentioned, you perceived that on the last elections the CDS was not following the rules correctly. The SC met extraordinarily, and clarified that, indeed, the proper procedure was followed. Still you insisted that the SC was wrong (even 'biased') to apply the constitution (since by doing so NuCARE would have one seat left). You refused to accept the explanation that anyone in the CDS can count votes as they wish, but that there is only one way that the Constitution allows votes to be counted. However, you insisted. In my view, this meant that you were quite willing to push your point through, no matter if it was against the constitution or not; granted,
MT Lundquist: the point would have been to be seen as a true fully functioning democracy that corrects its mistakes
Gwyneth Llewelyn: we cannot foretell the future (and you might change your attitude), but in my view, anyone willing to fight so hard *against* the Constitution might be doing that in the future. In fact, I wonder if instead of pushing for the RA to change the legislation, you won't prefer to 'force' the SC to adopt a different view instead... one that is more aligned to your ideas. This *can* happen again in the future. We (the RA) simply don't know.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: That was mostly my issue... based on your past behaviour, MT, how can the RA *know* that, in the future,
Gwyneth Llewelyn: you might uphold the Constitution after all?...
Gwyneth Llewelyn: thanks
Justice Soothsayer: Time for this discussion has expired. I'll let MT respond, then either entertain a motion to continue the discussion or we'll move to a vote.
MT Lundquist: well i dont thibk it wrong for anyone to place their interpretation of the constitution in front of the SC
MT Lundquist: the SC should decide
MT Lundquist: It may even be appropriate for the SC to reconsider if new facts or points of law emerge
MT Lundquist: we dont have a hierarchy of courts in CDS
MT Lundquist: so the SC has to decide and redecide if necesary
Justice Soothsayer: Thank you, MT, and thank you for your patience with us.
MT Lundquist: when it was clear they had made their final decision I srtopped putting my point forward
Justice Soothsayer: RA members, are you ready to vote?
MT Lundquist: as i wishe d to stay within the constitution
MT Lundquist:
MT Lundquist: finished
Gwyneth Llewelyn: thank you MT ? very enlightening
Bells Semyorka: diversity is a crutial part of democracy
Jo Sapeur: hi everyone
MT Lundquist: hi jo
Naftali Torok: hello
Bells Semyorka: we should include everyone pov and to represent the entire community
Arria Perreault: Hi Jo:-)
Justice Soothsayer: The question is on whether MT Lundquist shall be confirmed as a member of the Scientific Council. How do you vote?
Rubaiyat Shatner: yes
Pip Torok: no
Bells Semyorka: Aye
Arria Perreault: nay
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Nay
Justice Soothsayer votes no. The nays have it. 2 yes, 4 no, 1 absent.
Jamie Palisades: Mr. LRA, quick procedural question?
Justice Soothsayer: We are now past our allotted meeting time. Do you want to continue?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I would like to suggest something too (after Jamie)
Bells Semyorka clears her thoat and mumbles, witch hunt
Gwyneth Llewelyn is also fine to continue.
Justice Soothsayer: OK, Jamie, procedural question?
Jamie Palisades: Just wondering if anyone knows when the 30th day is or was, for the record.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (meaning: I second a motion to continue )
Justice Soothsayer: Yup, I believ the 30 day period would expire on 12 September.
Jamie Palisades: kk thx
Justice Soothsayer: OK moving, on, the Commerce Bill.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Nomination of Mt was August 13, Jamie
Gwyneth Llewelyn just wanted to add something
MT Lundquist: ty ladies and gentlemen for your consideration
Justice Soothsayer: Thanks, MT.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: may I? I promise to be brief.
Jamie Palisades looks at Gwyn with narrowed eyes and a sigh
Gwyneth Llewelyn: lol
Justice Soothsayer echoes Jamie
Naftali Torok: lol
Gwyneth Llewelyn: well, you can overrule, Mr LRA
Gwyneth Llewelyn: and let the meeting proceed...
Justice Soothsayer: Gwyn, we've voted. Time to move on, I think.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok.
Gwyneth Llewelyn *shrugs*
Justice Soothsayer: So if you want to speak about the commerce bill....
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Mmmh 
Justice Soothsayer notes RA members can and frequently do amplify their comments at meetings by further disucssion on the forums
Gwyneth Llewelyn notices that some homework on that bill was left undone and blames herself
Arria Perreault: can we table this topic?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I'd second that... for one reason... we sort of promised to review Jamie vs. Jon's bill
Gwyneth Llewelyn: but mmmh we failed to do so
Justice Soothsayer: Some members last time said they wanted to study the issue further; anyone have comments to make after that period of reflection?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: We didn't reflect enough... nay, we didn't reflect at all lol
Arria Perreault: I did not ...
MT Lundquist: apologies ...must go and sleep now
Gwyneth Llewelyn: What this mostly means hmm is that I'm not prepared to vote on a *changed* version of Jon's bill
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Thanks for bearing with us, MT
Bells Semyorka: Night Mt! huggs
Arria Perreault: Good bye MT, thank you for coming
MT Lundquist: bye all
Gwyneth Llewelyn: bye
Soro Dagostino: Take care MT
Justice Soothsayer: Bye MT
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Last meeting, a lot of questions (left unanswered) were made about Jon's proposed bill
Naftali Torok: bye mt
Justice Soothsayer: Allright, I heard a suggestion to table this (again)
Gwyneth Llewelyn: the 'period of reflection' was planned to 'smooth out' the rough edges on that proposal, based on comments made
Gwyneth Llewelyn: we didn't smooth them out
Justice Soothsayer: I gather more smoothing time is needed
Gwyneth Llewelyn: so I second Arria's motion
Justice Soothsayer: Pip? Bells? Ruba?
Rubaiyat Shatner: table
Bells Semyorka: I agree more time is needed
Pip Torok: i realise we didnt "smooth" them
Justice Soothsayer: OK I think we have a consensus. We'll continue this item.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: ok...
Justice Soothsayer: Any other new business?
Gwyneth Llewelyn remains silent
Justice Soothsayer: Hearing none, we can move on to open discussion. Feel free to jump in, one and all.
Gwyneth Llewelyn:
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok... a few 'minor' points...
Jamie Palisades: I have two quick ones will wait until after Gwyn
Gwyneth Llewelyn: we have an unofficial proposal for an Anthem
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (that's mostly it ? an announcement)
Arria Perreault: I have 2 short ones for Jamie
Gwyneth Llewelyn: anyone musically inclined should feel free to contribute, it would be nice to have it for the Oktoberfest (unlikely) or Christmas (possibly) as well as the New Flag
Justice Soothsayer: Jamie?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: that's all
Jamie Palisades: -- commissions -- note, corproate commission, I flubbed, will have to go to next week
Jamie Palisades: -- green sustainability commission 0-- stil lin the planning, btu be aware, it;s "oth there", thoughts welcome
Jamie Palisades: "out there"
Justice Soothsayer: OK, wil put corporate and electoral commission reports on next meeting's agenda.
Jon Seattle has to run to the Guild meeting.. thanks everyone.
Jamie Palisades: -- sim expansion Arria and I and others are talking ... so some extent we need to figure out when and how
Gwyneth Llewelyn: good
Jamie Palisades: so anyone with thoughts on voids and priorities? Great time to chat informally about it
Arria Perreault: ok
Naftali Torok: ok
Jamie Palisades: finally -- watch for the parade uinfo, It;'s your patriotic duty to enter a float
Jamie Palisades: and ooo this is gonna be fun ...
Naftali Torok: do i feel patriotic?
Naftali Torok: lol
ThePrincess Parisi: i want more sims for small lots for new citizens of every color and persuasion
Patroklus Murakami: the plans sound great jamie
Arria Perreault: yes
ThePrincess Parisi: with a area for newbies that has lots for welfare recipients
Naftali Torok: i would love to see and extension of our lovely AM sim
ThePrincess Parisi: pro bono lots.. BJs plan was fantastic
Jamie Palisades: good -- this is the kind of feedback that we need to keep collecting
Justice Soothsayer: I would like to see a smoothing of the rough edges of our sims as seen from LA
Jamie Palisades: Watch "Sim & City Planning" -- or just come talk to me
Arria Perreault: The Monastery will make one. There is the other side to fill ....
Jamie Palisades: and rememnber the GMP already helps guid a lot of this
Jamie Palisades: hmmmm
Jamie Palisades: I wonder if we oughts do a special meeting for all citizens as some point soon
Arria Perreault: good idea
Naftali Torok: i am thinking ofgreat
Jamie Palisades: (assuming that we are ready to start executing post Oktoberfest .. that sort a suggests a citizen & guild recation period roughly *durign* it.) ...
Naftali Torok: sorry wrong snetnece
Naftali Torok: lol sentence
Jamie Palisades: OK will meditate a little on that.
Justice Soothsayer: hmmm, Oktoberfest beer-infused citizen response might be interesting.
Naftali Torok: lol
Jamie Palisades: yaaaah -- hic -- whhaaaat the heck ---- lesss buy some (HIC) shims ...
Jamie Palisades burps
Justice Soothsayer: hehe
Arria Perreault: I have two short questions for Jamie. First is: are the expenses for the opening ball in the budget (we spend money before to have it I would to be sure everything is ok). 2. question about CDS webmaster
Soro Dagostino: It has been interesting, its time to go to the bar.
Soro Dagostino: RL -- cya all.
ThePrincess Parisi: bye soro!
Justice Soothsayer: Thanks, Soro.
Arria Perreault: bye Soro
Jamie Palisades eyes the LRA and wonders if he mentioned the Government Officials Beer Dunk Tank ytet
Jamie Palisades: ta Soro
Patroklus Murakami must get going too. bye all
Soro Dagostino: Take care all!
Jamie Palisades: Arria
Jamie Palisades: as to Q1
Justice Soothsayer notes Arri's question, suggests Jamie responds after the meeting, looks at his watch, etc.
Jamie Palisades: oh ok:)
Arria Perreault: does the CDS webmaster to the executive branch or should we enter a bill to describe the job?
Jamie Palisades: adjourn first then I will talk
Arria Perreault: ok
Gwyneth Llewelyn: haha
Gwyneth Llewelyn: ok
Arria Perreault: I second adjournment
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I'll second it too!
Rubaiyat Shatner: third
Justice Soothsayer: OK, me too. We are adjourned.
Rubaiyat Shatner: all right, bye all
The meeting closed at 11:25 Linden time.