Alp Meadows Covenant discussion

[Moon Adamant]

hello everyone,

i am calling the discussion on the covenants for our third sim. Please check the proposal discussion at this thread:

http://forums.neufreistadt.info/viewtop ... 5&start=30

and also the covenants for the other sims here:

http://www.aliasi.us/nburgwiki/tiki-ind ... d+Covenant

Notice that the covenants for the third sim must include:

- The CDS wide covenants
- The sim wide covenants, that describe characteristics pertaining to all plots and builds in the sim.
- In case zoning is considered for the sim, zone wide covenants, which describe the common characteristics of builds and plots within each zone.

Also, the CN covenants include a chapter on building typologies and allowed materials. It is up for discussion as regards the third sim if a likewise chapter will be set.

[Sleazy_Writer]

I'd like to see skyboxes allowed in the entire sim (above 512 meters), why isn't it allowed in the whole of CN?

This is also a good moment for covenant reforms for the other sims (script rules?)

My first impression is that we do need a building typology because if we want a rural character, that means using certain materials.

[Sonja Strom]

At a height over 512 m, would such skyboxes be visible from the land

[Moon Adamant]

I can't remember exactly why you have skyboxes just above a bit of CN. I think it was an experience that was made then, to see if the skyboxes were attractive for buyers.

As for the height of skyboxes, that depends on what you define as 'standard drawing distance'. If you have a drawing distance of 256, you can be at the top of Alp Meadows (~150 m) and still don't see the skyboxes. For reference, i think the default drawing distance in your SL client is 128.

I agree that we can look at the scripts question. If we can implement a better script rule in Alp Meadows, then i am sure the other sims will follow

[Moon Adamant]

always forget something...

I agree also about the tipologies for the sim. The original proposal mentioned 'chateaux' and 'cottages'. These could be described in the covenant. My problem here atm is that i don't know exactly to what they refer: is a chateau a scottish baronial castle or a classic french chateau (say)? Is the cottage a fachwerk, an alpine house, something else?

I think perhaps we could look for pictures of the styles we are envisaging, since i am sure that we all have each a different idea of what the builds should be.

As for materials, the case is easier. The cue here is exactly the same language as was used in the CN covenant - that is, pre-industrial materials. And that to refine later on: for instance, i am sure that the roofs won't be just terracota tiles like in CN, but they can be thatch, shingles in wood, slate or terracota, maybe even metal shingles, say.

Edit: just so you can see my point, have a look at the variety of possible appearances of chateaux just in the article in wikipedia!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chateau

[Diderot Mirabeau]

I'd like to see skyboxes allowed in the entire sim (above 512 meters), why isn't it allowed in the whole of CN?

As I remember it we envisioned partitioning CN into zones with gradually more relaxed covenants and it was the feeling that a skybox was a radical departure from precedent considering that the original covenant provisions required all structures to be physically plausible and made no provision for exceptions such as skyboxes.

I am by no means the more senior citizen so perhaps others could correct me on this but it is my subjective impression that the original projekt was very much inspired by a desire to show that it is possible to do things differently from the mess of the mainland. As everybody knows skyboxes are an intrinsic part of life on the mainland. I can easily imagine the original founders having seen this as undignified as well as promoting a kind of isolationism that was not part of the original community ideals of the projekt.

Of course since then the dogma have been gradually devolved first with the teaching rooms of the NFS School and subsequently with the quiet retreat / builders skyboxes of Colonia Nova.

I guess it is inevitable that the general ban on skyboxes will one day be lifted but the original reason why skyboxes are only allowed in one zone of CN is that the status quo at the time was 'no skyboxes in CDS' and the lifting of that general ban in one particular zone was seen as a way of making parcels in that zone more attractive - and by extension more profitable.

[Dnate Mars]

Part of the thinking of this was also that we didn't want a sim of just a bunch of skyboxes. Think of how boring that would be. No one around, no builds on the ground. It also allows for the more realistic feel of the sims. That is why all the builds are supposed to be physically feasible.

As for this sim, all along it has been stated that this will have some of the most strict convents of any of the sims thus far.

[Bromo Ivory]

Did the proposition voted on by the citizens say anything about covenants? (strict, etc?)

One way to preserve a rural "feel" and hand many parcels would be to have or allow skyboxes.

I have no opinion on this, actually, but just wanted to bring up these items to keep in mind when making decisions.

[Sonja Strom]

Thank you Moon, for answering my question.

In my opinion skyboxes look very modern, actually like something from the future, and they would not in any case really help to preserve a rural feeling. If we want to have many parcels on the new sim, I would prefer there be small plots clustered (especially as was discussed in the Forum here: http://forums.neufreistadt.info/viewtop ... c&start=30).

If skyboxes can not be seen from a relatively normal view distance, I guess there can be some possibility of allowing them. For example, as Diderot mentioned, there are skyboxes above Neufreistadt to make the NFS School larger. I have visited these but not ever used them; but as I also do not ever see them they don’t really bother me.

Overall when I see the description "Alpine Meadows," what I think of is a place with a rural character. In practice this would mean fairly strict covenants, because otherwise many different things could be built.

Another issue to consider is, I assume skyboxes need prims?

[Dnate Mars]

Did the proposition voted on by the citizens say anything about covenants? (strict, etc?)

One way to preserve a rural "feel" and hand many parcels would be to have or allow skyboxes.

I have no opinion on this, actually, but just wanted to bring up these items to keep in mind when making decisions.

It was talked about, but not in great detail. Just to remind people, the vote that was had was in no way, shape, or form a binding agreement. It was held for the sole reason of ranking the order that the New Guild was going to present them to the RA. The RA had, and still has, the final say in anything that gets done. If the RA wanted to, they could tell the New Guild to build a sim that is a futuristic space themed sim, and we would do it.

[Moon Adamant]

Guys, i am sorry - but this discussion needs a bit more momentum, or we'll never have the covenants written down

Let's start by discussing the GENERAL CDS covenants:

There is already a call that the script/m2 clause be changed - what should be a better ratio there?

CDS wide covenants

The following provisions apply to all CDS parcels:

* All structures are subject to review
* No terraforming is permitted
* No SL or RL commercial pornography is permitted
* At most 1 script per 100 m^2 of land is permitted.
* Scripts which use llListen (voice command) are only permitted, if they listen only after a touch and then deactivate after a certain period of time.
* Scripts which spy on residents are not permitted.
* Bounce script are not permitted.
* Scripts which create autonomous wandering objects are not permitted.
* Particles can only be used in effects that have real-world analogies, such as lights, smoke, and fire.
* Particles should be set no higher than 10 particles per second.
* Scripts, particles, and scripts attached to avatars are unregulated.
* Subletting is not permitted
* No skyboxes are permitted below 512 m in altitude
* No default wood textured prims are to be left in place longer than 24 hours

Edit: to fix the italics

[Tanoujin Milestone]

There is also the Texture Size Reduction Act NL 3-8. Imo this kind of rules should be part of the general covenant.

Scripts: doesnt it depend on the server how much the sim can take? I would prefer to see the script rules on the regional covenants then, taking into account how much load they cause.

(May be allow heavy scripts if they are not permanent and do not interfere with the experience of the others as long as they are in use...)

[Dnate Mars]

Is it really a good idea to have rules that in reality unenforcible?

Particles, How can you tell from the outside what the actual rate that they are bing created? Don't things like size, speed, and length of life also effect how good they look?

Scripts, we need to not care so much about the [i:25wo6g79]number[/i:25wo6g79] of scripts but how much lag these scripts generate. Is it really fair to allow 1 script that takes 1ms to run but not allow 10 scripts that only take .01ms to run?

Also, do we really need to keep: Scripts which create autonomous wandering objects are not permitted? As long as they are not wandering on public land or someone else land, they shouldn't be an issue.

Also, just as an aside, is there a reason that terraforming is allowed on CN? Is this just an oversight or is it really allowed?

[Sleazy_Writer]

Good points,

I don't think the time is right to do a review of NFS and CN that obligates everyone to use 512x512 textures instead of larger ones (NL 3-8). But it would be a good idea to make this requirement part of an AM covenant.

As for particles. Like Dnate said, the 10 particles per second isn't perfect at all, but it's an easy way to count *something* of particles. Size and speed shouldn't be an issue because that's taken care of by the RL analogy requirement. My proposal below includes Tan and Dnate's remarks:

• CDS wide covenants

  The following provisions apply to all CDS parcels:

  * All structures and scripts are subject to review
  Why? Because, afaik, only people with EO powers can see detailed permance info.
  The Chancellor already does this, so it's not really a change.
  * No terraforming is permitted
  * No SL or RL commercial pornography is permitted
  * The maximum of scripts that is permitted per 100 m^2 is: 1 continuously active or looping script, or 5 non-continously active or non-looping scripts.
  Why? Because despite the number of scripts being a bad guideline, individual residents do need *some* indication of what is allowed. And because continuously processing scripts should be a different category than small scripts that run once when triggered by user interaction or a timer. Feel free to change the numbers or wording.
  * Scripts which use llListen (voice command) are only permitted, if they listen only after a touch and then deactivate after a certain period of time.
  * Scripts which spy on residents are not permitted.
  * Bounce script are not permitted.
  * Scripts which create autonomous wandering objects are only permitted when those objects stay on the owner's parcel.
  * Particles can only be used in effects that have real-world analogies, such as lights, smoke, and fire.
  * Particles should be set no higher than 10 particles per second.
  * Scripts, particles, and scripts attached to avatars are unregulated.
  * Subletting is not permitted
  * No skyboxes are permitted below 512 m in altitude
  * No default wood textured prims are to be left in place longer than 24 hours

  Alpine Meadows Sim-Wide Covenants

  * Following and as a result of law NL 3-8, the largest texture allowed may have 512x512 pixels or an equivalent number of resulting pixels.
  Why? For better performance. But I think the Chancellor should grant waivers for special applications.
  * more ..
  * more .. Including building typology.

[Moon Adamant]

what about defining scripts instead by a total millisecond spending per parcel?

If a resident would like to have more scripts, then he/she would review the scripts used so they would spend as little as possible, thus freeing allowed time for more.

Can this allowance of iteration time - and teh checking of it - be done in a simple way?