Notes on Sim Commission: Meeting 1, held Sunday, August 31, 8 am SLT
(These notes are compiled by Leslie Allandale who kindly volunteered to do so for all of these meetings. Only the extraneous "hello's" were edited out to make it easier to follow the discussion.)
[08:01] Attending (Attendees are noted in italics. Late-comers noted at approximate times of arrival):
StarLight, as a guest
Gaius Tiberius Curio
[08:02] Rosie Gray: so, let's get started has everyone received a notecard? few housekeeping things before we start Leslie will be taking the notes and writing them up afterwards so please be aware that this meeting is recorded next, we will work through the questions on the notecard... let's try to keep on topic and not drift off too much
[08:06] Rosie Gray: It is the mandate of this committee to make recommendations to the RA on what new sim or sims we should add to the CDS, and what that theme and placement should be. We will base these recommendations on the findings of the commission through the survey already conducted, and these in-world meetings.
Summary of New Sim Survey Results
So far, with our survey, some patterns have emerged:
1. A majority continues to desire adding a sim of some sort, mostly land, but a desire for water (though not a water sim) is not insignificant.
[08:07] Rosie Gray: 2. Almost all respondents would use a land sim in one manner or other, though no activities dominate.
3. As a theme, everything is mentioned, though most are against a Roman theme (54%), and French was
mentioned 4 times (17%).
4, A generally (not historical) European master plan, with sims being centered on individual countries would appear to fit the sensibilities of most respondents.
5. Land Use was split, however not many preferred commercial/conference space.
[08:07] Rosie Gray: Questions for this meeting:
6. A referendum during the last election showed strong support for a new region; however, changes announced subsequently by Linden Labs may have affected people’s desire to expand. What is your current opinion on this?
[08:09] Gaius Tiberius Curio (guillaume.mistwalker): I think that we should be cautious of plans that are too grand, but if we are facing "The End" then I think that one sim will suit us well as a way to 'top off' CDS's history
[08:11] Pip Torok: a good implementation of Gui/Tor/Pip wd be the continuation of NFS city if were are going for one sim only to top off .. how about Timo's plan for an extended NFS .. its well advanced ... done
[08:14] Widget Whiteberry: I've heard some interesting thinking from Calli on some inexpensive water sims which I think would be a great addition
[08:16] Leslie Allandale: Just for the record I see no reason not to put in a new sim Then it would be good to fill in the rectangle and that a sim that added both highland and ocean front is possible.
[08:17] Rosie Gray: 7. If CDS adds a new – mostly land – region, what are you most likely to do?
[08:18] Lilith Ivory: I only wanted to say that I still would like to get a new Sim too but for me it is most important to plan it carefully, even if it takes a little longer
[08:22] CLEOPATRA Xigalia: I know of no reason that because of the Linden lab announcement we should stop any plan, slow down or be more reluctant to grow at the rate that is set by demand. So that even though the answers you have show some indication of SOmE peopels desires
that being said, I do want to have a s many new sims as the demand will I know of no reason that because of the Linden lab announcement we should stop any plan, slow down or be more reluctant to grow at the rate that is set by demand. that being said, I do want to have a s many new sims as the demand will allow and se no reason to MOVE SLOWLY
[08:24] Rosie Gray: 7. If CDS adds a new – mostly land – region, what are you most likely to do?
[08:25] Gaius Tiberius Curio (guillaume.mistwalker): As I answered on the survey that was passed around, I would likely buy a new house. But, considering the public land can be shaped and be made into a communal and social area, it depends. On the topic of NFS W, Tor has proposed a ski resort and I have proposed an airport -- so I think those possibilities are interesting!
[08:30] Tor Karlsvalt: I am at my limit of 8 parcels so do not plan to buy another parcel. But I expect I
would enjoy using any public land for walking, chatting and welcome any new people it might draw.
[08:31] CLEOPATRA Xigalia: I did not answer the survey so i totally would buy new parcels to the limit i am allowed and bring as many new citizens to CDS as i possibly can , and also try to get everyone else in CDS to bring as many new people. As well as do that i will encourage the government to do outreach in a way that would work, using avenues not used now to reach out to the grid at large to promote CDS. I would encourage the RA to now buy a sim and let it be used ASAP for the 10th anniversary celebrations
[08:33] Catz Jewell Lane (catz.jewell): Well, I would love to own land on the new sim: I also think that there needs to be a place for holding events.
[08:35] Cadence Theas: I am happy with my properties in NSF, and would not buy any more, but.. one of the things that was brought up in the survey whic is a fascinating idea and also has memories of Cedar Island: is to establish an educational institution we have a lot of professionas and people doing interesting things and research it could also be a place to incorporporate VS for example
[08:37] Rosie Gray: for the record... for me it would depend on what the sim was... the theme etc., as I
am at the most land I can afford now
[08:37] Rosie Gray: 8. If CDS adds a mostly land region, do you have preferences regarding theme?
[08:38] Gaius Tiberius Curio (guillaume.mistwalker): And it can back up Cadence's idea for professional meeting spacer I'd like to see a colonial era North American sim — it can include English, German, French, and other colonial inspired buildings in a modern setting. Admittedly, this only works in woodlands primarily (like an NFS W) But it would provide for some of the ideas other citizens. Halls from the revolutionary US, French themes from New France/Québec...
[08:40] Catz Jewell Lane (catz.jewell): I like that idea. Gaius
[08:41] CLEOPATRA Xigalia: I think that Cadence's idea to have an educational institution, with many professions being able to use it , with people doing interesting things and research, .. as well as Virtually Speaking being incorportated is a great idea.
[08:41] Tor Karlsvalt: I would prefer Neufreistadt East, with a different name probably, but naturally alpine similar to AM. done
[08:43] Lilith Ivory: I´d love to see us working with Timos plan to close the hole between Monastery and
[08:43] Lilith Ivory: NFS [08:44] Tor Karlsvalt: /nods [08:44] Rosie Gray nods [08:44] Pip Torok agrees [08:44] Sudane Erato: agrees [08:44] Cadence Theas agrees
[08:44] Ludo Merit raises hand [08:44] Widget Whiteberry agrees [08:44] CLEOPATRA Xigalia: nods [08:45] Tor Karlsvalt nods
[08:45] Ceasar Xigalia:
[08:45] Rosie Gray: for me that's the main part of it I'd like to see too, is filling in that hole with a suitable theme that blends with both NFS and Monastery
[08:46] Ludo Merit: I was wondering if NFS west could be called University of NFS and be devoted to residence, education and event areas.
[08:48] Rosie Gray: I think that an educational facitily is an interesting idea too, but I'd hesitate to devote too much space unless we had a committed educational group of some kind willing to pay some tier on it
[08:49] Cadence Theas: it could be a multi-functional space with a few dedicated areas for education and exhibition
[08:49] Pip Torok: we need to ensure enough academic personnel done
[08:50] CLEOPATRA Xigalia: the theme for a mostly land sim i think would be something like Ludo and Cadence say that is educational, and i think there are many many ways to fund that ... one idea is to have dormotory style very small houses surrounding where citizens can reside many of them very inexpesively
[08:50] Cadence Theas: like a university town
[08:50] CLEOPATRA Xigalia: but giving some teir .. sort of like NFS yes and also let people donate or have ways that they can Pay for a parcel but not use it as philanthropy sort of just to say there are many ideas of ways to fund, e xoploring that is useful at some point. we can do it. Education is a thing i think we do need to support.
[08:53] Gaius Tiberius Curio (guillaume.mistwalker): I like CLEO's idea for small dormitory-like housing (perhaps because I currently live in a dorm!) It would be nice to have that sort of idea for NFS E though, following Timo's plan for it, where the library can also be connected to a college or university
[08:54] Tor Karlsvalt: I also like Timo's plan. I think smaller parcels and housing is best left for NFS East, as with Timo's plan. I believe he includes a large library as a public space for NFS East. The west should follow Timo's plan more like AM. Regarding a University, that is good, but I would like a group dedicated to supporting it.
[08:56] Widget Whiteberry agrees
[08:56] Tor Karlsvalt: I think sudane can tell us how well collection bowls in the Kirche work for funding the Kirche. I wager few in CDS donate.
[08:57] Sudane Erato: the collection bowls bring in very little... sometimes 100 or 150 in a month... usually noting
[08:58] Rosie Gray: I agree with what Tor said about a group for any dedicated educational facility... we can't just expect them to miraculously appear and pay tier but I think something like a public library could be used for that and be a nice public building for multi use too
[09:01] Ludo Merit: I think that some people might pay tier to have an educational facility on NFS West if it's a university. I would buy a parcel and put my two educational projects on it.Then there's a Timo proposal that I'm not aware of. Thank you. I would find NFS West, which I think should come next, far more interesting with an educational theme.
[09:02] Ceasar Xigalia: I agree with Cadence and Ludo for a university town, with small housing. Its worked well in NFS
[09:04] Widget Whiteberry: I just want to say that for people with an urge to build, small parcels don't doo
[09:04] CLEOPATRA Xigalia: ok small parcels have always sold very well in CDS. they keep us alive when other things dont having a mix is needed yes widget so what i will say is this .. i think we actually need to get both sims soon because we need land that is big and small, public and privately owned.
regarding the library. Just as The Kirche does not drain CDS of resources.it is a space used to enhance NFS and all of the CDS. . just like the library will do .. i think the Govt should maintain control of the Library NOT allowing any one group to have the space and control it, but rather being something that anyone can use and we can keep open for use and draw others in to get people involved and keep a variety of things.. going on in CDS. When a group owns things i see that it stays closed to only that group. When the Government owns it we can keep it open for diverse uses.. I think we do not want to lock it down to one group. If there is a group that wants the library space, let them buy a parcel and build a library on it.
[09:07] Lilith Ivory: I wanted to say that NFS E was better for smaller parcels while NFS W is more for the bigger ones, but that has been said already
[09:08] Michel Manen: Thank you. Nice to see old friends I have four quick points to make: 1. What does this community need most? Since citizenship remains tied to land ownership, it needs a beautiful residential sim, where new citizens themselves could build their own houses or buy appropriate designs specified by the administration. 2. Where does it need it? I was walking yesterday on the edge of NFS, AM and Monastery and it seems filling in the space between the three would provide an ideal location with stunning views. It would also complete the famous road and bridge to the Abyss in NFS. 3. What theme would be most appropriate? This would mean Germanic themed mountain village theme to fit in with all three sims I mentioned above. I thought about places like Laufenburg, Interlaken, Zell an See. What special uses should it cater to? If the sim will be placed in that spot, it will be within easy reach of both Schloss and monastery, with a lot of public meeting spaces. I don’t think it will need a huge amount of public space. It should be left to the local community to develop its own unique identity and activities organically, rather than prescribe it from the start by administrative fiat..
[09:11] Tor Karlsvalt: First I agree with Lilith, a large number of small parcels belong in NFS E, not the W. However, as Michel suggests. We could have a small hamlet in a corner of NFS W. It would be an improvement of the mews now situated in AM. For he most part is should look like he Valley or rural AM.
[09:13] Rosie Gray: and I think that we should have a focal point, whatever we do... not just a residential sim without focus
[09:13] Pip Torok: agree
[09:13] Lilith Ivory nods
[09:14] Rosie Gray: so something like a ski chalet, or even a period style airport with vintage planes might work for that
[09:14] Rosie Gray: either of those might bring in new people who are interested in those things
[09:14] Tor Karlsvalt nods
[09:15] Rosie Gray: I think if we had a vintage airiport, we would charge hangar fees, and we'd have to designate landing places in the other sims (or not, as the case may be), but it could give us this focal point and an additional activity
[09:15] CLEOPATRA Xigalia: it sounds that as this plan is developing we need to go ahead and buy E and W together and develop both of them... make sure they are unified, it will be our opportunity now to do that .. otherwise they may get lost in the delevelopment and time .. So i propose that we go ahead and buy both of the sims and develop them together as you are doing I think whatever theme we do now it will fill up quickly because CDS is very popular because of the community and what we have that is so unique. I love all the ideas about themes. i want them all ! done.
[09:18] Rosie Gray: 9. If CDS adds a mostly land region, do you have preferences regarding features?
[09:19] Tor Karlsvalt: ok, well, a hiking trail over the mountain to Monastery, mtn stream, a proper ski run.
[09:20] Gaius Tiberius Curio (guillaume.mistwalker): I would like to see a period airport available in a new sim, particularly NFS W.
[09:21] Lilith Ivory: I would also include riding trails as I know peole owning horses are always looking for nice estates to ride them
[09:22] Michel Manen: if you look at successful developments that have expanded into dynamic and active communities, like Caledon, the modus operandi has usually been to provide new citizens an outlet for their own interests rather than presuming from the start to define the identity of a community without knowing who the people will be and what they will care about. Remember the sim is only a virtual setting for real people. They must be interested to log in and be there. And that will only happen if they know they can do something fun and useful with people they like to be with. No one can decide that in advance for them. NFS and Monastery have already amazing public spaces. What NFS needs is new citizens. Build a beautiful setting, let them create its special use and give it soul – and they will come.
[09:25] Penelope Gossamer: I'd like to see some sort of water feature be it a waterfall,lake or river. Whatever features are added, we need to consider the impact on existing citizens. I can just imagine a plane crashing into our homes lol
[09:24] Rosie Gray: then... moving on: 10 If you purchased a parcel in the new Sim, how would you prefer it to look like (lake/river front, mountain view etc)
[09:26] Pip Torok: like [email protected] lovers' Waterfall ...
[09:26] CLEOPATRA Xigalia: I was dive bombed by planes in CDS before, by a griefer !
[09:26] Rosie Gray: well, we'd have to have laws and rules if we had an airport, naturally ㋡
[09:26] CLEOPATRA Xigalia: nods
[09:26] Gaius Tiberius Curio (guillaume.mistwalker) nods
[09:26] Tor Karlsvalt rolls his eyes.
[09:28] Rosie Gray: 11. A new mostly water region would likely require increase in tier for everyone. Would you be willing to pay a share of expenses for a recreational water region?
[09:28] Pip Torok: we all have individual prefs .. mine are river-fronting, mountain-views
[09:29] Soro (soro.dagostino): And get some racing done. Rent out the Islands –
[09:32] CLEOPATRA Xigalia: I actually agree totally with you soro, i think we can do the sims with water around the L A part and make the islands there .. and people would pay to be there. i believe we can make that work, and i have actually seen plans for this done by citizens that make financial sense. Though, soro you will have to send that plan to the RA b
[09:31] Rosie Gray: can we have everyone here just say a simple yes or no to this question? 11.
[09:32] Lilith Ivory: no
[09:32] Leslie Allandale: Yes
[09:32] Tor Karlsvalt yes
[09:32] Penelope Gossamer: yes
[09:32] Pip Torok: no
[09:32] Lilith Ivory: (while I agree with Soro and Cleo)
[09:32] Ceasar Xigalia: yes
[09:32] Catz Jewell Lane (catz.jewell): would depend on how much
[09:32] Rosie Gray: maybe, for me
[09:33] Lilith Ivory: having a homestead with a few island for rent did work in other estates so I think we can have a water sim without raising the tier for all of us it would work like it works with monastery
[09:35] JerryDon Lane: The citizens pay their share of expenses via their tiers. No further expenses should be incurred by a Citizen of CDS. The government should be responsible enough to properly manage the regions out of the budgets alloted to them according to the amounts received in tier payments....And why is water more expensive to maintain than land? Isn't it all just textures and prims? done....thank you
[09:37] Tor Karlsvalt: I think islands will work to cover some of the cost, but I don't think most would buy and island and pay what a homestead costs so the rest of us can use the water. I suspect the sim would have to be subsidized in part. I would like more water, I think LA suffers to some extent not having more water, and yes I would not mind a tier increase to support a water sim. by the way look at Fruit islands, people do support water access, but all the residents do
[09:42] Catz Jewell Lane (catz.jewell): I love Water
[09:44] Lilith Ivory: I personally would like to do one step after the other. Develop NFS W first and after we have done that start thinking about getting a water homestead or developing NFS E
[09:45] Michel Manen: nods in agreement
[09:45] Lilith Ivory: depending on how fast we are able to fill NFS W [09:45] Widget Whiteberry nods in agreement
[09:45] Pip Torok: nods
[09:45] Soro (soro.dagostino): Concede
[09:45] Tor Karlsvalt nods
[09:46] Michel Manen: i agree with lilith. lets complete the empty space between NFS and Monastery and use the stunning views to attarct new people
[09:52] Widget Whiteberry: I wish we had asked how many people prefer a parcel that abuts Linden water. It's a strong preference for me.
The meeting was adjourned at 10:00 am slt.
Moderator: SC Moderators
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