The following is a transcript of the LUC meeting held Sunday, September 6, 2015 on the Locus Amoenus Quay. The meeting ran from about 8:10 AM SLT until 10:29 AM SLT.
Delia Lake, Shep Titian, Em Warden, Mizou Vavoom and Tor Karlsvalt were present.
A number of citizens were present.
Summary
The LUC first addressed routine business. The transcripts and summary of the last meeting were accepted. The LUC opted to consider a summary at the head of the transcripts to to suffice as minutes.
The LUC voted for Mizou Vavoom as Alternate Chairperson.
A good deal of the meeting included a discussion on the role of the LUC to inspect builds and objects in order to offer recommendations to the Chancellor. The LUC, per the commission’s establishment law CDSL 21-01, is charged with hiring inspectors. Per the law, the LUC voted to hire its own members as inspectors. In addition the LUC accepted the inspection guidelines as drawn up by Delia Lake. The guidelines are here: http://forums.slcds.info/viewtopic.php?f=69&t=7071
LUC members will use the inspection guidelines and report findings to the LUC by mid-October. Delia will check into the possibility of an LUC dropbox placed in the Praetorium.
Mizou and Rosie offered status on the Thermae and Praetorium projects. Mizou stated that texturing the Thermae is taking a long time. She is making some original textures for the project. Rosie is also still working on finishing the Praetorium. However the new Praetorium is now in place and was used by the RA for its meeting yesterday. Some texturing and furnishing issues remain. Rosie welcomed comments and suggestions. Naturally, prim counts were a major consideration with regard to furnishing.
The LUC finished with a discussion about the venue for its meetings. There was even support for moving around the estate and finding a set location. Currently, the idea of moving around the estate held sway.
The meeting happily just over two hours.
Transcript
Call to order of the meeting of the Land Use Commission at 8:08 am Sunday 06 September 2015
meeting is being recorded and the transcript will be posted on the Forum in the LUC announcements thread. By being here you are agreeing to be recorded
[08:10] Mizou Vavoom: Agree
[08:10] Delia Lake: does everyone have the proposed Agenda?
[08:11] Mizou Vavoom: Yes
[08:11] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): I agree
[08:12] Delia Lake: here comes Tor
[08:12] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): Tor just came online, but I will continue copying the chat
[08:12] Mizou Vavoom nods
[08:13:40] Delia Lake: first on the Agenda, I propose that we consider the summary at the head of our transcripts to be our meeting minutes for our past meeting and for all meetings of the LUC moving forward unless we vote to change that.
[08:13:42] Tor Karlsvalt: HI everyone
[08:13:51] Weimaraner Yakubu: Come help unskew the sex ratio, Tor!
[08:13:54] Delia Lake: Hi Tor
[08:13:56] Rosie Gray: hi everyone
[08:13:58] Weimaraner Yakubu: Oh crap.
[08:14:03] Shep (shep.titian): Hi Rosie 
[08:14:03] Delia Lake: hi Rosie
[08:14:08] Mizou Vavoom: Hi Rosie
[08:14:12] Weimaraner Yakubu: Hey, Rosie.
[08:14:49] Rosie Gray: okay if i drag over a chair and join you?
[08:14:59] Mizou Vavoom: i will do same
[08:15:11] Weimaraner Yakubu: please tak that one.
[08:15:16] Weimaraner Yakubu: *take
[08:15:26] Weimaraner Yakubu: Oh
[08:15:29] Weimaraner Yakubu: neat.
[08:15:35] Rosie Gray: oh thank you Weimaraner... it's okay I have one ㋡
[08:15:40] Delia Lake: repeat my proposal. I propose that we consider the summary at the head of our transcripts to be our meeting minutes for our past meeting and for all meetings of the LUC moving forward unless we vote to change that at a future time. Comments, other proposals, discussion, motion?
[08:16:19] Delia Lake: trying to get housekeeping handled asap
[08:16:39] Mizou Vavoom: Motion
[08:16:59] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): Second
[08:17:12] Delia Lake: all in favor?
[08:17:18] Tor Karlsvalt: aye
[08:17:25] Shep (shep.titian): aye
[08:17:28] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): Aye
[08:18:08] Delia Lake: Opposed?
[08:18:46] Delia Lake: Mizou are you voting?
[08:18:53] Mizou Vavoom: I did
[08:19:02] Mizou Vavoom: Maybe not the right word
[08:19:05] Delia Lake: ok
[08:19:16] Mizou Vavoom: aye
[08:19:26] Delia Lake: so the summary will now be our official minutes
[08:19:28] Soro (soro.dagostino) entered chat range (5.58 m).
[08:19:39] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): Hi Soro
[08:19:45] Mizou Vavoom: Hi Soro
[08:19:52] Delia Lake: moving on,. C. Vote to accept, or modify and accept, the minutes of the previous LUC meeting http://forums.slcds.info/viewtopic.php?f=67&t=7043
[08:20:39] Rosie Gray: hi soro
[08:20:42] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): I move that the minutes will be accepted
[08:20:48] Mizou Vavoom: second
[08:20:53] Delia Lake: I have 1 requested modification to the summary
[08:21:04] Delia Lake: just a sec
[08:21:10] Shep (shep.titian): Anyone have a seat for Soro?
[08:21:34] Shep (shep.titian): Ah lol
[08:22:20] Soro (soro.dagostino): Hello all
[08:22:32] Tor Karlsvalt: Hi Soro
[08:24:09] Delia Lake: re submitting the recommended modifications to the Friedsee plan. we said in the meeting we would submit to the Chancellor and give a copy to the RA but we did not in the transcript say anything about approval. that is probably not up to us so I think approval should be removed from the summary to reflect what is said in the transcript
[08:24:42] Delia Lake: the rest of everything looks good to me
[08:25:51] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): Important point to be considered
[08:26:07] Mizou Vavoom nods in agreement
[08:26:12] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): I agree with Delia here
[08:27:18] Delia Lake: Tor? Shep?
[08:27:51] Shep (shep.titian): Yes sounds good to me
[08:28:03] Tor Karlsvalt: Um, well the idea of approval was not in the transcripts but is in the first paragraph of the recommendation.
[08:28:55] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): In the summary to the transcript?
[08:29:25] Tor Karlsvalt: The recommendation points out that the plan is accepted by the RA.
[08:30:53] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): But the RA didn't seem to be aware of any document with recommendations to be approved
[08:31:05] Delia Lake: my thiought is that for people doing future searches of the transcripts that what is in the summary should be what is in the transcript because otherwise it is crazy making. Yes the plan was accepted by the RA but this is the summary of the meeting transcript
[08:33:51] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): How do we correct this?
[08:33:54] Tor Karlsvalt: Well seems we are belaboring a semantical issue. At the meeting we approved the recommendation that clearly stipulated that RA would need to approve the plan for Freedsee. I think we all assumed the recommendation would be before the RA.
[08:34:13] Carissima Tedeschi (carissima) entered chat range (18.61 m).
[08:34:36] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): Should we state in the summary for this meeting that the word "Approved" be disregarded in the last summary?
[08:34:44] Mizou Vavoom: Yes, we did.
[08:34:48] Delia Lake: it's not a big deal and I don't want to belabor the point.
[08:35:28] Tor Karlsvalt: perhaps in future bills and proposals should be read directly into the transcript.
[08:35:46] Delia Lake: we have a motion on the floor to accept the transcript so let's just vote on that
[08:35:56] Delia Lake: good idea, Tor
[08:36:02] Rosie Gray: hi Carissima
[08:36:09] Carissima Tedeschi (carissima): Hi
[08:36:11] Rosie Gray: come have a seat... I'll drag one over for you
[08:36:12] Mizou Vavoom: Hi Carissima
[08:36:21] Delia Lake: all in favor of accepting the transcript of the previous meeting?
[08:36:24] Carissima Tedeschi (carissima): Thanks, Rosie
[08:36:26] Mizou Vavoom: I vote
[08:36:32] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): Aye
[08:36:43] Tor Karlsvalt: aye
[08:37:18] Delia Lake: btw, according to the law the Chair doesn't vote unless to break a tie
[08:37:28] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): OK
[08:37:33] Mizou Vavoom understands
[08:37:41] Delia Lake: so transcript is accepted
[08:38:17] Delia Lake: next. D. Nominations for, and vote on person to fulfill the position of LUC alternate Chairperson
[08:38:41] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): I nominate Mizou
[08:38:41] Delia Lake: according to the law we need to elect an alternate Chair
[08:38:59] Delia Lake: second?
[08:39:45] Tor Karlsvalt: second
[08:39:52] Tor Karlsvalt: Mizou would be wonderful.
[08:39:55] Mizou Vavoom abstains as she cannot nominate herself
[08:40:06] Mizou Vavoom thanks Tor for the vote of confidence
[08:40:13] Rosie Gray: ㋡
[08:40:26] Delia Lake: all in favor of Mizou for alt Chair?
[08:40:43] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): Aye
[08:40:43] Tor Karlsvalt: aye
[08:41:12] Shep (shep.titian): Aye
[08:41:54] Delia Lake: congratulations and thank you, Mizou
[08:42:10] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): Congrats, Mizou
[08:42:15] Mizou Vavoom: Thank you and i will do my best in the chairs absence
[08:42:19] Rosie Gray: yay Mizou
[08:42:25] Mizou Vavoom:
[08:42:28] Delia Lake: housekeeping accomplished
[08:42:42] Tor Karlsvalt now wonders if Delia is planing a vacation.
[08:42:57] Mizou Vavoom hopes not in the near future
[08:43:01] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): Lol
[08:44:26] Shep (shep.titian): LOL
[08:45:12] Delia Lake: next we have been asked by the Chancellor to review the current regions. Cadence conveyed that request in our last meeting. In order to do that fairly and efficiently the LUC should have published guidelines regarding how this is done. We have a draft of some guidelines that is on google docs for us and on the Forum for anyone to read. next item on our agenda is
[08:45:50] Delia Lake: E. Discussion of and subsequent vote on “LUC guidelines for assessment of content, and condition of a CDS region and identification of issues”
[08:47:16] Tor Karlsvalt: the link is here, http://forums.slcds.info/viewtopic.php?f=69&t=7071
[08:47:47] Delia Lake: ty Tor
[08:48:17] Mizou Vavoom: I just have a question about (duplicate for each building reviewed), what is meant exactly?
[08:48:18] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): I must say that the "Building Quality" is a bit tricky
[08:48:40] Tor Karlsvalt nods
[08:48:56] Delia Lake: the floor is open for LUC members to comment, make modifications, add. gah lag!
[08:49:21] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): Yes, lag indeed
[08:49:43] Mizou Vavoom: Hmmm, for once i am lagless
[08:49:56] Em Warden (mothercard.warden):
[08:50:02] Tor Karlsvalt: I think as long as a build is within the covenant we have to be liberal regarding building quality. That can be so subjective.
[08:50:42] Delia Lake: what I think is meant for duplicate is that for every building reviewed for instance we'd duplicate that section #2
[08:51:27] Mizou Vavoom: ok
[08:52:05] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): For instance, in Monastery there are two parcels with no building on them, but some VERY ugly, non-realistic trees
[08:52:17] Delia Lake: yes I agree building quality is a subjective assessment. that may be what we are asked to do though so that the overall quality of our estate is attractive
[08:52:18] Mizou Vavoom:
[08:52:23] Mizou Vavoom: agreed
[08:52:34] Tor Karlsvalt nods
[08:52:53] Em Warden (mothercard.warden) whispers: I would like to offer some better trees to the owners, but where in the text do I get any support for that?
[08:52:55] Mizou Vavoom: In some cases we might need to ask a second opinion if not too sure
[08:53:03] Tor Karlsvalt: I suppose any assessment would be tempered by the views of this entire commission and the Chancellor.
[08:53:10] Mizou Vavoom: yes
[08:53:14] Mizou Vavoom: Yes to Tor
[08:53:47] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): I agree, Tor
[08:53:56] Shep (shep.titian): WE have to be careful not to alienate people
[08:54:08] Tor Karlsvalt nods
[08:54:14] Mizou Vavoom: yes Shep it is a very sensitive subject
[08:54:40] Shep (shep.titian): And as Delia said subjective
[08:55:08] Delia Lake: let me use buildings for an example to start. there are some excellent high quality low prim buildings on the marketplace today. there are also some low prim very old leftover buildings that are free or almost free with very poor textures and they are obviously nothing more than plywood boxes with cheap textures thrown on. do we want regions covered with those kinds of builds?
[08:55:30] Delia Lake: they may conform to the covenants but they are really ugly
[08:55:31] Mizou Vavoom: nope Delia
[08:55:40] Weimaraner Yakubu listens.
[08:56:06] Mizou Vavoom: There is a marked difference between the two type of builds that you described Delia and i presume that is one of our criteria
[08:56:53] Tor Karlsvalt: This is one of those things where one can't describe an old ugly build but knows it when one sees it.
[08:57:05] Mizou Vavoom nods
[08:57:21] Rosie Gray: ㋡
[08:57:22] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): Very true
[08:57:31] Delia Lake: when we are doing region reviews might it be a good idea to note those and then be able to speak with the owner in a fair and equitable way about the building? textures on the outside of private buildings is one of the areas that is designated our responsibility in the law as written
[08:57:37] Mizou Vavoom: and correct texture application is so important in a good quality build
[08:58:29] Tor Karlsvalt: Well we might have situations where a build is acceptable, but could be improved often without many changes.
[08:58:46] Mizou Vavoom hmmms
[08:59:28] Mizou Vavoom has some old builds with what she thought were small changes needed only to see more and more mistakes in the textures
[08:59:45] Delia Lake: my question re the guidelines is what do we have to include so that we can make recommendations to the owners and to the chancellor that are fair and that keep regions looking attractive at the same time
[09:00:25] Tor Karlsvalt nods
[09:00:25] Mizou Vavoom: Good texturing is a first in my opinion
[09:01:00] Tor Karlsvalt: Just for clarification, the idea her is that for every build, we will comment on each item and then offer recommendations.
[09:01:39] Shep (shep.titian): Could we advertise it as a service .. 'Keep your home up to date with the latest textures' apply to the LUC
[09:01:45] Mizou Vavoom: - Proportions of the build
[09:01:52] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): Does that apply only to buildings? Not to other unattractive objects on the parcels?
[09:02:29] Delia Lake: the guidelines should be just that. guidelines that we all follow in common so that if there are things that stick out on any region we have the information to start a productive discussion among ourselves and or with a plot owner or with the Chancellor
[09:02:32] Weimaraner Yakubu listens.
[09:02:49] Mizou Vavoom: Offering to retexture an old build is as much work as rebuilding it
[09:03:11] Delia Lake: buildings is 1 category item, landscaping is its own item
[09:03:14] Mizou Vavoom: it is time consuming and not to be taken lightly
[09:03:33] Shep (shep.titian): True
[09:03:39] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): I think you have a point there, Shep
[09:03:49] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): (Sorry, lag)
[09:04:06] Shep (shep.titian): But we can't just come at a problem from the negative
[09:04:10] Tor Karlsvalt: Isn't even the Chancellor constrained as to what can be done with any old violations if they when unchallenged more than 14 days?
[09:04:23] Tor Karlsvalt: went*
[09:04:26] Delia Lake: public infrastructure ia its own category item. so we need another additional category for Other?
[09:04:28] Shep (shep.titian): Yes Tor
[09:05:41] Tor Karlsvalt: I suspect that for at least this initial effort we will have to offer any recommendations in a good natured unbinding fashion.
[09:05:43] Delia Lake: what do we need to have as common guidelines in order to do our job fairly and effectively?
[09:05:51] Tor Karlsvalt: I agree
[09:06:19] Tor Karlsvalt: I can accept the guidelines.
[09:06:24] Mizou Vavoom: second
[09:07:40] Delia Lake: ready to vote? as we use our guidelines we can always make changes. this is a start. an internal LUC policy doc that everyone will know is being used
[09:08:01] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): Ready
[09:08:01] Weimaraner Yakubu: Who is eligible to vote?
[09:08:28] Delia Lake: LUC members are eligible to vote on this
[09:08:40] Weimaraner Yakubu nods.
[09:08:45] Delia Lake: all in favor?
[09:08:48] Mizou Vavoom: We will probably get a better idea on how to reword this when we have practiced the guidelines
[09:08:53] Shep (shep.titian): Ready Delia
[09:08:53] Mizou Vavoom: aye
[09:09:04] Tor Karlsvalt: aye
[09:09:06] Shep (shep.titian): Aye
[09:09:14] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): Aye
[09:09:38] Delia Lake: the LUC now has initial guidelines for reviewing regions. thank you.
[09:09:57] Tor Karlsvalt: yay
[09:10:19] Tor Karlsvalt only about a year after the creation of the LUC.
[09:10:26] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): Hehehe
[09:10:29] Mizou Vavoom:
[09:11:04] Tor Karlsvalt: Thanks Delia for your work on this.
[09:11:15] Mizou Vavoom: Yes thanks Delia
[09:11:19] Shep (shep.titian): I second that
[09:11:27] Delia Lake: so everyone will be clear, the LUC is a standing advisory committee. we make recommendations to the Chancellor and to the RA when asked to do so, or on our own submission to those government functions in order to fulfill what we are assigned to do in CDSL 21-01
[09:11:34] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): I applause the great work
[09:11:39] Delia Lake: you're all welcome
[09:11:52] Mizou Vavoom claps
[09:11:56] Soro (soro.dagostino): Woot!
[09:14:07] Delia Lake: We need to put out a schedule for these regional reviews, but before that, and reversing the order of the next 2 items on the agenda, we have to decide how we will "hire" inspectors, according to the law
[09:15:20] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): I think we should "hire" ourselves as a normal procedure, and hire others when we need some expertise we don't have, or if the time is too short
[09:15:22] Delia Lake: H. Regarding LUC responsibilities and powers, according to CDSL 21-01, http://portal.slcds.info/index.php/code-of-laws/
1. “SECTION IV: STRUCTURE. The commission shall select a chairperson and an alternate, who shall preside over meetings, without a vote, unless to decide a split decision, a secretary who shall keep minutes of the proceedings and inspectors who may be hired from the Commission or Citizenry-at-large, who will determine the conformity of all builds and uses, including complete regions, within the jurisdiction of CDS, either in Second Life, or other grids, as CDS establishes presence on them”
[09:15:36] Shep (shep.titian): Do you mean non citizen inspectors?
[09:16:24] Shep (shep.titian): Hmmm ok
[09:16:51] Delia Lake: there is no provision in the law for non citizen inspectors, Shep, not as it is written. I am inclined to think it is as Em just stated, that that was the intent of the law
[09:17:13] Delia Lake: but we should formalize that as policy
[09:17:21] Mizou Vavoom nods
[09:17:35] Shep (shep.titian): Seems a shame .. outsiders would have no bias
[09:18:35] Delia Lake: as we work through the term se can make a running list of possible amendments to the enabling law then suggest them for the next term
[09:18:47] Mizou Vavoom: agrees
[09:18:59] Shep (shep.titian): ok
[09:19:45] Delia Lake: other suggestions than what Em wrote? if now would someone put that into a motion please?
[09:20:35] Tor Karlsvalt: I motion that we hire the members of the LUC as inspectors.
[09:20:56] Mizou Vavoom: second
[09:21:07] Delia Lake: all in favor?
[09:21:11] Tor Karlsvalt: aye
[09:21:14] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): Aye
[09:21:16] Shep (shep.titian): I abstain
[09:22:13] Delia Lake: Mizou?
[09:22:17] Mizou Vavoom: aye
[09:24:16] Shep (shep.titian): Why are we voting for ourselves to do a job we were formed to dop
[09:24:35] Weimaraner Yakubu nods.
[09:24:37] Delia Lake: LUC members are now "hired" as inspectors. for the next meeting I suggest that we start drafting what we should want as very basic qualifications for hiring other inspectors from the citizenry. we don't need more now but might at sometime. best not to leave that to the last minute and best to make sure people know what the expectations are
[09:24:46] Shep (shep.titian): Plus voting on it is a conflict of interest
[09:24:54] Delia Lake: it's because of the way the law is written, Shep
[09:25:31] Delia Lake: it says "and inspectors who may be hired from the Commission or..."
[09:25:37] Shep (shep.titian): Maybe RA could alter it
[09:26:09] Tor Karlsvalt: I suppose they could.
[09:26:35] Delia Lake: and it makes sense to have provisions for non commission inspectors because no one would be inspecting a build they have made and therefore would have to recluse themselves.
[09:26:49] Mizou Vavoom agrees
[09:27:05] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): Maybe we should discuss what alterations of the LUC law would be advantageous, and make a recommendation as to those changes?
[09:27:23] Shep (shep.titian): I'm not against other inspectors
[09:27:46] Shep (shep.titian): It's simply the conflict of voting for ourselves
[09:27:49] Delia Lake: as an example, Rosie is almost done with our new Praetorium. Rosie is an excellent builder. in the previous term she was LUC Chair. she would not have been able to inspect her own build if she had done the Praetorium last term
[09:28:12] Mizou Vavoom:
[09:28:23] Shep (shep.titian): yes I understand that
[09:29:11] Shep (shep.titian): How many of us are needed to decide if something needs changing?
[09:29:40] Delia Lake: but you and Mizou for instance could conduct a review with no conflict of Rosie's guild
[09:29:50] Mizou Vavoom:
[09:30:06] Delia Lake: that is policy that is yet to be determined. how many of us for what
[09:31:18] Delia Lake: and part of the reason why guidelines that we all use are important. so the reviews will be fair and transparent
[09:31:52] Shep (shep.titian): If one of us sees a citizens home has some nonconformity .. do we tell them ourselves or bring it to committee
[09:32:12] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): To the Chancellor, in fact
[09:32:19] Shep (shep.titian): ok
[09:32:41] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): Delia would bring it to the Chancellor for us
[09:33:47] Delia Lake: my suggestion would be that we use the now passed guidelines to collect standard information. it would be more objective that way and people would know ahead of time that those are the review and assessment criteria
[09:34:49] Tor Karlsvalt: I agree
[09:34:51] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): But there will always be the issue that Tor mentioned earlier: it only applies to new buildings
[09:34:53] Mizou Vavoom: second
[09:35:31] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): Because the older ones have been "approved" because of time laps
[09:36:36] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): It can be hard to explain for newcomers...
[09:36:52] Mizou Vavoom: hmmmm yes agrees Em
[09:37:26] Delia Lake: my thought here is if there is an old build that is grandfathered but is really out of step with current technology and aesthetics, we might use the same guideline information as a way to gently talk with current residents or to help the Chancellor gently talk with current residents about possibly updating
[09:37:30] Mizou Vavoom: Maybe we need to have some common procedure
[09:37:48] Mizou Vavoom: ah ok
[09:38:20] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): Here SHep's suggestion would come in handy: To offer help with modernizing the textures etc.
[09:38:39] Tor Karlsvalt nods.
[09:38:41] Mizou Vavoom: Yes, but with reservations
[09:38:53] Shep (shep.titian): You have to give them something
[09:39:00] Mizou Vavoom: I reiterate that retexturing is hard work
[09:39:06] Delia Lake: yes. sometimes that's easy to do but sometimes as Mizou said it is a real bear of a job.
[09:39:13] Em Warden (mothercard.warden) nods
[09:39:15] Mizou Vavoom: absolutely!
[09:39:34] Mizou Vavoom: It is quicker for me to rebuild and apply textures from scratch
[09:39:50] Mizou Vavoom: then to fix someone or even my own texturing mistakes
[09:40:12] Mizou Vavoom: although a laudable proposal Shep in real terms it is not really viable
[09:40:22] Delia Lake: I'd love to have a listing of businesses that have quality buildings and landscaping that fit our regions, available for people--perhaps in the CDS offices
[09:40:36] Mizou Vavoom totally agrees
[09:40:45] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): Yes!
[09:40:47] Tor Karlsvalt: That would be good.
[09:41:03] Shep (shep.titian): We don't want to get too much like a gated community
[09:41:12] Mizou Vavoom: a one stop shop with good links to good quality builds and maybe a shop for our own builders
[09:41:35] Tor Karlsvalt: Perhaps we could suggest a list that the Chancellor could display.
[09:41:41] Pip Torok entered chat range (11.63 m).
[09:41:46] Mizou Vavoom: on the website?
[09:42:08] Mizou Vavoom: Hi Pip
[09:42:11] Tor Karlsvalt: Well back in the old days, I think we had a co-op shop on the Platz.
[09:42:21] Pip Torok: hi Mizou
[09:42:21] Mizou Vavoom: we did
[09:42:23] Shep (shep.titian): Hi Pip
[09:42:55] Rosie Gray: hi Pip ㋡
[09:43:00] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): Hello Pip
[09:43:14] Delia Lake: Josie, might that be something that the PIO could compile if citizens suggested merchants of quality builds that fit our covenants?
[09:43:17] Tor Karlsvalt: Hi Pip
[09:43:24] Pip Torok: hi Rpsoe .. was sorry to miss the RA
[09:43:35] Rosie Gray: np ㋡
[09:43:37] Pip Torok: hi Tor
[09:43:53] Soro (soro.dagostino): Hello Pip.
[09:44:04] Josie Cooperstone (josephine.fotherington): Yes, because it dovetails into something else I am going to be putting on the website, and that is a list of all of the CDS businesses.
[09:44:13] Pip Torok: soro ! // goos 2 C Y
[09:44:17] Mizou Vavoom: good idea Josie
[09:44:20] Pip Torok: good
[09:44:26] Rosie Gray moves a stool over for Pip
[09:44:44] Pip Torok: tks
[09:45:30] Delia Lake: Perfect. ty Josie. to finish up with reviews of regions. during the previous LUC meeting each of us, aside from Shep who wasn't there, volunteered to review a region. there's the list from that meeting. NFS - Delia Lake
AM - Tor Karlsvalt
CN - Mizou Vavoom
LA - Cadence Theas
Monastery - Em Warden
[09:45:46] Josie Cooperstone (josephine.fotherington): So I will already have all of the businesses. That is more "commerce" and would fall under that menu, but this would just be a filtered down version of that, that could go under the covenant menu.
[09:46:43] Delia Lake: that will be very helpful imo Josie
[09:47:47] Delia Lake: Shep there is no reason we can't have 2 reviewers of a region if you want to do that
[09:48:07] Mizou Vavoom: I can do with help Shep
[09:48:20] Delia Lake: I think we should not include Friedsee at this time because it's not yet built
[09:48:26] Mizou Vavoom:
[09:48:30] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): AFK
[09:48:37] Shep (shep.titian): Ok Mizou
[09:48:42] Mizou Vavoom:
[09:48:44] Shep (shep.titian): Happy to help
[09:49:06] Mizou Vavoom: Thanks Shep
[09:49:21] Delia Lake: great! do we think we can have preliminary region reviews done by the end of September?
[09:49:25] Shep (shep.titian): No probs ... which do we have?
[09:49:32] Mizou Vavoom: oh that early?
[09:49:51] Delia Lake: mid October? open to suggestions, realistic ones
[09:49:53] Tor Karlsvalt: Well the hard regions in my opinion are NFS, CN and LA.
[09:50:03] Tor Karlsvalt: Lots of builds in all of those
[09:50:14] Mizou Vavoom: Preferably mid-October for me
[09:50:32] Delia Lake: yes
[09:50:32] Shep (shep.titian): LA won't take long its half empty
[09:50:34] Mizou Vavoom: Shep I do CN so if you want to help?
[09:50:47] Shep (shep.titian): Yes sure
[09:50:53] Mizou Vavoom: Thanks
[09:51:05] Shep (shep.titian): Most of that needs tearing down hahaha
[09:51:15] Mizou Vavoom: Mu question is do we write the results in a pre=prepared google doc?
[09:51:27] Mizou Vavoom giggles
[09:51:33] Delia Lake: we'll target mid October for our preliminary review?
[09:51:38] Mizou Vavoom: agree
[09:51:41] Shep (shep.titian): I think notecards are fine!
[09:51:50] Tor Karlsvalt: that seems good.
[09:52:02] Mizou Vavoom: notecards to go in a box somewhere?
[09:52:19] Delia Lake: you should be able to copy the google doc if you want. or use notecards
[09:52:31] Shep (shep.titian): I'd suggest a copy to each member
[09:52:37] Delia Lake: hmmm. we don't have a box
[09:52:46] Mizou Vavoom: or a place for the box?
[09:53:11] Rosie Gray: can I make a suggestion about that, that you see if you can use the lower level of the praetorium for a few things?
[09:53:17] Mizou Vavoom: Would it not be easier to read if we had an excel sheet in google docs?
[09:53:19] Rosie Gray: there's lots of space there
[09:53:59] Delia Lake: ok. ty Rosie. we could put a box there. I'll check that
[09:55:08] Delia Lake: I"ll let folks know
[09:55:20] Delia Lake: moving on, I. Updates on:
1. Gaius Tiberius Curio’s (guillaume.mistwalker) and Mizou’s building of a new Thermae.
2. Rosie Gray’s building of a new Praetorium.
[09:55:26] Mizou Vavoom: Updates on rebuilding the Thermae:
Gaius and myself decided that I would continue with the building and texturing and continue to seek help from Gaius to conform to an authentic thermae.
I am trying to work out the roof with the windows at the moment. The final build will be mesh partially done in 'Mesh Studio' and refined in Blender 3D.
[09:56:00] Delia Lake: ty Mizou. very good
[09:56:21] Delia Lake: Rosie, would you like to speak to the Praetorium?
[09:56:23] Tor Karlsvalt: wow Mizou, great that you can work in Blender.
[09:56:26] Mizou Vavoom: Also I have no idea how long it will take me as RL work has been increased
[09:56:48] Rosie Gray: oh sure
[09:56:51] Mizou Vavoom: I love Blender, my eldest son gave me a manual as present
[09:57:06] Rosie Gray: well, as I told Delia, it is mostly finished
[09:57:10] Rosie Gray: it looks finished
[09:57:30] Rosie Gray: but I want to work on some specific textures for some areas, and that will take me some time
[09:57:36] Mizou Vavoom: A lovely addition Rosie
[09:57:50] Rosie Gray: and I will experiment with meshing some of the parts to see if I can reduce the LI
[09:57:56] Mizou Vavoom:
[09:58:00] Tor Karlsvalt: It will be a dramatic interesting change to the CN skyline.
[09:58:04] Rosie Gray: but it's already CHd, so not sure how much that will make a difference
[09:58:17] Rosie Gray: thanks you Mizou
[09:58:31] Rosie Gray: it actually doesn't change the skyline all that much Tor
[09:58:34] Rosie Gray: anyway,
[09:58:53] Rosie Gray: I would welcome any feedback now, before I work on the specific textures
[09:59:00] Rosie Gray: as it would be easier to change things now
[09:59:06] Rosie Gray: btw
[09:59:17] Rosie Gray: I consulted with Gaius about the design quite a lot
[09:59:28] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): Back
[09:59:32] Rosie Gray: to ensure that it is historically accurate
[09:59:34] Mizou Vavoom is invaluable for advice
[09:59:37] Tor Karlsvalt: Is there a TP to it located in CN?
[09:59:47] Rosie Gray: it's on the ground now Tor
[09:59:51] Tor Karlsvalt: haha
[09:59:53] Rosie Gray: the old one is gone
[09:59:57] Mizou Vavoom says Gaius is invaluable for advice
[10:00:05] Rosie Gray: yes he is Mizou!
[10:00:08] Rosie Gray: ㋡
[10:00:10] Mizou Vavoom: yay!!
[10:00:11] Tor Karlsvalt: I have been gone for a week.
[10:00:16] Tor Karlsvalt: Wonderful.
[10:00:18] Carissima Tedeschi (carissima) chuckles
[10:00:30] Rosie Gray: so that's it from me
[10:00:31] Rosie Gray: :)_
[10:00:54] Delia Lake: Thank you both for the updates, and for building for the community
[10:00:57] Pip Torok left chat range.
[10:00:57] Mizou Vavoom: Just a question about the lower rooms in the new build
[10:01:05] Rosie Gray: yes?
[10:01:17] Mizou Vavoom: Do they have a new purpose?
[10:01:22] Mizou Vavoom: specific?
[10:01:32] Rosie Gray: I thought they were for committee use
[10:01:39] Rosie Gray: just as the old one was used for
[10:01:42] Rosie Gray: and display
[10:01:51] Mizou Vavoom: good, as long as we get good chairs to sit in
[10:02:03] Rosie Gray: I think that is up to the committee
[10:02:04] Delia Lake: lol
[10:02:20] Rosie Gray: but please try to keep the LI low on them!
[10:02:35] Mizou Vavoom: Could the LUC has a dedicated room in there?
[10:02:42] Soro (soro.dagostino): Well folk, its been interesting, RL calls.
[10:02:48] Mizou Vavoom: By Soro
[10:02:49] Rosie Gray: bye soro
[10:02:57] Delia Lake: next and moving up to last...
[10:02:59] Rosie Gray: I don't see why not Mizou
[10:03:01] Soro (soro.dagostino): CYA
[10:03:05] Rosie Gray: but it's not up to me
[10:03:10] Mizou Vavoom: Delia?
[10:03:58] Delia Lake: I think it would be good to have a place to put things, like the box and probably the master plan on the wall, yes
[10:04:08] Mizou Vavoom: yes my thinking too
[10:04:21] Mizou Vavoom: as long as we know how many prims we can use
[10:05:06] Tor Karlsvalt cams over to CN and enjoys the grandeur of the new Preatorium
[10:05:34] Delia Lake: we should probably do everything we needed with about 20 or 25 prims total next...J. New requests to the LUC from
1. the RA?
2. the Chancellor?
[10:05:36] Rosie Gray: lol
[10:06:04] Delia Lake: I have received no new requests. has anyone else?
[10:06:15] Tor Karlsvalt: no
[10:06:38] Mizou Vavoom: no
[10:06:39] Shep (shep.titian): nope
[10:07:03] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): Not me either
[10:07:03] Tor Karlsvalt thinks that now barbarians tho could breach the city walls via the lower rooms of the Preatorium.
[10:07:14] Delia Lake: we'll have that as an agenda item every meeting though because sometimes we will have them
[10:07:25] Mizou Vavoom: ok
[10:07:38] Tor Karlsvalt: sounds good.
[10:08:26] Carissima Tedeschi (carissima): Sorry all. My typist isn't feeling well and needs to rest a while. See you soon.
[10:08:35] Rosie Gray: by Cari
[10:08:39] Rosie Gray: hope you feel better soon
[10:08:41] Delia Lake: regarding meeting space. I like the idea of having an official space but for actual meetings I think we should move around for now. OUr purview really requires we know the regions. so. K. Propose that the LUC rotate meeting spaces so that we intentionally use and highlight the different available public spaces in each region
[10:08:42] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): Tc cari
[10:08:42] Tor Karlsvalt: see you carissma
[10:08:43] Mizou Vavoom: Good bye Carissma, nice to meet you
[10:08:46] Carissima Tedeschi (carissima): Thanks
[10:08:53] Carissima Tedeschi (carissima) left chat range.
[10:08:56] Pip Torok: tc carissima
[10:08:58] Delia Lake: thx for coming Cari. hope you feel better
[10:09:53] Delia Lake: thoughts on rotating through public spaces for LUC meetings?
[10:10:20] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): I think it would be a good thing if the LUC members were all sitting at the same table...
[10:10:40] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): So anywhere where that can be arranged is fimne
[10:10:46] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): *fine
[10:11:03] Mizou Vavoom: Yes me too
[10:11:24] Tor Karlsvalt: If we eventually used the same space we could make use of some display space for maps or pics.
[10:11:42] Mizou Vavoom agrees with tor
[10:11:49] Mizou Vavoom: and boxes
[10:12:19] Delia Lake: what prompted me to suggest rotation is that we have so many wonderful public spaces most of which are under used
[10:12:30] Mizou Vavoom:
[10:12:31] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): It sounds pretty appealing
[10:12:36] Tor Karlsvalt: That is true too.
[10:12:45] Delia Lake: and I see the benefit of display space too
[10:12:56] Mizou Vavoom:
[10:13:03] Tor Karlsvalt: I guess I am rather ambivalent.
[10:13:06] Rosie Gray thinks there's no reason you can't have both
[10:13:16] Tor Karlsvalt: true
[10:13:18] Mizou Vavoom: i agree to both
[10:13:43] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): I for one make regular "inspection" tours around the sims to see what's new, but I am aware that not everyone has the time for that
[10:13:46] Tor Karlsvalt: I do like moving around as like you say we use more of the sims.
[10:13:56] Shep (shep.titian): I'll go with the majority
[10:14:08] Tor Karlsvalt: And perhaps we encourage others to look at more of the sim
[10:14:16] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): I wonder if there is a majority
[10:14:21] Shep (shep.titian): yeah right
[10:14:26] Delia Lake: that's what I'm hoping Tor
[10:15:22] Mizou Vavoom: I agree with the Propose that the LUC rotate meeting spaces so that we intentionally use and highlight the different available public spaces in each region and we could add the other one in later
[10:16:03] Delia Lake: or start the room as a place for display but rotate meeting places for now?
[10:16:08] Josie Cooperstone (josephine.fotherington) left chat range.
[10:16:08] Tor Karlsvalt: bye Josie
[10:16:11] Mizou Vavoom: yes
[10:16:18] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): Bye bye Josie
[10:16:34] Shep (shep.titian): bye Josie
[10:16:39] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): A good compromise IMO
[10:16:53] Tor Karlsvalt: yeah, I agree
[10:17:50] Delia Lake: ok good. let's put a thread on the events in the forum where we and other people can suggest meeting places for us. would that work?
[10:18:02] Mizou Vavoom: yes
[10:18:07] Pip Torok: agree
[10:18:09] Mizou Vavoom: good suggestion
[10:18:30] Tor Karlsvalt: It would.
[10:18:30] Pip Torok: agree
[10:18:54] Delia Lake: I have no other new business. does anyone else?
[10:19:07] Mizou Vavoom: none
[10:19:09] Shep (shep.titian): not me
[10:19:11] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): We may have a lot of options from now on... hard to decide which place to choose
[10:19:13] Tor Karlsvalt: Nope, none
[10:19:24] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): Sorry, lag...
[10:19:32] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): none here
[10:19:58] Delia Lake: then last but not least by any means the floor is open to citizens who are present to ask LUC related questions or make comments
[10:20:25] Delia Lake: sorry the meeting took so long today. I expect it will not be any where near this long again
[10:20:32] Pip Torok: a silly question for Rosie...
[10:20:38] Rosie Gray: ㋡
[10:20:42] Rosie Gray: shoot, Pip!
[10:21:07] Pip Torok: I see where the RA sit but where do the audience sit in the praesidium?
[10:21:26] Rosie Gray: everyone sits on the tiers, but only the RA sit on the red area
[10:21:28] Rosie Gray: for now
[10:21:40] Rosie Gray: I am going to improve that area and make it look a lot nicer
[10:21:46] Pip Torok: AH .. thank you .. mystery solved!
[10:21:49] Shep (shep.titian): I like that qualification lol
[10:22:11] Rosie Gray: it's the traditional way that ancient Romans had their meetings
[10:22:20] Pip Torok: I see
[10:22:20] Rosie Gray: seemed to work well yesterday ㋡
[10:22:33] Delia Lake: it did, yes
[10:22:34] Rosie Gray: except for some sore bottoms maybe, from the hard cement
[10:22:41] Rosie Gray winks
[10:22:41] Pip Torok: LOL
[10:22:46] Tor Karlsvalt sorry he missed it.
[10:22:54] Delia Lake: any other questions or comments?
[10:23:17] Shep (shep.titian): I don't see it accommodating a big audience
[10:23:41] Shep (shep.titian): in the old one the crowd sometimes filled the seats
[10:23:44] Rosie Gray: there's enough room there for a lot of people Shep
[10:23:57] Tor Karlsvalt: I think when it it finally finished we should make a mention with pictures on fb.
[10:23:59] Rosie Gray: which is the advantage of just sitting on the prim
[10:24:26] Tor Karlsvalt: I am wondering too if there is enough room.
[10:24:44] Tor Karlsvalt: You know some citizens might throw a rock or two.
[10:24:58] Pip Torok: or shoes!! 
[10:25:24] Rosie Gray: well, if I make chairs, we can always have some extra ones if necessary
[10:25:46] Rosie Gray: have to be mindful of the LI though
[10:26:20] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): The old Roman chair Gaius rezzed yesterday was only 1 prim
[10:26:38] Rosie Gray: yes, but even at 1 prim
[10:26:51] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): But if we need to put out 30 of them...
[10:26:58] Shep (shep.titian): Make benches?
[10:26:59] Rosie Gray nods
[10:27:13] Shep (shep.titian): less prims
[10:27:15] Rosie Gray: could use the benches I already made I guess
[10:27:20] Delia Lake: we can continue this conversation of course but if there are no LUC related questions might someone move that we officially adjourn this meeting?
[10:27:33] Shep (shep.titian): so moved
[10:27:34] Pip Torok: they’d be best imo Rosie
[10:27:36] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): So moved
[10:27:41] Mizou Vavoom: second
[10:27:42] Tor Karlsvalt: second
[10:27:46] Mizou Vavoom: lol
[10:27:49] Mizou Vavoom: aye
[10:27:49] Tor Karlsvalt: hehe
[10:27:54] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): Aye
[10:27:57] Tor Karlsvalt: aye
[10:28:00] Shep (shep.titian): Aye
[10:28:06] Pip Torok: LOL
[10:28:12] Mizou Vavoom: Bue all and thanks Delia, dinner time in RL
[10:28:18] Mizou Vavoom: *Bye
[10:28:23] Rosie Gray: bye Mizou!
[10:28:24] Delia Lake: OK! thank you everyone. doodle for next meeting toward the end of Sept
[10:28:27] Tor Karlsvalt: have a good dinner
[10:28:28] Em Warden (mothercard.warden): Thank you, Delia
[10:28:29] Mizou Vavoom: okido
[10:28:33] Delia Lake: bye Mizou
[10:28:35] Tor Karlsvalt: Thanks everyone esp. Delia.
[10:28:42] Tor Karlsvalt: Bye Mizou
[10:28:50] Pip Torok: and evening dinner in London ...
[10:28:51] Weimaraner Yakubu: I'm extra laggy, need to scoot.
[10:28:53] Shep (shep.titian): yes well done Delia!
[10:28:56] Mizou Vavoom left chat range.
[10:29:01] Tor Karlsvalt: see you Pip
[10:29:02] Pip Torok: cheers Wei
[10:29:05] Weimaraner Yakubu left chat range.
[10:29:12] Pip Torok: see you all !