Commission Meeting Transcript August 17, 2014
[2014/08/17 10:01:49] Rosie Gray: okay, meeting starts!
[2014/08/17 10:01:52] Pat (patroklus.murakami): wow 50 responses? thats pretty good!
[2014/08/17 10:01:53] Rosie Gray: ㋡
[2014/08/17 10:02:16] Rosie Gray: Bromo might join us if he can
[2014/08/17 10:02:24] Lilith Ivory: that´s awesome
[2014/08/17 10:02:39] Rosie Gray: so, 3 items for our Agenda today (sorry I didn't write it up)
[2014/08/17 10:02:45] Rosie Gray: 1) review the survey
[2014/08/17 10:03:06] Rosie Gray: 2) decide on our in-world meeting times and format
[2014/08/17 10:03:21] Rosie Gray: 3) Bromo's question about allowing anyone who wants to sit into these meetings
[2014/08/17 10:03:39] Rosie Gray: anything else to add to the Agenda?
[2014/08/17 10:04:02] Pat (patroklus.murakami): i have no further items to add
[2014/08/17 10:04:11] Lilith Ivory: format means the questions we are gonna ask right?
[2014/08/17 10:04:38] Rosie Gray: yes I think so
[2014/08/17 10:04:55] Rosie Gray: and anything else re those meetings we want to standardize
[2014/08/17 10:05:05] Lilith Ivory: very good
[2014/08/17 10:05:14] Rosie Gray: ㋡
[2014/08/17 10:05:57] Rosie Gray: so, if there are no other items, let's discuss the survey
[2014/08/17 10:06:08] Rosie Gray: maybe Widget can give her thoughts first?
[2014/08/17 10:06:10] Lilith Ivory: ok
[2014/08/17 10:09:02] Rosie Gray: okay Widget is doing a little analysing first
[2014/08/17 10:09:17] Rosie Gray: first impressions, Pat, LIl?
[2014/08/17 10:09:19] Pat (patroklus.murakami) /me is reading the results too...
[2014/08/17 10:10:16] Pat (patroklus.murakami): on question 1, opinion seems pretty split between the options
[2014/08/17 10:10:19] Lilith Ivory: can we say it looks like the mayority wants to have a mostly land Sim?
[2014/08/17 10:10:47] Rosie Gray: yes I think that's fair to say Lil
[2014/08/17 10:11:01] Widget Whiteberry: Yes, if we combine agree with strongly agreee, then 60% want mostly land
[2014/08/17 10:11:06] Pat (patroklus.murakami): there\s a marginally higher support for a land-based sim but several options are tied - water/new world/no new sim
[2014/08/17 10:12:07] Lilith Ivory: we should keep the idea of having a Sim elsewhere in mind indeed
[2014/08/17 10:12:14] Widget Whiteberry: while 60% want a mostly land sim, no where near that number want to expand their own holdings
[2014/08/17 10:12:36] Rosie Gray /me nods
[2014/08/17 10:12:38] Widget Whiteberry: eslsewhere. but not instead
[2014/08/17 10:12:44] Lilith Ivory /me has not red so far yet but was concerned about this too
[2014/08/17 10:13:24] Rosie Gray: 61% agree or strongly agree to adding a mostly land region
[2014/08/17 10:13:39] Pat (patroklus.murakami): tbh i think you could take qn 2 as justification for any course of action! new land sim. or a combo of new land and water. or a new SL sim and one someone else. or not doing anything!
[2014/08/17 10:13:46] Widget Whiteberry: Do either of you happen to know how many people cast a vote on the referendum?
[2014/08/17 10:13:51] Rosie Gray: 34% agree or strongly agree to a mostly water region
[2014/08/17 10:14:17] Rosie Gray: so clearly there is a strong draw for a mostly land region (between those two options)
[2014/08/17 10:14:26] Pat (patroklus.murakami): but rose that discoutns the views of people who disagree or strongly disagree
[2014/08/17 10:14:32] Pat (patroklus.murakami): *rosie
[2014/08/17 10:14:42] Lilith Ivory: hmm don´t we have the election results somewhere - I think it was written at this page too
[2014/08/17 10:14:50] Pat (patroklus.murakami): i've been looking at the average ratings which take that into account too
[2014/08/17 10:14:53] Widget Whiteberry: brb
[2014/08/17 10:14:54] Rosie Gray: yes I think so Lil
[2014/08/17 10:15:16] Pat (patroklus.murakami): about 65 voted in the referendum. i forget the exact figures
[2014/08/17 10:15:48] Lilith Ivory: and the majority wanted to have a new Sim
[2014/08/17 10:15:54] Rosie Gray: yes
[2014/08/17 10:16:31] Rosie Gray: okay, 13.64% either strongly disagree or disagree about adding a mostly land region
[2014/08/17 10:16:46] Rosie Gray: and 31.82% either strongly disagree or disagree about adding a mostly water region
[2014/08/17 10:17:15] Pat (patroklus.murakami): the three most popular choices, in aggregate, were 'add a new land', 'add new water' and 'add new SL region and an outpost elsewhere'
[2014/08/17 10:17:42] Pat (patroklus.murakami): 3.7, 3.0 and 3.0 respectively
[2014/08/17 10:17:47] Lilith Ivory: for me this looks like we should build a mostly land Sim now as we need to make a decission I think
[2014/08/17 10:18:44] Rosie Gray: there is also the issue of who said they would be interested in adding new parcels to their land holdings, vs. those that had no interest in that, or wanted to trade rather than acquire more
[2014/08/17 10:18:58] Pat (patroklus.murakami): well we could add more than one. i think this would justify us adding a land sim, a water sim and outpost in a new world!
[2014/08/17 10:19:16] Rosie Gray /me wonders if Pat is looking at the same results as she is
[2014/08/17 10:19:25] Rosie Gray: lol
[2014/08/17 10:19:30] Lilith Ivory: adding Sims is easy but filling them might become a problem (again)
[2014/08/17 10:19:39] Pat (patroklus.murakami): it probably does not justify doing nothing or only opening a sim elsewhere
[2014/08/17 10:19:59] Pat (patroklus.murakami): rosie, are you looking at the average scores at the end of the table?
[2014/08/17 10:20:06] Rosie Gray: yes
[2014/08/17 10:20:13] Rosie Gray: I'm looking at all
[2014/08/17 10:20:37] Pat (patroklus.murakami): so, i'm just considering qn 2 for now
[2014/08/17 10:20:49] Pat (patroklus.murakami): there are three clear leaders and two less popular options
[2014/08/17 10:22:29] Pat (patroklus.murakami): i think those could justify a new land sim, a new water sim and an outpost elsewhere. the next qns are 'what can we deliver?' and 'what will sell?'
[2014/08/17 10:22:46] Rosie Gray: I think we need to consider all the questions/answers
[2014/08/17 10:22:55] Lilith Ivory: I agree
[2014/08/17 10:23:27] Rosie Gray: question 3 shows only 20.83% would acquire more parcels
[2014/08/17 10:23:32] Rosie Gray: that's not very high
[2014/08/17 10:24:07] Rosie Gray: that's only 10 people
[2014/08/17 10:24:28] Pat (patroklus.murakami): surely we would expect most of the people buying land in the new sim to be new people?
[2014/08/17 10:24:44] Rosie Gray: that would be ideal ㋡
[2014/08/17 10:25:08] Rosie Gray: and good point
[2014/08/17 10:25:18] Widget Whiteberry: back and catching up
[2014/08/17 10:25:23] Lilith Ivory: 10 people who are willing to support a new Sim and others trying to invite new people does not sound bad to me
[2014/08/17 10:25:26] Pat (patroklus.murakami): 17 said they invite friends to buy a parcel
[2014/08/17 10:25:40] Rosie Gray /me nods
[2014/08/17 10:25:43] Lilith Ivory: as we won´t get broke if the Sim needs some time to fill
[2014/08/17 10:25:45] Pat (patroklus.murakami): it's a better answer than for the water parcel idea
[2014/08/17 10:26:01] Rosie Gray: wb, Widget
[2014/08/17 10:26:07] Lilith Ivory: wb Widget
[2014/08/17 10:26:39] Pat (patroklus.murakami): q6 is interesting. ppl don't want to pay for sailing it would seem
[2014/08/17 10:26:57] Rosie Gray: it's pretty specialized
[2014/08/17 10:27:14] Pat (patroklus.murakami): q7 shows little support for buying water parcels too
[2014/08/17 10:27:20] Lilith Ivory: I am one of those as I know a homestead with 4-5 parcels and water can support itself
[2014/08/17 10:27:35] Lilith Ivory: and I´m not into sailing lol
[2014/08/17 10:27:56] Rosie Gray: I'm not either, but I don't mind the idea of a mostly water sim
[2014/08/17 10:28:12] Rosie Gray: not sure I want to pay for someone else's sailing though
[2014/08/17 10:28:15] Pat (patroklus.murakami): q8 shows little support for buying into a new grid too.... (
[2014/08/17 10:28:31] Lilith Ivory: I don´t mind that idea either but there are ways to get it without all of us having to pay more
[2014/08/17 10:28:33] Widget Whiteberry: Lilith, does it follow from that that if we had 5 people who would buy n that we could add a water sim? and is a homestead sim sufficient for saiing?
[2014/08/17 10:29:08] Widget Whiteberry: I would have a parcel on a mostly water sim.... and I'm not a sailor
[2014/08/17 10:29:18] Rosie Gray: good point about 1 homestead sim being enough for sailing
[2014/08/17 10:29:30] Lilith Ivory: New Toulouse had a homestead Sim with 4 or 5 parcels on little islands and the resiudents there had to pay only a little more than on the main Sims
[2014/08/17 10:29:36] Lilith Ivory: like on Monastery
[2014/08/17 10:29:41] Rosie Gray: I would think the serious sailors like to go where there is a lot of water
[2014/08/17 10:29:44] Lilith Ivory: those parcels were always sold out
[2014/08/17 10:29:53] Widget Whiteberry: Pat, I think we deal with new grid by having a parcel rather than a whole sim
[2014/08/17 10:29:55] Rosie Gray: that's interesting Lil
[2014/08/17 10:30:17] Lilith Ivory: I am sure Miz Gabi would tell us more detail about how it was done
[2014/08/17 10:30:33] Lilith Ivory: I lived on that water Sim for a while and loved it
[2014/08/17 10:30:51] Rosie Gray: ㋡
[2014/08/17 10:31:03] Pat (patroklus.murakami): one of the comments talks about extending LA with a water sim. it would make it more of a point to have a water parcel in LA since right now you can't really sail anywhere!
[2014/08/17 10:31:04] Widget Whiteberry: We could have used a question asking if people preferred parcels that border water
[2014/08/17 10:31:30] Rosie Gray: most people like parcels bordering water, I think
[2014/08/17 10:32:08] Lilith Ivory: looks like it
[2014/08/17 10:32:13] Widget Whiteberry: well, I* do.... but I'd love to know what 50 people think... maybe it's a question for the forums and for a public meeting
[2014/08/17 10:32:40] Rosie Gray: we can add that to the list of questions we ask in our in-world meetings
[2014/08/17 10:32:43] Lilith Ivory: the preferences for a Sim in the mountains might be different .)
[2014/08/17 10:32:46] Widget Whiteberry: btw, is (name removed for privacy) a citizen now?
[2014/08/17 10:33:04] Rosie Gray: I don't know
[2014/08/17 10:33:09] Lilith Ivory: me neither
[2014/08/17 10:33:09] Rosie Gray: checking the land transfers
[2014/08/17 10:33:36] Widget Whiteberry: we had a few respondants who were not on the July census
[2014/08/17 10:34:37] Leslie Allandale: entered chat range (3.51 m).
[2014/08/17 10:34:42] Rosie Gray: we said they had to be 'current citizens'
[2014/08/17 10:34:49] Rosie Gray: hi Les
[2014/08/17 10:34:51] Pat (patroklus.murakami): hi leslie
[2014/08/17 10:34:57] Widget Whiteberry: yes, I was just using it as a point of reference
[2014/08/17 10:35:00] Leslie Allandale: Hi Rosie.
[2014/08/17 10:35:02] Leslie Allandale: Hi all
[2014/08/17 10:35:09] Lilith Ivory: Hi Les
[2014/08/17 10:38:50] Leslie Allandale: left chat range.
[2014/08/17 10:39:34] Rosie Gray: I can't seem to find (name removed for privacy) land transfers
[2014/08/17 10:39:57] Lilith Ivory: is it a big problem if he slipped in?
[2014/08/17 10:40:16] Rosie Gray: we said only current citizens
[2014/08/17 10:40:17] Widget Whiteberry: we would want to remove his survey from the set
[2014/08/17 10:40:26] Lilith Ivory /me nods
[2014/08/17 10:40:38] Rosie Gray: anyone know where his parcel is?
[2014/08/17 10:40:39] Lilith Ivory: we´d need to ask someone to check the hippo list maybe
[2014/08/17 10:41:31] Pat (patroklus.murakami): we could ask sudane to check when he bought a parcel
[2014/08/17 10:41:58] Rosie Gray: yes we could... but if we can just verify through the land changes and go look at his Hippo, that would be more expedient
[2014/08/17 10:42:06] Widget Whiteberry: (Name removed for privacy) was also not on the July Census, but I think you all know him
[2014/08/17 10:42:37] Rosie Gray: I don't think I know him
[2014/08/17 10:43:08] Rosie Gray: you do?
[2014/08/17 10:43:13] Lilith Ivory: sounds somehow familiar
[2014/08/17 10:43:24] Rosie Gray: his name is familiar to me as well
[2014/08/17 10:43:25] Pat (patroklus.murakami): i know the name
[2014/08/17 10:43:44] Pat (patroklus.murakami): should we spend time trying to verify citizens now though? might take up a lot of our time
[2014/08/17 10:44:23] Lilith Ivory: (name removed for privacy) is not even in the CDS group
[2014/08/17 10:45:41] Pat (patroklus.murakami): just one point on the survey, the comments have a date and time attached so could be used to identify particular avatar's views. i think that should be removed
[2014/08/17 10:46:04] Widget Whiteberry: he crashed or logged, I'll watch for him
[2014/08/17 10:47:55] Widget Whiteberry: so where are we?
[2014/08/17 10:48:21] Rosie Gray: well I was looking for (name removed for privacy's) name on the land transfers
[2014/08/17 10:48:29] Rosie Gray: but maybe that's not his name
[2014/08/17 10:48:30] Pat (patroklus.murakami): i was saying the survey needs to have personal data removed before it's published
[2014/08/17 10:48:49] Pat (patroklus.murakami): or people's views will made available to everyone
[2014/08/17 10:48:52] Rosie Gray: why Pat?
[2014/08/17 10:48:53] Widget Whiteberry: yes, agreed... re publishing
[2014/08/17 10:48:59] Pat (patroklus.murakami): and some will have seen it as private
[2014/08/17 10:48:59] Rosie Gray: we didn't do that before
[2014/08/17 10:49:01] Lilith Ivory: I agree
[2014/08/17 10:49:03] Widget Whiteberry: though you can't see wwho voted how
[2014/08/17 10:49:12] Pat (patroklus.murakami): no, but you can see how made which comment
[2014/08/17 10:49:16] Lilith Ivory: looks like a lot of people are sensitive about that
[2014/08/17 10:49:17] Rosie Gray: right, you can't tell who made comments
[2014/08/17 10:49:30] Widget Whiteberry: hmm actually you can infer
[2014/08/17 10:49:30] Pat (patroklus.murakami): you can by looking at the date and time they were made
[2014/08/17 10:49:34] Rosie Gray: well, if you think we should
[2014/08/17 10:49:47] Widget Whiteberry: good idea to strip names from the responses
[2014/08/17 10:49:50] Rosie Gray: I dont see anything contentious
[2014/08/17 10:50:04] Rosie Gray: but if you all think so, agreed ㋡
[2014/08/17 10:50:05] Widget Whiteberry: it's a matter of principle
[2014/08/17 10:50:08] Pat (patroklus.murakami): there are some which are. they mention individual avatars for example
[2014/08/17 10:50:15] Lilith Ivory: I think it should be kept private wo answered the survey (and who did not)
[2014/08/17 10:50:23] Pat (patroklus.murakami): and their nefarious plans :0
[2014/08/17 10:50:29] Pat (patroklus.murakami): mwuhahaha
[2014/08/17 10:51:34] Pat (patroklus.murakami): was the purpose of the survey to enable us to make an unambiguous recommendation to the RA on next steps for a new sim?
[2014/08/17 10:51:41] Rosie Gray: I've gone back to January and still don't see (name removed for privacy)
[2014/08/17 10:51:53] Widget Whiteberry: it was to help us think
[2014/08/17 10:51:56] Rosie Gray: yes, I would say so Pat
[2014/08/17 10:52:12] Widget Whiteberry: and does suggest some questions for public meetings
[2014/08/17 10:52:30] Lilith Ivory: yes
[2014/08/17 10:52:44] Pat (patroklus.murakami): yes. as the survey results require some interpretation. they are not unambiguous
[2014/08/17 10:53:06] Rosie Gray: and we may find clarification through our inworld meetings
[2014/08/17 10:53:19] Widget Whiteberry: and on the forum
[2014/08/17 10:53:48] Rosie Gray: I'm not sure about the forum
[2014/08/17 10:53:54] Rosie Gray: what does everyone else think?
[2014/08/17 10:54:24] Widget Whiteberry: what's your hesitation about, Rosie?
[2014/08/17 10:54:29] Rosie Gray: well
[2014/08/17 10:54:34] Pat (patroklus.murakami): i think we should use the forums too
[2014/08/17 10:54:38] Rosie Gray: not very many people use the forums
[2014/08/17 10:54:58] Pat (patroklus.murakami): if all we get is garbage, nm. but there's the possiblity of a sensible debate/discussion
[2014/08/17 10:55:03] Rosie Gray: only the same group of people... and I think it might skew what the majority thinks
[2014/08/17 10:55:44] Lilith Ivory: we have to be careful not to get lost in endless talks again as we need to get something done too
[2014/08/17 10:55:47] Widget Whiteberry: we'll want to post logs of public meetings, so why not start some threads to ask for clarifiction. We could wait till afte the public meetings
[2014/08/17 10:56:03] Leslie Allandale: entered chat range (3.20 m).
[2014/08/17 10:56:23] Rosie Gray: hi Les
[2014/08/17 10:56:26] Pat (patroklus.murakami): i think you need to post to the forums first so people have a chance to read the survey results. once this transcript is posted, people will start talking
[2014/08/17 10:56:49] Widget Whiteberry: oh Les, good!
[2014/08/17 10:56:54] Lilith Ivory: I agree the results should get posted
[2014/08/17 10:56:59] Pat (patroklus.murakami): i don't think a forum discussion can be avoided. if people post nonsense well, that's their business
[2014/08/17 10:57:14] Rosie Gray: yes I suppose you are right about that Pat
[2014/08/17 10:57:42] Widget Whiteberry: the forums are very helpful for getting a fuller picture of who people are and how they think
[2014/08/17 10:57:54] Rosie Gray: so we are agreed to remove the names of people, and post the survey results on the forum
[2014/08/17 10:58:09] Pat (patroklus.murakami): and the time and date of their comments
[2014/08/17 10:58:29] Pat (patroklus.murakami): (as that identifies them)
[2014/08/17 10:58:52] Rosie Gray: just removing the names is enough, because there is no reference then
[2014/08/17 10:58:54] Lilith Ivory: I agree
[2014/08/17 10:59:00] Pat (patroklus.murakami): no rosie
[2014/08/17 10:59:20] Pat (patroklus.murakami): if you leave the times in ppl can infer who made waht commetn by matching them across qns
[2014/08/17 10:59:27] Rosie Gray: well... what I mean is removing question 1
[2014/08/17 10:59:28] Pat (patroklus.murakami): they are no longer anonymous that way
[2014/08/17 10:59:33] Pat (patroklus.murakami): no
[2014/08/17 10:59:59] Pat (patroklus.murakami): if i cross refernce qn 3 and qn 4 (or whatever) i can identify who made what comment