?Transcript, July21, 2019, LUC Meeting

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Cathy Sabre
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?Transcript, July21, 2019, LUC Meeting

Post by Cathy Sabre »

[09:35] Rosie Gray: I call this meeting to order
[09:36] Cathy Sabre: Yes. comps and RL are not good atm.
[09:36] Cathy Sabre: sighs
[09:36] Rosie Gray: has everyone had a chance to see the Minutes that Han posted on the forum?
[09:36] Sudane Erato: i did
[09:36] Rosie Gray: http://forums.slcds.info/viewtopic.php?f=67&t=9049
[09:36] Cathy Sabre: Yes
[09:36] Rosie Gray: we aren't being super formal in these meetings
[09:37] Rosie Gray: but for the record, any comments on the Minutes?
[09:37] Rosie Gray: see anything missing or?
[09:37] Sudane Erato: looked good to me
[09:37] Cathy Sabre: move to approve?
[09:37] Rosie Gray: okay, seems fine to me to
[09:37] Rosie Gray: are you making the motion, Cathy?
[09:38] Cathy Sabre: yes
[09:38] Rosie Gray: do we have a second?
[09:38] Sudane Erato: second
[09:38] Rosie Gray: all in favour
[09:38] Sudane Erato: aye
[09:38] Cathy Sabre: aye
[09:38] Rosie Gray: aye
[09:38] Rosie Gray: it's a good thing we have a quorum!
[09:38] Delia Lake: aye
[09:38] Sudane Erato: :)
[09:38] Rosie Gray: motion passed
[09:39] Rosie Gray: we have two big items to talk about, so I thought we should bring those forward first
[09:39] Cathy Sabre: yes
[09:39] Rosie Gray: one is the upgrading of sims as per Lyubov's presentation
[09:40] Rosie Gray: and the other one is the Colonia Nova new covenant - I will go into detail on that when we get to it
[09:40] Rosie Gray: has everyone read Lyubov's proposal?
[09:40] Sudane Erato: hehe... yes
[09:40] Rosie Gray: :D
[09:40] Sudane Erato: its a good proposal, IMHO
[09:40] Rosie Gray: Delia, have you?
[09:40] Cathy Sabre: Yes, and we have discussed it some.
[09:41] Rosie Gray: maybe Pumpkin has taken over the keyboard ;)
[09:41] Sudane Erato: i think so
[09:41] Delia Lake: tg
[09:41] Sudane Erato: :)
[09:41] Delia Lake: Hello there!
[09:42] Rosie Gray: hmmm
[09:42] Rosie Gray: lol
[09:42] Sudane Erato: A very literate cat!
[09:42] Rosie Gray: well let's have comments about the proposal - I'm in favour of it myself
[09:43] Rosie Gray: anyone else want to say anything about it?
[09:43] Sudane Erato: i will
[09:43] Sudane Erato: I think that it basically takes the opportunity presented by LL when they lowered full sim prices
[09:43] Sudane Erato: and revamps our tier structure
[09:44] Sudane Erato: AND... enables us to add the extra prims to LA and AM
[09:44] Sudane Erato: all for essentially no change in our money prospects
[09:44] Sudane Erato: so
[09:45] Sudane Erato: we give up the benefit of automatic increased profit
[09:45] Sudane Erato: in excahnge for a much more attractive tier structure
[09:45] Sudane Erato: so thats a plus i think
[09:45] Sudane Erato: done
[09:45] Rosie Gray: thank you Sudane
[09:45] Rosie Gray: anyone else?
[09:45] Cathy Sabre: And, perhaps increase interest in property in CDS
[09:46] Sudane Erato: oh, and i compliment Lyubov for her reasoning and analysis
[09:46] Delia Lake: q1y7 bb
[09:46] Sudane Erato: done again :)
[09:46] Cathy Sabre: Second
[09:46] Rosie Gray: agreed!
[09:47] Rosie Gray: ah, Lilith is coming
[09:47] Lilith Ivory: Hi all :)
[09:47] Rosie Gray: glad you could make it ㋡
[09:47] Sudane Erato: hi Lil :)
[09:47] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): Hello
[09:47] yo-yo (yoshiko.bomazi) is offline.
[09:47] Rosie Gray: Lilith, we are just talking about Lyubov's proposal
[09:48] Lilith Ivory: ok :)
[09:48] Rosie Gray: [09:43] Sudane Erato: I think that it basically takes the opportunity presented by LL when they lowered full sim prices
[09:43] Sudane Erato: and revamps our tier structure
[09:44] Sudane Erato: AND... enables us to add the extra prims to LA and AM
[09:44] Sudane Erato: all for essentially no change in our money prospects
[09:44] Sudane Erato: so
[09:44] Sudane Erato: we give up the benefit of automatic increased profit
[09:45] Sudane Erato: in excahnge for a much more attractive tier structure
[09:45] Aᴘᴘʏ (AppaloosaHorse Resident) is online.
[09:45] Sudane Erato: so thats a plus i think
[09:45] Sudane Erato: done
[09:48] Rosie Gray: what Sudane just said
[09:48] Delia Lake: just fed cats. back and catching up. sorry
[09:48] Rosie Gray: wb Delia
[09:49] Lilith Ivory: thank you Rosie
[09:49] Rosie Gray: so, Lilith and Delia, do either of you have any thoughts about the proposal you'd like to share?
[09:50] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): please
[09:50] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): I did not ask to be moved
[09:50] Lilith Ivory: I am all in favour for this proposal
[09:50] Delia Lake: it looks good to me
[09:50] Lilith Ivory: I think it s a great opportunity to make our estate more attractive for (new) citizens
[09:51] Rosie Gray: I agree
[09:51] Rosie Gray: shall we vote to endorse the proposal?
[09:51] Cathy Sabre: I move
[09:52] Cathy Sabre: Do we have a link?
[09:52] Cathy Sabre: So I can include it in the motion?
[09:52] Rosie Gray: it's on the forum
[09:52] Lilith Ivory: good idea Cathy :)
[09:52] Lyubov (20180414): This is the Forum thread http://forums.slcds.info/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=9055
[09:52] Lilith Ivory: a link would be good
[09:52] Rosie Gray: thank you Lyubov
[09:52] Lilith Ivory: ty Lyubov
[09:53] Cathy Sabre: I move we adopt Lyubov's proposal, per: http://forums.slcds.info/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=9055
[09:53] Rosie Gray: do we have a second?
[09:53] Lilith Ivory: I second
[09:53] Rosie Gray: discussion
[09:54] Rosie Gray: I think we can endorse, but not adopt
[09:54] Cathy Sabre: What are the next steps
[09:54] Rosie Gray: it would need to go to the Chancellor and the RA
[09:54] Cathy Sabre: We can adopt it as our proposal
[09:54] Rosie Gray: but we can as the LUC endorse it
[09:54] Lilith Ivory: I think we can vote wether we want it or not and than figure out how to proceed
[09:54] Cathy Sabre: So adopt or endorse is moot.
[09:55] Delia Lake: yes, we need to endorse and send to the RA and Chancellor with our recommendation that they adopt it
[09:55] Lilith Ivory: if I remember correctly this is something the RA has to decide about
[09:55] Rosie Gray: yes it is, which is why endorse would be more accurate, in my opinion
[09:55] Lilith Ivory whispers: (we can always look up how we did that when increasing LI for NFS and CN :) )
[09:56] Cathy Sabre: I withdraw the motion and substitute it with: I move that LUC adopt Lyubov's proposal, re: http://forums.slcds.info/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=9055
[09:56] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): I would like to remind this group that as chancellor I have many ob,ligations with regard to land disposition
[09:56] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): I do approve of the proposal with the one caveat Sudane mentioned
[09:56] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): It is bold
[09:57] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): and with our efforts it most likely will vreate rxcitement and succeed
[09:57] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): done
[09:58] Rosie Gray: thank you Kyoko
[09:58] Rosie Gray: there is a motion on the floor
[09:58] Lilith Ivory: I second again
[09:58] Rosie Gray: but I think you used exactly the same wording
[09:58] Rosie Gray: as the first one
[09:58] Rosie Gray: lol
[09:58] Cathy Sabre: sighs
[09:58] Lilith Ivory giggles
[09:58] Sudane Erato: :)
[09:59] Cathy Sabre: I move that the LUC endorse Lyubov's proposal, re: http://forums.slcds.info/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=9055
[09:59] Rosie Gray: do we have a second?
[09:59] Lilith Ivory looks in her dictionary for endorse ...
[10:00] Sudane Erato: hehe
[10:00] Sudane Erato: means we like it
[10:00] Rosie Gray: ㋡
[10:00] Lilith Ivory: lol yes
[10:00] Sudane Erato: and hope the authorities will approve it :)
[10:00] Cathy Sabre: befürworten
[10:00] Lilith Ivory: I second that we like and support this proposal :)
[10:01] Lilith Ivory: (cathy, non native spakers won´t understand befürworten too ;-) )
[10:01] Cathy Sabre: call the question
[10:01] Cathy Sabre: soz
[10:01] Rosie Gray: any more discussion?
[10:01] Rosie Gray: hearing none, please vote
[10:01] Rosie Gray: aye
[10:01] Sudane Erato: aye
[10:01] Lilith Ivory: aye
[10:01] Cathy Sabre: aye
[10:01] Delia Lake: aye
[10:02] Rosie Gray: motion passed
[10:02] Sudane Erato: yay!
[10:02] Rosie Gray: ㋡
[10:02] Lilith Ivory applauds
[10:02] Lyubov (20180414): :)
[10:02] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): Congratulations Lyubov :)
[10:02] Rosie Gray: and since our Chancellor is here, and you've already said you like it
[10:02] Cathy Sabre: second
[10:02] Rosie Gray: we can take it to the RA
[10:02] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): I said I liked it
[10:03] Rosie Gray: but, I do think it's important that anyone who will have their tier increased be personally spoken to about it
[10:03] Lilith Ivory: who has to figure out how to inform the citizenship in case the RA votes for it?
[10:03] Rosie Gray: if they aren't one of us
[10:03] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): I didn't say that I am without concerns about how it is presented to the citizens
[10:03] Rosie Gray: yes, and that's what I wanted to talk about too a bit
[10:03] Rosie Gray: not that it is the LUC's job to do the presenting
[10:03] Lilith Ivory: of course we absolutely need to inform all concerend citizens
[10:04] Rosie Gray: do you have thoughts about it, Kyoko?
[10:04] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): yes
[10:04] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): I think most of the proposal is a slam dunk
[10:04] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): (is that in your dictionary Lilith?)
[10:04] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): I too am concerned about those who will have tiers raised
[10:04] Lilith Ivory: lol no and I´m too lazy to look
[10:05] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): I would strongly suggest that the emphasis be on more LI
[10:05] Cathy Sabre: It means what it sounds like
[10:05] Sudane Erato: I could make a list of affected citizens, as well as a chart of how much their tier will rise
[10:05] Sudane Erato: also... the citizens in FDS and MON who have their tier lowered
[10:06] Sudane Erato: they should be informed too
[10:06] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): yes
[10:06] Rosie Gray: yes good point, much should be made of that point too!
[10:06] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): because that's a plus
[10:06] Sudane Erato: yes
[10:07] Rosie Gray: so for your end of things Kyoko
[10:08] Rosie Gray: do you have an idea of what you want to do?
[10:08] Sudane Erato: :((... all those tier boxes needing changing :((
[10:08] Sudane Erato: sorry
[10:08] Rosie Gray: awh, sorry Sudane
[10:08] Rosie Gray: can anyone help with it?
[10:08] Delia Lake: We had to handle this issue in the past. I'm trying to recall but think that most people were ok with it. I think there was one citizen who was not and we reduced the size of that plot just a little so that the person's tier remained the same. it was only that one person though
[10:09] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): Well I think it is important that the chancellor take a role in presenting this to the citizens
[10:09] Delia Lake: yes
[10:09] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): I would say that no matter who was chancellor
[10:09] Sudane Erato: agreed
[10:09] Rosie Gray: I agree! I think it's really the responsibility of the Chancellor to do so
[10:09] Rosie Gray: before it's a done deal
[10:09] Rosie Gray: because the RA has to pass it into law after that
[10:10] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): when will it come to the RA?
[10:10] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): swhat has to haoppen before that?
[10:10] Rosie Gray: at least I 'think' it has to pass into law
[10:10] Rosie Gray looks at Lilith and Delia who might be able to clarify
[10:10] Sudane Erato: the people should know first... so they can come and scream at the RA :)
[10:10] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): cvertainly approval is also part of the chancellor's obligations
[10:11] Rosie Gray: thinking about it, I'm not sure that there is actually any law that needs to be applied about this
[10:11] Rosie Gray: so the RA would be more a matter of a stamp of approval too
[10:11] Rosie Gray: am I right?
[10:11] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane) likes the idea of less laws ;)
[10:12] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): ok then my approval at this juncture is provisional until we work out how to present it
[10:12] Lilith Ivory: having a hard toime to catch up reading lol
[10:12] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): I think Lyubov has made a good start on that in her revision
[10:12] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): But there is some strategy involved
[10:12] Delia Lake: yes.
[10:12] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): done
[10:13] Lilith Ivory: if we don´t have a better idea I suggest we follow the procedure we followed when proposing the LI increase in NFS and CA
[10:14] Lilith Ivory: I wouldn´t mind getting a better idea as last time we offered more LI for the old tier for a few month :)
[10:14] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): I like the idea of a transition period
[10:14] Sudane Erato: Yes... that's what I had done in new england, and it worked well
[10:14] Lilith Ivory: yes
[10:14] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): which is what I think you are describing Lilith
[10:14] Sudane Erato: 2 months
[10:15] Rosie Gray: it has to be manageable too, with the adjustments to the Casperlets
[10:15] Lilith Ivory: I do like the idea of following our own procedures from last time
[10:15] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): gleep
[10:15] Lilith Ivory: one would have to look up how it was done
[10:15] Delia Lake: it seems to me that people want to know 1. how changes will affect them personally Namasté benefits and negative impacts - and 2. how the changes will affect the community, in that order
[10:15] Sudane Erato: we suggested that people could extend their time at the old rates
[10:16] Rosie Gray: ;)
[10:16] Delia Lake: wow, how did Namaste get in there? I never said that
[10:16] Lilith Ivory: yes, group nptes with detailed info needs to be send out and the citizenship needs to get informed it´s discussion on the forum and when the RA decides about it
[10:16] Rosie Gray: hehe
[10:17] Rosie Gray: does anyone recall when this happened so we can find what the RA actually did in Minutes?
[10:17] Rosie Gray asks, hopefully
[10:17] Lilith Ivory: I had it found again in the past ... moment
[10:18] Rosie Gray: it did go pretty smoothly last time
[10:18] Lilith Ivory: it´s called a modest proposal on the forum ...
[10:18] Rosie Gray: ah thank you
[10:18] Sudane Erato: ahhh... yes...
[10:19] Lilith Ivory: http://forums.slcds.info/viewtopic.php? ... t+proposal
[10:19] Lilith Ivory: was it this one?
[10:20] Rosie Gray: yes
[10:20] Rosie Gray: just found it too
[10:20] Aedan (aedan.charron) is online.
[10:20] Sudane Erato: (I had to explain Jonathan Swift...)
[10:20] Delia Lake: lol
[10:21] Rosie Gray: :D
[10:21] Rosie Gray: just skimming over it again
[10:21] Lilith Ivory giggles (and tries to remember who that Coop guy was ...)
[10:22] Sudane Erato: :)
[10:22] Rosie Gray: so there was a 2 month transition
[10:22] Sudane Erato: yes
[10:22] Lilith Ivory: yes and as it seems the RA voted for it before sending out the info for citizens
[10:22] Lilith Ivory: just cross reading it tho
[10:22] Rosie Gray: do you happen to have that link too, Lilith?
[10:23] Lilith Ivory: it´s on the second page of this proposal
[10:23] Lilith Ivory: what link do you need? RA transcript?
[10:23] Rosie Gray: oh, yes sorry I see it mentioned
[10:23] Rosie Gray: no was looking for Minutes
[10:25] Lilith Ivory: okt 29 20017 Tan presented Sudanes proposal
[10:26] Rosie Gray: hmmm, don't see anything for Oct. 29
[10:26] Rosie Gray: oops, sorry now I found it
[10:26] Rosie Gray: http://forums.slcds.info/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=8285
[10:27] Rosie Gray: so it was approved by the RA, no new law was necessary
[10:27] Rosie Gray: that's what I was wondering ㋡
[10:27] Rosie Gray: sorry to take up time on that!
[10:27] Lilith Ivory: yes exactly
[10:28] Rosie Gray: is there anything else anyone wants to say about Lyubov's proposal?
[10:28] Lilith Ivory: we never need a new law for one time actions imo
[10:28] Delia Lake: I have to leave in a couple of minutes
[10:28] Rosie Gray nods
[10:28] Rosie Gray: okay, then let's move on to the Colonia Nova new covenant
[10:28] Rosie Gray: Cathy, do you want to bring it forward?
[10:29] Cathy Sabre: Sure
[10:29] Cathy Sabre: WE have been working on the CN covenant in google docs
[10:30] Cathy Sabre: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Wya ... DDf_U/edit#
[10:30] Cathy Sabre: I still need to rewrite the code for inside the walls
[10:31] Cathy Sabre: Which I think should be in two parts
[10:31] Cathy Sabre: The mandate for all building sot be govt owned.
[10:31] Aedan (aedan.charron) is offline.
[10:32] Cathy Sabre: And reference to the original code until all buildings are non-private.
[10:32] Cathy Sabre: done for now
[10:32] Rosie Gray: can everyone see this document?
[10:32] Cathy Sabre: I have a nc with the work in progress document if any one wants.
[10:32] Cathy Sabre: IDK
[10:33] Rosie Gray: any comments?
[10:33] Lilith Ivory: what does that mean? till all buildings are non private?
[10:33] Rosie Gray: this is what we need to talk about
[10:34] Cathy Sabre: Alll the buildings are to be linked to public land, and "owned" by CDS
[10:34] Cathy Sabre: Within the city walls
[10:34] Cathy Sabre: But there will be a transition period
[10:34] Rosie Gray: in my original proposal to update the buildings inside the walls, I referred to Zone S only, which is what was approved by the LUC
[10:35] Lilith Ivory: we might get a problem with Prims if we really anchor ALL buildings to public land
[10:35] Cathy Sabre: Is there a difference between zone 5 and the area encompassed by the walls
[10:35] Rosie Gray: but, when I said Zone S, I was actually thinking of all of the buildings immediately adjacent to the forum road
[10:36] Rosie Gray: which I didn't realize until I updated one more building and put it down, then realized that it wasn't Zone S
[10:36] yo-yo (yoshiko.bomazi) is online.
[10:36] Sudane Erato: It would be nice if we COULD anchor all builds in the walls to public land... but i think we'll have to study if thats feasible
[10:36] Lilith Ivory nods in agreement
[10:36] Rosie Gray: yes I AGREE
[10:37] Rosie Gray: oops
[10:37] Rosie Gray: we initially talked about Zone S but that was my mistake not getting the zoning correct
[10:37] Sudane Erato: and if we did anchor all builds thusly we could get rid of the prim parcels as no longer needed
[10:37] Rosie Gray: so we need to study what is feasible
[10:38] Lilith Ivory: yes
[10:38] Rosie Gray nods
[10:38] Cathy Sabre: those parcels are now for FV
[10:38] Rosie Gray: or keep a couple of them for fishing village
[10:38] Sudane Erato: well... FV is all anchored
[10:38] Cathy Sabre: But I think that the ones on the river should be for cottages, personally
[10:38] Sudane Erato: so i see no need for them for that purpose ?
[10:39] Cathy Sabre: That would be nice
[10:39] Rosie Gray: Kyoko wants some for the fishing village
[10:39] Sudane Erato: *shrug*
[10:39] Cathy Sabre: Make them part of FV.
[10:39] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): prim parcels for FV?
[10:39] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): yes
[10:39] Rosie Gray: I was thinking that they should be available for anyone who has a regular parcel in CN, if we have thenm at all
[10:39] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): best way imho Rosie
[10:40] Sudane Erato: might as well
[10:40] Lilith Ivory: I agree with Rosie on that
[10:40] Cathy Sabre: I do to
[10:40] Cathy Sabre: too
[10:40] Sudane Erato: simpler to administer
[10:40] Rosie Gray: yes
[10:40] Rosie Gray: and more fair
[10:40] Lilith Ivory: if we can sell a parcel why not sell it :)
[10:40] Sudane Erato: hehe
[10:40] Delia Lake: reading the covenant, what zone is the FV?
[10:40] Cathy Sabre: Shall I put that in our covenant proposal?
[10:40] Cathy Sabre: then?
[10:41] Rosie Gray: the Fishing Village will have its own zone
[10:41] Sudane Erato: Delia, zone FV
[10:41] Sudane Erato: at the end
[10:41] Rosie Gray: I have to say that I find all the different zones inside the city a bit confusing
[10:42] Delia Lake: and if we don't need prim parcels then maybe the sales shouldn't be restricted to CN citizens only, but we might need to keep 1 of them for LV for riverbank landscaping
[10:42] Cathy Sabre: We couldn't even find a zone
[10:42] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane) raises her hand
[10:42] Rosie Gray: jump in, Kyoko
[10:42] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): I was lookingh at the zones in casperlet
[10:42] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): In my experience wandering around as is my wont
[10:42] Sudane Erato: :)
[10:43] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): The stalls are a very Roman thing and aren't even being used as stalls to sell or for horses
[10:43] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): So howabout folding S intyo C
[10:43] Rosie Gray: yes they are an anachronism for sure
[10:43] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): and then eventually destall the stalls
[10:44] Cathy Sabre: What if someone gets a horse?
[10:44] Sudane Erato: hehe
[10:44] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): rent a prim parcel?
[10:44] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): LOL
[10:44] Sudane Erato: get a barn!
[10:44] Rosie Gray: hehe
[10:44] Rosie Gray: when they were designated as 'stalls', I think it was meant to be market stalls
[10:45] Rosie Gray: I have never seen them used as such
[10:45] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): my assumption
[10:45] Cathy Sabre: of course
[10:45] Cathy Sabre: just an oat of humor, Rosie.
[10:45] Sudane Erato: remember there's one down below as well
[10:45] Sudane Erato: just above the docks
[10:45] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): anyway you might consider folding S into C
[10:46] Sudane Erato: makes sense to me
[10:46] Rosie Gray: I guess if things are going to change with the Casperlets, then it won't really add much work if we do that too
[10:46] Rosie Gray looks at Sudane
[10:47] Cathy Sabre: So, S into C, and R into FV?
[10:47] Rosie Gray: no, not R into FV
[10:47] Cathy Sabre: Shall I put that into text?
[10:47] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): R is R
[10:48] Rosie Gray: if we are keeping prim parcels, it stays as its own
[10:48] Cathy Sabre: But we were eliminating R
[10:48] Rosie Gray: no we aren't
[10:48] Rosie Gray: lol
[10:48] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): Just redescribe zone S
[10:48] Cathy Sabre: Okay
[10:48] Sudane Erato: well... we'll just need to change prim box names and then rest, cause the parcel names are taken from the actual boxes
[10:48] Delia Lake: I'll have to read text when I return. I have 13 min to do a 15 min rl drive so I'm afk for the duration. bye
[10:48] Lilith Ivory: might be a good idea to decide at one point wether we want to keep prim parcels or not :)
[10:48] Sudane Erato: bye Delia!
[10:48] Rosie Gray: bye delia
[10:48] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): wait redescribe zone C and just drop zone S
[10:48] Rosie Gray: ㋡
[10:48] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): btye Delia
[10:48] Delia Lake: all future typing here will be by pumpkin
[10:49] Sudane Erato: haha
[10:49] Lilith Ivory: bye Delia
[10:49] Rosie Gray: and then there are the Zone E plots
[10:49] Rosie Gray: which are also inside the city walls
[10:49] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): those are outside the walls
[10:49] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): E?
[10:49] Sudane Erato: those are outside, yes
[10:49] Cathy Sabre: To the East
[10:49] Rosie Gray: oh are they? see how easily I am confused
[10:49] Sudane Erato: across from the theater
[10:49] Sudane Erato: just 4 of those
[10:50] Cathy Sabre: Anyone here not confused?
[10:50] Sudane Erato: hehe
[10:50] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): zones make my eyes cross
[10:50] Rosie Gray: perhaps a one line description of what area is being referenced beside the Zone names would be helpful
[10:50] Rosie Gray: it would certainly help any citizens trying to figure it out
[10:50] Cathy Sabre: k
[10:50] Sudane Erato: hehe... we can blame them on Moon... she's not here :)
[10:51] Rosie Gray: one other item I'd like to address re these parcels is the restrictions of commercial and residential
[10:51] Rosie Gray: I just don't think we need them anymore
[10:51] Rosie Gray: what does everyone else think of that?
[10:51] Cathy Sabre: good idea
[10:51] Lilith Ivory: isn´t there a map somewhere with the zoning?
[10:52] Cathy Sabre: I would like to see it if there were.
[10:52] Rosie Gray: yeah, don't know
[10:52] Sudane Erato: there ARE maps
[10:52] Lilith Ivory: I am all in fvour to set all parcels to mixed use , allowing both, residental and commercial
[10:52] Sudane Erato: but i was searching for them the other day, and came up empty
[10:53] Lilith Ivory: I know too there were maps but idk where to find them :(
[10:53] Cathy Sabre: Can we have a show of hands on the matter of mixed use.
[10:53] Cathy Sabre: I don't want to change it unless we agree.
[10:54] Sudane Erato: i agree with Lil... we could well have mixed use everyhwere.... but
[10:54] Sudane Erato: some residents might not like signs in what were residential areas
[10:55] Sudane Erato: issues like that
[10:55] Rosie Gray: I was thinking of just inside the city walls
[10:55] Lilith Ivory: just restrict the use of big signs :)
[10:55] Rosie Gray: also, there's only 1 actual residence that I can think of
[10:55] Cathy Sabre: Have sigh police.
[10:55] Cathy Sabre: sign
[10:56] Rosie Gray: the rest are galleries, offices, what-not
[10:56] Cathy Sabre: And do they have signs?
[10:56] Lilith Ivory: we did have this "comercial/non comercial" discussion about galleries efore lol
[10:56] Rosie Gray: I think the commercial aspect goes back to when the idea was to try and make it a truly commercial area, with shops
[10:56] Lilith Ivory joins the sigh police ;-)
[10:56] Sudane Erato: hehe
[10:56] Cathy Sabre: I haven't noticed any obnoxious signs lately.
[10:56] Rosie Gray: hahah
[10:57] Cathy Sabre: I guess there were some back in the day.
[10:57] Rosie Gray: isn't there somewhere in the covenant about signs?
[10:57] Rosie Gray: I do agree about obnoxious signage
[10:57] Lilith Ivory: yes, it was just to keep those huge ugly malls out of residental areas
[10:57] Cathy Sabre: anywhere!!
[10:57] Cathy Sabre: And why can't a little rural restaurant have a small sign?
[10:57] Rosie Gray: well they can
[10:58] Rosie Gray: but this goes back to some laws too
[10:58] Lilith Ivory: and I really have no problem at all if someoen ever wants to sell something inside of a nicely build house
[10:58] Cathy Sabre: Or could I put a little sign over my gate: AM Gardens?
[10:58] Rosie Gray: about commercial expectations
[10:58] Rosie Gray: maybe we add some sign size restrictions, and no-bright
[10:59] Cathy Sabre: I agree
[10:59] Lilith Ivory: yes
[10:59] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): I've been jusing .03 glow instread of fullbright
[10:59] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): *using
[10:59] Lilith Ivory: oh btw .... when we had the nuseum ladies here it crossed my mind we should thing about the allowed max high of buildings again
[10:59] Cathy Sabre: Would that apply to all sims, or just CN?
[10:59] Rosie Gray: in RL there are rules around signage size and lighted etc in most downtowns
[10:59] Sudane Erato: yeah... glow is better than bright
[11:00] Lilith Ivory: I came to realise HOW BIG 20 meters can be :)
[11:00] Sudane Erato: :)
[11:00] Rosie Gray: yes as long as it's very low glow
[11:00] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): LOL
[11:00] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): yeah
[11:00] Rosie Gray: but adding a light to shine on your sign is the best solution
[11:00] Sudane Erato: thats true too
[11:00] Rosie Gray: oh interesting point, Lilith
[11:00] Cathy Sabre: Or torch.
[11:00] Rosie Gray: well that's a light
[11:00] Cathy Sabre: Rosie has nice torches.
[11:01] Lilith Ivory: it´s a 5 floor appartment building ;-)
[11:01] Rosie Gray: wow, when you put it like that!
[11:01] Rosie Gray: maybe we need to do some measuring
[11:01] Lilith Ivory: didn´t we talk about this when inspecting the building space of the museum group
[11:01] Rosie Gray: did we?
[11:02] Lilith Ivory: I would sugesst allowing buildings that are PARTLY 20 m high max
[11:02] Rosie Gray: such as the peak of a roof?
[11:02] Sudane Erato: top of chimney :)
[11:02] Rosie Gray: I thought that was how it is anyway
[11:02] Lilith Ivory: yes or the tower of a windmill
[11:02] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane) is going to go around with a 20 meter prim and measure LOL
[11:02] Rosie Gray: been there, Kyoko!
[11:02] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): (not)
[11:03] Rosie Gray: haha, there are times though
[11:03] Cathy Sabre: Hey,, I would set out the prim for you, if there were a question.
[11:03] Lilith Ivory: gez yes and those times keep coming back
[11:03] Rosie Gray: they do
[11:03] Rosie Gray: we can see the result of a misdemeanor from here
[11:03] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): (scratch that treehouse I was considering LOL)
[11:03] Lilith Ivory: I remember we lost a few citizens due to the fact their chimney was 21m high
[11:03] Cathy Sabre: awwww
[11:03] Lilith Ivory: *sighs again
[11:04] Cathy Sabre: That is why variances are written into LUC.
[11:04] Rosie Gray: awh
[11:04] Rosie Gray: yes, special circumstances can have allowances made
[11:04] Cathy Sabre: One size rarely fits all.
[11:04] Rosie Gray: but if you don't have a standard, then people sometimes go crazy
[11:04] Cathy Sabre: absoultely
[11:04] Lilith Ivory: I agree
[11:05] Rosie Gray: and without something in the covenant to point to
[11:05] Rosie Gray: it can put you in a difficult position to reject a building
[11:05] Lilith Ivory nods
[11:06] Rosie Gray: so Lilith, were you thinking that 20m is too high?
[11:06] Lilith Ivory: I want it to be changed into partly 20m - not the whole thing
[11:06] Rosie Gray: how would you word that though?
[11:07] Lilith Ivory: party of a building like chimneys, towers and such can have a maximum high of 20 meters
[11:07] Lilith Ivory: *parts
[11:07] Cathy Sabre: differentiate between the structure and attachments
[11:08] Rosie Gray: hmmm, but then that seems to indicate that the main structure should also have a maximum
[11:08] Rosie Gray: personally, I always took it to be the highest point on the structure can be no higher than 20m
[11:08] Rosie Gray: whatever it was
[11:08] Cathy Sabre: that works for me.
[11:08] Lilith Ivory: yes I was measuring this too
[11:08] Rosie Gray: then if you have something unusual, like a belltower or whatever
[11:09] Rosie Gray: you can ask for a variance
[11:09] Cathy Sabre: yes
[11:09] Lilith Ivory: I wish I could find that picture again that was taken of the museum building floating over the parcel
[11:09] Rosie Gray: oh that one that the ladies rezzed?
[11:09] Rosie Gray: egads that was horrific
[11:09] Lilith Ivory: yes!
[11:09] Lilith Ivory: that´s exactly what started my concern!
[11:10] Lilith Ivory: and it was not even 20m high yet
[11:10] Lilith Ivory: now what to do if it is build with textures that fit to our covenant
[11:10] Rosie Gray: so maybe 20m is too high
[11:11] Lilith Ivory: while for example the house that Max has in LA is partly 20m and fits well
[11:11] Lilith Ivory: we don´t need to find a solution for this now but I think we should think that through carefully
[11:12] Rosie Gray: okay just rezzed a 20m measure outside the window
[11:12] Rosie Gray: for reference
[11:12] Rosie Gray: most of the houses here in NFS are well below 20m
[11:13] Lilith Ivory: yes and that´s good as it´s small parcels
[11:13] Rosie Gray: so you can easily have 2 stories within that size
[11:13] Rosie Gray: and still have enough space for chimneys
[11:13] Cathy Sabre: Mine is three, and not nearly 20 m
[11:13] Rosie Gray nods
[11:13] Lilith Ivory: 20 meters give a 5 floor house with average room high of 4 meters
[11:14] Rosie Gray: that's pretty big alright
[11:14] Cathy Sabre: minus the attic
[11:14] Lilith Ivory: yup
[11:15] Rosie Gray: just lowered the measuring prim to 15m
[11:15] Rosie Gray: and that is still above most of the roof heights here
[11:15] Rosie Gray: Sudane, what do you think about this?
[11:16] Sudane Erato: sorry... a bit distracted
[11:16] Sudane Erato: but i agree... at least for out of town, 20 m is very high
[11:16] Rosie Gray: should we lower it to 15m?
[11:16] Rosie Gray: that's still quite big
[11:16] Lilith Ivory: I am mostly worried about the border between CN and AM
[11:17] Rosie Gray: I agree Lilith
[11:17] Rosie Gray: we could define those areas as specifically for rural cottages?
[11:18] Cathy Sabre: It is two zones now,
[11:18] Cathy Sabre: One river front, the other the border with AM
[11:18] Rosie Gray: that also seems a bit unnecessary
[11:18] Rosie Gray: visually, they blend
[11:18] Cathy Sabre: That is why I brought it up
[11:18] Rosie Gray: yes, thanks
[11:19] Cathy Sabre: I think it was for villas on the river and transition at the south
[11:19] Rosie Gray nods
[11:19] Lilith Ivory: I remember those parcels once were sykbox quarters idk why lol
[11:19] Rosie Gray: well if we want to change it, now is a good time because they are unoccupied
[11:19] Sudane Erato: yes
[11:19] Cathy Sabre: But what if someone wants a villa
[11:20] Cathy Sabre: FV eliminated that option to the sough
[11:20] Rosie Gray: Zone E are essentially villas
[11:20] Sudane Erato: are we really able to define the difference between villas and rural cottages?
[11:20] Cathy Sabre: in reality? Probably not.
[11:21] Cathy Sabre: except for size, ,which isn't mentioned
[11:21] Rosie Gray joins the sigh police
[11:21] Rosie Gray: looking at the time
[11:21] Sudane Erato: remember... its really difficult for admins to tell a new resident exactly what kind of house they can build unless its REALLY well defined
[11:21] Lilith Ivory: I would say: if a villa fits on a plot than a villa is allowed there lol
[11:21] Rosie Gray: perhaps we need to extend this discussion to the document
[11:22] Sudane Erato: yeah
[11:22] Lilith Ivory: the parcels at the border to AM aren´t this big
[11:22] Sudane Erato: its tough writing a covenant
[11:22] Rosie Gray nods
[11:22] Cathy Sabre: but I want to get something to the forum
[11:22] Rosie Gray: it has to be very specific, understandable, yet with room for some flexibility
[11:22] Cathy Sabre: And want agreement.
[11:23] Sudane Erato: well, what's wrong with getting it to the forum now?
[11:23] Sudane Erato: we get broader discussion
[11:23] Rosie Gray: I think we need to hash it out between all of us first
[11:23] Cathy Sabre: I agree
[11:23] Sudane Erato: *shrug*
[11:23] Rosie Gray: if you add in even more people, those who may not even know anything about covenants in the first place, it adds another layer again
[11:23] Rosie Gray: but that's just my opinion
[11:23] Cathy Sabre: Can we wait until next meeting for me to translate this into docuese?
[11:24] Sudane Erato: ok
[11:24] Lilith Ivory: can´t we put it into LUC discussions?
[11:24] Cathy Sabre: Or should I up date the work-in-progress and publish it?
[11:24] Rosie Gray: oh that's an idea Lilith
[11:24] Cathy Sabre: Good idea, Lilith
[11:24] Cathy Sabre: yay
[11:24] Rosie Gray: and then we can all discuss there and others can see it
[11:24] Sudane Erato: yeah... agree
[11:25] Cathy Sabre: sighs in front of a police officer.
[11:25] Sudane Erato: i suspect its mostly us who are going to get so absorbed in it... others won't care :)
[11:25] Rosie Gray: so Cathy, I would refine as much as you can and then post to the LUC discussions
[11:25] Cathy Sabre: aye cap'n
[11:26] Sudane Erato: :)
[11:26] Cathy Sabre: I am on it.
[11:26] Rosie Gray: ㋡
[11:26] Cookie Cresci is online.
[11:26] Rosie Gray: looking at the time, should we pick the next meeting date?
[11:26] Cathy Sabre: And much thanks to all of you.
[11:26] Cathy Sabre: !!!
[11:26] Sudane Erato: :)
[11:26] Sudane Erato: hoping for a Sunday at this time
[11:26] Rosie Gray: how is Sunday July 28th same time for everyone?
[11:27] Cathy Sabre: soon
[11:27] Sudane Erato: next week?
[11:27] Rosie Gray: that is just one week
[11:27] Rosie Gray: yeah
[11:27] Sudane Erato: jeez
[11:27] Cathy Sabre: lol
[11:27] Rosie Gray: too soon?
[11:27] Sudane Erato: how about 2 weeks :)
[11:27] Rosie Gray: we have so much else to talk about
[11:27] Sudane Erato: true
[11:27] Rosie Gray: okay, August 4th? same time?
[11:27] Cathy Sabre: Not if Cathy stays at the spinning wheel
[11:27] Sudane Erato: hehe
[11:27] Lilith Ivory: I am trying hard to put a SC meeting together for next saturday :)
[11:28] Rosie Gray sends Lilith best wishes
[11:28] Sudane Erato: ahh... i was going to ask you Lil :)
[11:28] Rosie Gray: how is Aug 4th?
[11:28] Lilith Ivory: (I just didn´t get feedback about 9am or 10am yet :(
[11:28] Sudane Erato: good for me
[11:28] Cathy Sabre: and for me
[11:28] Rosie Gray: Lilith? Cathy?
[11:28] Lilith Ivory: works for me
[11:29] Rosie Gray: okay good ㋡
[11:29] Rosie Gray: our next meeting will be Aug 4th, 9:30 am slt
[11:29] Rosie Gray: before we adjourn
[11:29] Rosie Gray: I would like to mention the new building that I put down in CN
[11:29] Sudane Erato: neat!
[11:29] Rosie Gray: on one of the parcels I 'thought' was to be anchored already approved
[11:30] Rosie Gray: but it turns out it was not in the right zone
[11:30] Rosie Gray: anyway, it's down, and it is anchored
[11:30] Rosie Gray: so please have a look
[11:30] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): It's a lovely building
[11:30] Sudane Erato: remind us which it is?
[11:30] Rosie Gray: it is right across the street from Kyoko's gallery
[11:30] Rosie Gray: at the gate leading to LA
[11:30] Sudane Erato: ok
[11:30] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): next to city wall near LA
[11:31] Rosie Gray: so it would need approval to remain, and anchored
[11:31] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): sudane?
[11:31] Sudane Erato: yes?
[11:31] Sudane Erato: I'll go look soon :)
[11:31] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): you are the prim expert
[11:31] Rosie Gray: if it can't remain anchored I'll have to remove it, as it's too many LI for that parcel
[11:31] Sudane Erato: oh... we'll have to study that issue
[11:31] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): I approve if Sudane does :)
[11:32] Rosie Gray: thank you Kyoko
[11:32] Rosie Gray: okay then
[11:32] Sudane Erato: lol... ok.... I WISH we could anchor everything in the walls
[11:32] Rosie Gray: anything else from anyone, before we adjourn?
[11:32] Cathy Sabre: not me
[11:32] Lilith Ivory: o yes
[11:32] Rosie Gray: speak now or forever hold your peace
[11:33] Lilith Ivory: is there a chance to reparcel the two free parcels in the NFS valley?
[11:33] Sudane Erato: combine them?
[11:33] Lilith Ivory: to make both parcels in a way one might want to buy them
[11:33] Lilith Ivory: that would work
[11:33] Rosie Gray: oh that little strip parcel?
[11:33] Sudane Erato: we should combine them
[11:33] Rosie Gray: good idea
[11:33] Lilith Ivory: yes !
[11:33] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): right the ones next to my parcel
[11:33] Rosie Gray: yeah I don't know why that is like that
[11:33] Lilith Ivory: the smaller one is really not of much use
[11:33] Sudane Erato: exactly
[11:34] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): it's basically a defacto prim parcel
[11:34] Sudane Erato: yes
[11:34] Rosie Gray nods
[11:34] Rosie Gray: I'd vote for that
[11:34] Lilith Ivory nods too
[11:34] Sudane Erato: well, i'm in favor... but Kyoko should say
[11:34] Rosie Gray: merging the two, I mean
[11:34] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): It's fine with me
[11:34] Sudane Erato: she usually gives me instructions for parcel mods :)
[11:35] Rosie Gray: yes ;)
[11:35] Lilith Ivory: of course
[11:35] Sudane Erato: (which I dislike doing... but accede) :)
[11:35] Lilith Ivory giggles
[11:35] Kyoko Furse-Barzane (samara.barzane): more like I ask if it's ok LOL
[11:35] Sudane Erato: hehe
[11:35] Rosie Gray gives Sudane a virtual pat on the shoulder
[11:36] Rosie Gray: we are done now?
[11:36] Lilith Ivory: I am fine now :)
[11:36] Rosie Gray: okay, I call this meeting adjourned
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