RA Meeting - 28 September 2008: Transcript

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Justice Soothsayer
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Joined: Sun Jun 04, 2006 1:14 pm

RA Meeting - 28 September 2008: Transcript

Post by Justice Soothsayer »

Object-Name: notetaker 2.0.1
Region: Locus Amoenus (246272, 250112)
Local-Position: (120, 165, 23)

Meeting on 2008-09-28
Those present:
Justice Soothsayer is in the chair.
Bells Semyorka has indicated consent to be recorded.
Bells Semyorka: Hello Jamie!
Bells Semyorka smiles, Thanks Justice!
Jamie Palisades: AH, excellent - thanks for the TP, I would have been wandering around searching otherwise :)
Justice Soothsayer: I am distributin gthe agenda via notecard
Justice Soothsayer: It is also on the forum
Jamie Palisades: Hi Bellsie -- waaaaay over there :D
Bells Semyorka: :)
Rose Springvale: hmm
Justice Soothsayer: Nice to meet in the sunshine
Justice Soothsayer: Let's get started, as we have a quorum.
Pip Torok: very true
Justice Soothsayer: The notetaker device is on the bench next to me; please touch it to indicate consent to recording.
Rubaiyat Shatner has indicated consent to be recorded.
Rose Springvale has indicated consent to be recorded.
Pip Torok has indicated consent to be recorded.
Justice Soothsayer: Y'all have the proposed agenda; any changes?
Rubaiyat Shatner: I am looking for the webmaster in the forum (can never find anything there) but no changes
Justice Soothsayer: I'm not sure anyone has posted a webmaster proposal other than our discussions about it at our last meetings.
Rubaiyat Shatner: hmm something came across my reader
Pip Torok: yes bit arria did send a merssage re it
Arria Perreault: Hi everybody :-)
Bells Semyorka: Hello Arria
Pip Torok: hi arria!
Bells Semyorka: Lovley dress hun
Rubaiyat Shatner: got it, it is an email
Rubaiyat Shatner: hi arria
Justice Soothsayer: Anyone other than RA members want to speak on any item on the agenda, please say so now (Jamie, we know you will be speaking to the Chancellor's Report)
Jamie Palisades nods
Arria Perreault: :-)
Justice Soothsayer: OK. Item I e. future RA meetings; is Oct. 12th (2 weeks hence) OK? I think our rotation would have us meet at the Rathaus.
Arria Perreault: 12 october ok for me ...
Jamie Palisades has indicated consent to be recorded.
Pip Torok: ditto
Rubaiyat Shatner: yes it looks okay for me as well
Justice Soothsayer: good
Justice Soothsayer: Moving on to Item II, Chancellor's report.
Justice Soothsayer: Jamie, you're up.
Jamie Palisades: Thank you. Here's the lo;st of topics I sent around by e-mail in reply to Justice's meeting agenda query: appointments, land sales, land enforcement, land groups,
outreach, Oktoberfest, events generally.
Arria Perreault has indicated consent to be recorded.
Jamie Palisades: And I would like to at least talk about the webmaster role business later as well.
Jamie Palisades: But I see we have one of our team with us - good morning Rose.
Rose Springvale: hi..on phn
Jamie Palisades: So let me take Oktobefest and events , areas of her concern, up out of order :)
Jamie Palisades: hm - or maybe not :) Rose if you are staying around, we'll get to those in a little while, then :)
Jamie Palisades: OK then
Jamie Palisades: Appointments first
Jamie Palisades: You know we annoucne them all to the Executive Branch Announcements page of the forums
Jamie Palisades: so you also likely know that our former RA colleague Sonja Strom has agreed to serve as one of our land caretakers
Justice Soothsayer: Excellent news!
Jamie Palisades: I will mention this again in connection with some security and land powers issues in a few minuites :)
Pip Torok: good!
Jamie Palisades: and yes, we appreciate her service! Also Sonja is one of the people who consistently draws friends into CDS
Arria Perreault: great!
Jamie Palisades: We owe her our gratitude for that as well ... another uissue I will notw shortly .. and ...
Jamie Palisades looks around
Rose Springvale: hm
Jamie Palisades: .. a gooo model for everyone :)
Jamie Palisades: land sales next
Jamie Palisades: I;m unhappy with the speed with which LA is selling its originsal plots
Jamie Palisades: it's happening, but slowed than Alpine Meadows did
Pip Torok: yes but we live in different times!
Jamie Palisades: IN general - and as you will see I will sugggest a different forum for detailed discvussuion, this is just a report -- indeed, Pip :) different economy .. and continuing effects of Linden Lab's odd pricing and land management actions, resulting in an uncertain SL land economy as well, regardless of RL
Jamie Palisades: so whil I am still also focused on the financial feasibaility of expansion of CDS
Jamie Palisades: I am leaning a little skeptic
Jamie Palisades: just now
Jamie Palisades: let's see if our colleaguesh help us promote LA
Jamie Palisades: Riose and Brian and I are doing things to promote and advertise CDS
Jamie Palisades: they've just started wiuth our ternm, but we also will see if that works a little better than waiting for people to find us :)
Arria Perreault: May I ask a question?
Rose Springvale: i'm back btw
Jamie Palisades: and I think you shoud expect that any expansion plans we suggest for the next month or two would be grounded in a firm positive cash flow projection :D
Jamie Palisades: sure
Jamie Palisades: Arria?
Pip Torok: agreed Jamie but look at CDS in context to the whole SL economy
Jamie Palisades: If we are to stop for Qs now, I had one from Arria first
Arria Perreault: yes, I think that people prefer now to rent land instead to buy it. Should we make some reflections in this direction?
Jamie Palisades: ARria, I woudl like to call a meeting to discuss that specifically, of interested citizens
Arria Perreault: ok
Jamie Palisades: I thik it;s worth more time than RA can give it mid-repor
Jamie Palisades: t
Jamie Palisades: and there might be a few who;s like to come and chat with us who do not show up at RA much
Jamie Palisades: where I want to go with this is a citizen recruiting team.
Jamie Palisades: Not necessariyl stipended, but given a place to work and the authority to go out and evangelize for us.
Pip Torok: agree
Jamie Palisades: and I excpect it woudl include people from multiple roles and factions, expected to put down their political swords and work together :)
Jamie Palisades: so - as an action item - I will announce a midweek meeting late this next week to begin that project as a n open-to-citizens initiative
Jamie Palisades: probelay in the SLT late morning so as to be accessible to EU .. and then maybe an announvement at the closing OFest ball to solicit more ideas and participants.
Jamie Palisades: Pip? You had a Q also? I;m done with this topic for the moment
Pip Torok: no ... go along with what you just said ...
Jamie Palisades: kk thx
Jamie Palisades: on from land sales to land enforcement
Jamie Palisades: ladies and gentlemen (smile)
Jamie Palisades: I have good news and bad news
Jamie Palisades: the good news is that we have such good will, generous volunteers and decent citizens that we have not had too many problems for several years now
Jamie Palisades: :)
Jamie Palisades: the bad news is that our land groups, permissions and so ons are a horrid mess and badly need untabgleing BECAUSE if we had a FAILURE of that good will we'd be hard pressed to deal with it well
Jamie Palisades: so
Jamie Palisades: :) I am in the nmiddle of reorganizing and cleaning up the key SL groups pertinent to CDS
Jamie Palisades: (excluding the Guild - which is their own nongovernmental thing)
Jamie Palisades: so mainly: "C.D.S.", "Lan Verwaltun" and "Colonia Nova'
Jamie Palisades: oops typo - Land Verwaltung
Jamie Palisades: as you probably know
Jamie Palisades: that, and who is 'estate manager' on each sim, control a wide variety of matters
Jamie Palisades: who can eject.freeze, and where
Jamie Palisades: who can remedy bad prims
Jamie Palisades: backup objects for community builds
Jamie Palisades: right to post noticed at hubs
Jamie Palisades: etc etc etc
Jamie Palisades: Sudane and I are working on this -- a lot
Jamie Palisades: there are a lot of old lergacy permissions too -- we are like a company who has had a lot of turnover ...
Jamie Palisades: .. but never bothered to change the door keys or ciomputer passwords :(
Jamie Palisades: \I hsoud have for you, during October, detailed repots on what's changed .. which will include
Jamie Palisades: -- backup arrangements
Jamie Palisades: -- defined roles -- some of whichi I may ask you to legislate
Cindy Ecksol is amazed that we're going to be so organized
Jamie Palisades: (e.g., if someone has pwer of our stuff, maybe there should be rules about giving it BACK at end of term :)
Jamie Palisades: serious :) I would ike to see some laws about how we make sure the old Chancellor or etc with certainty gets removed from the nuclear missle buttons :)
Jamie Palisades: sig - working on it, CIndy
Rose Springvale: which sim ar ethose in???!
Pip Torok: (agree)
Jamie Palisades: done with that topic .. any Qs for now? I felt it;s important public policy thaty we be aware of it, and get it right
Arria Perreault: I strongly support this project
Jamie Palisades: (Rose, the missles are buried in an unsold LA parcel so.. buy now!)
Justice Soothsayer: on land use, Jamie, do you have any pending complaints, or have all been resolved?
Jamie Palisades: :D next topic
Rose Springvale: smile, already did!
Jamie Palisades: Let me go to Justice's Q then, seeing no typey-gestures
Jamie Palisades: Hm. Yes, I have two ipen ones.
Rubaiyat Shatner: Jamie I am curious how this (LA sales) would impact the proposed void sim?
Jamie Palisades: The way we deal with land enforcement now is described in detail on the "Sim and City Planinng" forum pages.
Pip Torok: (void sim?)
Rubaiyat Shatner: Item III (b)
Jamie Palisades: hm - Rubiyat - threda collision - let me do 'covenant enforcer' first thhen come back to that
Rubaiyat Shatner: sure
Jamie Palisades: covenants :0
Jamie Palisades: a. we have them
Jamie Palisades: b. I get complaints sometimes
Jamie Palisades: c. and we -- slowly -- with the st8ill-underpopulated-BAC -- look for violatiosn too
Jamie Palisades: (probably one sim each month)
Jamie Palisades: (Volunteering for BAC has been a litte slow)
Jamie Palisades: d. when we get a complaint, I deal with it with the accuser AND alleged violater directly and offline
Jamie Palisades: e. A notice of the GENERAL problm is posted in the Sim & City Planning thread, no names
Jamie Palisades: ff. most resolve within a week
Jamie Palisades: and the resolution is posted to the forums ('executive' thread)
Jamie Palisades: if not :)
Jamie Palisades: we may get into soe prim ejecting or get-assistance-for-the-builder issues.
Jamie Palisades: That's rare
Jamie Palisades: also, finally
Jamie Palisades: i LA we are trying a new one-time preapproval
Jamie Palisades: land=owbers can say to us, come look and tell us it;s OK
Jamie Palisades: and if I do not, or the BAC, within a wekk, they're immune from covenant complaints as to the pre-erected part
Jamie Palisades: which is a nivce way for landowners to not get surprised
Jamie Palisades: about ... hm ...1/3 of the LA builds so far have asked for this
Jamie Palisades: let's see what Guild says - this was their idea - but might want to extend it to all sims
Jamie Palisades: (but if so I want more than one week :D)
Jamie Palisades: done with land enforcement
Jamie Palisades: we did outreach :)
Justice Soothsayer: ok
Jamie Palisades: I woudl like tyo talk a little about Oktoberfest and events
Jamie Palisades: realiuzing we're a bit behind - but started late also
Arria Perreault: I have a small remark
Jamie Palisades: Rose, back with us?
Rose Springvale: i'm here
Jamie Palisades: kk - yes Arria?
Arria Perreault: I was told that the fees are not clearly indicated in the convenant published in the window "ABout land"
Arria Perreault: Is it thinkable to add it to avoid any future issue
Arria Perreault: ?
Jamie Palisades: Arria, land pricing is also somethign we need to give attention - and I think that MIGHT be a good ideas for NEW parcels
Jamie Palisades: but we do not control the resale prices of others' land
Symo Kurka: tiers are not at all written in covenants
Rose Springvale: never have been
Jamie Palisades: which I want to mention briely after Rose is done with events
Jamie Palisades: (Well we could put the sale prices for New LA parcels in the LAND metadata for example)
Arria Perreault: I am talking about fees, not land price
Arria Perreault: monthly fees
Rose Springvale: could easily be added to the description line
Jamie Palisades: (all of the above :) makes them better searchable)
Justice Soothsayer: Well, Arria, fees denominated in Linden $ change sometimesdue to exchange rates, no?
Jamie Palisades: hmmmmmmm
Jamie Palisades: yes unfortunately we do have law in CDS permitting resets
Jamie Palisades: had not doen much for us, though, and complicated things
Rose Springvale: that's not what we've published on the LA site though
Arria Perreault: usually in other sims, all price categories are indicated in the convenant
Jamie Palisades: :) let me take that one as a query from the RA that required studsy and resposne from us :) and SU needs to be consulted on this one
Jamie Palisades: (I am a skeptic about the CDS US Dollar Accounting Act too)
Jamie Palisades: can we move on to events?
Arria Perreault: we can also provide a link to the portal and publish the prices and fees on the portal
Arria Perreault: yes
Rose Springvale: am i up?
Jamie Palisades: ARria - I will come back to that briefly at the end of my report, after Rose :) And yes, thanks, Rose, please
Pip Torok: yes you are Rpse
Rose Springvale: thanks Jamie
Rose Springvale: We've had a great response to Oktoberfest so far, and have one more big weekend
Rose Springvale: each event has brought in a slightly different group, so we are getting broad exposure
Rose Springvale: We have been a little short on .. ahem.. CDS citizens at events
Rose Springvale: so i'd encourage especially the RA to try to put in some appearances if you could.
Rose Springvale: Cindy hosted a fantastic open mic event..
Rose Springvale: by which i mean she persuaded professional musicians to work for tips!
Cindy Ecksol: kind of semi-open actually -- I stacked the deck :-)
Rose Springvale: and has another on thursday at 5 i believe
Cindy Ecksol: yes
Rose Springvale: There is soccer today at noon .. though i'll not be able to be there, it is fun and doesn't take long
Rose Springvale: Next weekend is our last set of concerts, and the ball
Rose Springvale: AT the ball we'll honor our various "winners" of the competitions we've held
Jamie Palisades: `and the football (soccer) match against Caledon, smile, also next weekend
Rose Springvale: and hopefully come together as a community... a good time to bring our newer citizens in the fold. no jamie
Rose Springvale: next weekend is the CDS final
Jamie Palisades: no? changed?
Jamie Palisades: Oh OK :) sorry
Rose Springvale: Caledon is after oktoberfrest
Rose Springvale: smiles
Rose Springvale: we try to extend the effect a bit
Jamie Palisades is looking fwd to that one entirely too much
Rose Springvale: they are .. not athletes :)
Rose Springvale: Also
Justice Soothsayer: Thanks to all who worked so hard on these events!
Rose Springvale: do you want me to talk about BL ajamie?
Cindy Ecksol wonders which team Jamie will play on in the Caledon/CDS match
Rose Springvale: ha
Jamie Palisades: bhwah hah hah
Rose Springvale: i still have my tar and feather animation....
Rose Springvale smiles sweetly
Jamie Palisades: already itching to kick some tartaned steampunk fanny, Cindy
Cindy Ecksol: ok, good! :-)
Jamie Palisades: and Rose I will get to tha iin a sec. Done with Ofest?
Rose Springvale: anyone have any questions for me? :)
Arria Perreault: thank you for organizing :-)
Rose Springvale: I'll be taking the floats down today.. so if you've not seen them, do!
Pip Torok: seconds arria
Jamie Palisades: indeed. Rose does her usual spectacular job and we're all very grateful.
Jamie Palisades: Which leads me to the following :
Rose Springvale blushes
Jamie Palisades: 1. Parade rocked. Go look at the floats today - over in the NW corner of this sim.
Rose Springvale: eveyrone has been really great to work with and help .. it is fun
Rose Springvale whispers.. and start thinking about your holiday floats....
Jamie Palisades: 2. WHile you are here, do look also at the remarkable builds by Sudane & Alexi there, and ARri's remarkable new domus . There is some indpsired building occurring here :)
Jamie Palisades: 3. Please be advsied. For Oktoberfest
Jamie Palisades: since we drive a lot of traffic to NFS this two weeks
Jamie Palisades: I donated my own marktplatz land to CDDS for the duration for free
Jamie Palisades: and doubled the size of the CDS "infohaus" there
Justice Soothsayer: very nice, Jamie.
Jamie Palisades: go look, please: I felt the old visitor information center was moribund
Rose Springvale: its very nice and helps a LOT with explaining to new ppl
Arria Perreault: I would like to make a precision: Ulysse has made the main work on this house
Jamie Palisades: ... I also think we may want to consider swapping parcels, or something to make the bigger Makrtplatz center permanent, but if we did that, it would need to be (a) something the community agrees is a good idea, and...
Jamie Palisades: ... (b) approved by RA. technically I have the power to do land deals liek that .. but this is MY land I I do not thikn it;s appropriate to have me approve a land swap (fro CDS) with me (aas inidvidual)
Jamie Palisades: so, go look, let me know if you thikn we should keep it like that or go back to the smaller one; we'd take up afte the festivals are done, I am content to donate it for the short term
Jamie Palisades: that's all on OFest
Jamie Palisades: 3 more pioints then done
Jamie Palisades: 1. Events generally - please look at the "events in CDS" forum
Jamie Palisades: I have posted my view that we probably should continue to increase event spending, well beyond the current budget
Jamie Palisades: WE can afford it - it;s about priorities, and what we want o have here -- and
Jamie Palisades: whether we continue to be a bunch of absentree-owner sims that only wake up when the diaspora comes home for events and RA meetings :)
Jamie Palisades: a reliable stream of events is a quetsion related to attracting new citizens, too
Arria Perreault: Hi Gwyn :-)
Jamie Palisades: so
Jamie Palisades: opinions are solicited, including disagree ment :) I see us coming back to the events budget issue in about a month
Jamie Palisades: next point
Jamie Palisades: Burning Life
Cindy Ecksol: jamie can I comment on that?
Justice Soothsayer: nearly out of time here, folks
Cindy Ecksol: not buring life, the "events budget"
Gwyneth Llewelyn says hi...
Justice Soothsayer: 2 more minutes, please.
Gwyneth Llewelyn has indicated consent to be recorded.
Jamie Palisades looks up, waits
Cindy Ecksol: jus twanted to note that the performers were looking around for OUR tip jar....and didn't find it
Jamie Palisades: SIndy? forums for lengthy comment .. short one now?
Cindy Ecksol: they wree surprised to hear that we funded these events
Jamie Palisades: OK - is that good or bad?
Cindy Ecksol: we ought to talk about this -- it's a great selling point for CDS
Jamie Palisades: kk
Jamie Palisades: last item for now :)
Jamie Palisades: and thsx for your patience
Jamie Palisades: CDS has an unofficial camp at Burning Life
Gwyneth Llewelyn: yay :)
Jamie Palisades: it promotes us -- or, rather, it would if advtertising was allowed there :)
Jamie Palisades: which it isn;t
Cindy Ecksol: wow, cool!
Jamie Palisades: so it;s just freebies and um a lot of information :D
Jamie Palisades: and clever re-used of Oktoberfest prims
Rose Springvale: smile, it "educates" about .. democracy in virtual worlds :)
Gwyneth Llewelyn: ;)
Jamie Palisades: I will drop the LM on each of you
Jamie Palisades: NEXT meeting:
Cindy Ecksol now understands why jamie has been bugging her for copies of old posters
Jamie Palisades: Juistice, I woud like us to talk about Arria;s void sinm proposal specifically
Jamie Palisades: (no, Cin, THOSE were for NFS infohaus :) )
Jamie Palisades: Arria and I have been working it through but we both thik that the RA members' opinion woudl be helpful, to bring that proposal to a decision point
Justice Soothsayer: I believe we have void sims on today;s agenda.
Jamie Palisades: all done :) and thans
Jamie Palisades: kk :)
Justice Soothsayer: any other qs for Jamie?
Justice Soothsayer: I guess we have already addressed them, so thanks, Jamie.
Justice Soothsayer: Next item on the agenda is the carryover of the Flag Bill. Has this one ripened to the point of making a decision? There hasnt been much discussion about it.
Rose Springvale raises hand
Justice Soothsayer: Rose?
Rose Springvale: I just want to encourage the adoption of one that doesn't deviate much
Rose Springvale: from what we already have.. we are working hard on branding
Rose Springvale: and if we change much
Rose Springvale: then all the little silly things we put together wont't be as valuable brand wise
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Well the discussion is just on the number of stars really :)
Justice Soothsayer: Claude's proposal is at http://forums.slcds.info//viewtopic.php?f=7&t=2034
Rose Springvale: no, claudes draft changes the look a bit i think
Rose Springvale: to little starts
Rose Springvale: stars, scattered across a blue sky field
Rose Springvale: it is very nice, but... different, imno. don'
Rose Springvale: done :)
Jamie Palisades admits, he likes the 3 stars better too - as rose said, don;t screw up the brand we have .. change for change bad ... reinforcing a stronig 4-year brand in SL, good
Gwyneth Llewelyn: To be honest... the real discussion is about more stars, or placing them differently, since the two-star-flag was for the time we had two sims...
Gwyneth Llewelyn: The rest ? colours and the owl ? mostly remain
Rose Springvale: i still like a star for each sim, and equidistant placement
Pip Torok: good point gwyn
Jamie Palisades: er
Jamie Palisades: do we have to add a star every time?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: That's the old problem... :)
Jamie Palisades: that's a little "USA" isn;t it?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: The EU gave up on adding stars after the 12th... ;)
Rose Springvale: well, i think we need to do SOMETHING to bring new sims in
Arria Perreault: it's too complicate
Jamie Palisades: didn;t claude post somethign about 3 branches of vgov't?
Arria Perreault: a half star for a void sim? ;-)
Jamie Palisades: siiigh
Rose Springvale: i am simply disagreeing :)
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Yes, well, but branches of Government are like stars, they come an dgo... :)
Cindy Ecksol loves arria's idea :-)
Gwyneth Llewelyn smiles @ Arria :)
Jamie Palisades: half star for Ash? .. um, never mind
Gwyneth Llewelyn: LOL
Cindy Ecksol: ah, so sorry I missed the good old days!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: We can always absorb Al Andaluz and get Ash back ;)
Gwyneth Llewelyn *snickers*
Justice Soothsayer: I dont hear a consensus emerging.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: anyway... no, there is none, Justice
Pip Torok: dont we all, cindy!!! :-)
Gwyneth Llewelyn: and I believe we'll never get one :D
Rose Springvale: my point is simply it is hard for new sims .. new people.. to be assimilated
Rose Springvale: this give us a chance to make a big deal about them. ::shrug::
Gwyneth Llewelyn: we can hand them out T-shirts with a star: "Be Your Own Star"!
Arria Perreault: usually flags are very conservative and don't need explanation for each symbol, except historical explanation
Cindy Ecksol: hee hee!!!
Justice Soothsayer: We could have one flag per sim, plus a CDS flag.
Cindy Ecksol: ah, now THERE is an idea!!!
Cindy Ecksol: kind of like state flags in the US
Rose Springvale: but
Gwyneth Llewelyn: True... actually, NFS has its own flag & coat of arms.
Justice Soothsayer: and at Oktoberfest, we link all the sim flags into a patchwork quilt.
Rose Springvale: then we need local rule :0
Arria Perreault: like each town in each country
Bells Semyorka smiles, good bye everyone, RL is calling. see you soon.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: aww Rose... lol
Rose Springvale favors some !
Cindy Ecksol: bye bells!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: bye Bells :)
Arria Perreault: bye bye Bells
Justice Soothsayer: OK gang, before we lose everyone, we need to move on to webmaster and void sims, so lets continue the flag tak another time.
Rose Springvale: ah, lets just vote on it..
Arria Perreault: we could make a survey
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Well I like the idea of "one flag per sim"... but I agree, there is still no consensus at all
Rose Springvale: sigh.
Arria Perreault: one flag per sim: our C means Confederation ;-)
Jamie Palisades: Justice? Does flag matter enough for you to do a quick straw poll of those voting, among the 2 or 3 options that are on table?
Jamie Palisades: or does it need to "cook" more?
Justice Soothsayer: RA? Your thoughts? Straw vote, more forum discusion?
Arria Perreault: survey in population
Rose Springvale: i'd like to see something done! . i don't care what :)
Justice Soothsayer: well Rose, doing nothing is doing something, as it leaves our current flag in place.
Jamie Palisades looks around for typey gestures, shrugs
Rose Springvale: but you CAN adopt a new one :)
Rose Springvale: and no one wanted to just keep old
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (and back...)
Justice Soothsayer: sorry, netowrk problems
Arria Perreault: wb Gwyn
Jamie Palisades: hm
Jamie Palisades: Justice havign a bad day
Jamie Palisades: network swise - he poofed again
Rose Springvale apologizes, but need to go back to rl...
Rose Springvale: I'll be looking for reports on the soccer game!!
Arria Perreault: see you soon, Rose :-)
Rose Springvale: :)
Gwyneth Llewelyn: strange, I wonder if it's connected to LA somehow?...
Gwyneth Llewelyn: and see you, Rose!
Cindy Ecksol: no, or all of us would be vanishing
Jamie Palisades: I have a suggestion, RA members. His next agenda item was webmaster. Would it promote progress to have Arria start talking about that proposal?
Rubaiyat Shatner: we need to copy him on the discussion, but I have no problems with moving forward
Pip Torok: nor me
Jamie Palisades: Ta Rose, thx for coming
Gwyneth Llewelyn: No problems with me either...
Jamie Palisades: Hearing no objections to that ... Arria, unofficially, maybe this is a good time to describe your idea?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: (can we start to turn the old sites off? :-D )
Jamie Palisades: (:) yes please) (and I am writing you about that offline)
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ah perfect!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: at last :))))
Jamie Palisades grins
Gwyneth Llewelyn: So that would be, for starters, neufreistadt.info and slcds.info, all pointing now to portal.slcds.info
Arria Perreault: Can I talk?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Then we have the whole bunch of blogs mmmh
Jamie Palisades: and http://www.slcds.info root page :)
Justice Soothsayer: back, sorry, I crashed
Gwyneth Llewelyn: for colonia nova, guild, masterplan, etc
Jamie Palisades: Justice we were drfiting into webmaster item
Gwyneth Llewelyn: wb Justice!
Jamie Palisades: which tcebnically was about whether the RA wishes to approve a stipendeed position with that description
Jamie Palisades: as ARris proposed and I support -- though duties may need some tweaking
Jamie Palisades: *Arria, sorry
Arria Perreault: Now we have a portal for all our official information, we have to insure it existence
Arria Perreault: someone must be responsible for this portal
Gwyneth Llewelyn agrees, of course.
Arria Perreault: I am not talking about content, which concerns mostly PIO
Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods*
Arria Perreault: but about technical and administrative matters
Gwyneth Llewelyn: So the webmaster would be part of the Executive, right? (it's what makes sense)
Arria Perreault: I propose a new role in the executive team
Arria Perreault: with following tasks:
Arria Perreault: - to own any domain name in the name of CDS
Arria Perreault: - to be contractor for the hosting
Arria Perreault: - to update the version of CMS or insure the migration to another system
Arria Perreault: (today Typo3)
Arria Perreault: - to create new design templates (with the help of a designer)
Arria Perreault: - to manage the users
Jamie Palisades: (CMS - content management system software for serving up text, pictures, etc.)
Arria Perreault: this last task is equivalent to the problem of our groups in CDS
Pip Torok: (what does "manage the users actually mean?)
Jamie Palisades: create and manage accoutns and permissions, Pip
Pip Torok: tku
Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods* and seconds that proposal, just one question though: what about the forums? (the moderators are the SC, per the Constitution)
Jamie Palisades: which Alexi is doing for us rigth now as admin for the Typo3 install on the current portal
Rubaiyat Shatner: I have a few issues that may be more with wording than with intent
Jamie Palisades: rather like Gwyneth does for Forums.slcds.info
Arria Perreault: This CDS Webmaster must also get an appointment
Rubaiyat Shatner: for example the webmaster should be admin rather than owner
Jamie Palisades has a few of therse but others are ctaching them so will reserve comment for a moment
Arria Perreault: admin yes
Rubaiyat Shatner: I would be in favor of redirecting older domains to the new site in the near future too as gwyn seems to be suggesting
Arria Perreault: owner, but in the name of CDS
Rubaiyat Shatner: is there some way to make the CDS the owner? I view Webmaster as a temporary position (well changing at some time in the future)
Arria Perreault: my last remark: I think that this role may not change every term
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Oh yes, RUba, the old sites are simply worthless now that most of the important information has been migrated...
Arria Perreault: beacause it's very complicated
Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods* @ Arria
Arria Perreault: this role is a little like the role of treasurer
Rubaiyat Shatner: I agree, but it will likely change at some time in the future
Jamie Palisades: Seems to me we all agree in principle. I had a few little wording concerns -- like, given the CDS law making the forums a domain of the SC, we may need ot be clear that the webmaster position's control is not necessarily over all resources -- may I suggests that I work with Arria on a revised wording for the legislation and bring it back at the next meeting?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok, and remember the Wiki too...
Pip Torok: well if this role does not change each term(tho laudable) does mean that a fresh precedence is being set
Jamie Palisades: and in the meantime we will go ahead to consoluidate all the websites - which does NOT require legislative action
Justice Soothsayer: Yes, I think we need a bill that can be posted on the forums for public comment, but there is a consensus that we need a webmaster position.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: ("ok" as in: I'm also fine with the revision of the proposed text for voting on the next session)
Jamie Palisades: exactly pip - but our law covers that, we just need to say so clearly :)
Arria Perreault: I am talking mostly about the portal
Rubaiyat Shatner: I would also like the webmaster to be responsible for a backup
Jamie Palisades nods
Rubaiyat Shatner: of data
Jamie Palisades: amen :)
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Indeed, Ruba!
Arria Perreault: we can have several website, official or not
Rubaiyat Shatner: (perhaps even a public one)
Arria Perreault: the portal give information and access to other ressources
Justice Soothsayer: Jamie, if you and Arria could post a draft by the end of the week, that should be enough time so that we could pass something on 12 October.
Rubaiyat Shatner: and to monitor the sites esp for uptime
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Aaah yes, Arria, but some things are pretty much obsolete these days!...
Jamie Palisades: Can do, as long as Arria and I can handle it back and forth by e-mail before then
Arria Perreault: like?
Jamie Palisades: colonia nova blog
Gwyneth Llewelyn: The wiki; the Colonia Nova blog...
Jamie Palisades: neufreistadt.ino
Jamie Palisades: .info
Arria Perreault: yes, I know
Gwyneth Llewelyn: yes, neufreistadt.info and slcds.info can be moved away *now*
Rubaiyat Shatner: and can we make sure that the old sites are archived and not deleted?
Jamie Palisades: aliaisi's laws site, now superceded (may the gods bless publius)
Arria Perreault: for example, all the laws are now migrated on the portal
Jamie Palisades: Rubiyat: heh heh we can ASK =-- which is the point. They're all volunteer resources
Arria Perreault: each sim has a page (or more)
Gwyneth Llewelyn: well sure, Ruba :) I'd be happy to send the backups to anyone that wishes a copy of those two :D
Arria Perreault: we still have to work on the content
Jamie Palisades: someone - CSDF I think - starting asking us to make it offical, what, 3 terms ago? We're getting around to it now
Cindy Ecksol: lol!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: hehe
Justice Soothsayer: We are now out of time
Jamie Palisades: and (smile) we will. This term. All of it.
Rubaiyat Shatner: Gwyn, I am happy to setup a public archive (for historical porpoises) of these in google or some such
Cindy Ecksol thinks jamie's starting to look like an "activist" chancellor
Jamie Palisades: Me and Sarko. Next up - fly to Iran?
Cindy Ecksol: oy!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Sure, Ruba, I'll make sure to give you a copy before pointing those two addresses to portal.slcds.info
Justice Soothsayer: I'm willing to continue to discuss the void sims, but how long are the remaining RA members able to stay?
Cindy Ecksol: let's not go there....
Arria Perreault: we are trying to save also some historical pages ...
Rubaiyat Shatner: I have about 10-15 min
Arria Perreault: I have time :-)
Gwyneth Llewelyn is fine in staying.
Pip Torok: can stay as long as you'd like ...
Rubaiyat Shatner: I have seen too many websites shut down and get lost, call it paranoia or experience...
Cindy Ecksol: hey, four years is ancient in SL time!!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: hehe good point :D
Jamie Palisades: :)
Justice Soothsayer: OK, let;s move on. WE also have the void sims proposal on the agenda for discussion; Arria or Jamie, care to discuss?
Jamie Palisades: ARria? You first or me?
Arria Perreault: I can make short remarks
Jamie Palisades: :)
Arria Perreault: The Monastery is managed by a NGO, Virtus
Arria Perreault: it is now on AM
Arria Perreault: our idea is to move it on a void sims
Arria Perreault: for several reasons
Arria Perreault: one is to give it more visibility and more space
Arria Perreault: the other is to build a new way of financing it, better for its future
Arria Perreault: the idea is the following:
Arria Perreault: the Monastery is set on a group owned plot
Arria Perreault: on the void sim, we will create around 6 plots with a small cottages and few prims
Arria Perreault: (wow of poverty ;-)
Cindy Ecksol: appropriate for a monastery :-)
Arria Perreault: the different owner will share the fees of the whole void sim
Jamie Palisades: What does share mena, Arria?
Jamie Palisades: *mean
Arria Perreault: share is pay together
Arria Perreault: and they use the Monastery for their projetcts
Arria Perreault: so the Monastery will not depend anymore on one person, like now
Arria Perreault: it's better for its future
Arria Perreault: now I have asked to get good conditions for this void sim
Jamie Palisades smiles - almost done?
Arria Perreault: so CDS must buy it for us
Arria Perreault: I cannot buy it myself, because I am not an island owner
Arria Perreault: done
Jamie Palisades: OK.
Jamie Palisades: Let me call your attention to our legal framework for adding sims. Summarised by me unofficially here:
Jamie Palisades: http://forums.slcds.info/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=2067
Jamie Palisades: There are four ways to do this: (1) a typical CDS-takes-risk plan like AM and LA ... (2) the InTheme Expansion Act under the CDS Masterplan ... (3) private expansion (beathan's bill last time), where developer shares risk with CDS .. and (4) the RA can do anythign else it likes :)
Jamie Palisades: Arria;'s plan, which was posted on the forums over a month ago -
Jamie Palisades: is an instance of #3
Jamie Palisades: but to buy a void you must own one or more sims already
Jamie Palisades: whic Virtus doesnot
Jamie Palisades: so she is asking us (CDS) bascially to front the price and be reimbursed
Jamie Palisades: "front" bveing english colloquial word for "make the payment for someone else"
Arria Perreault: we can finance the project by selling our plot in AM (and I make the bank of course)
Justice Soothsayer: don't void sims also come in 4-packs?
Jamie Palisades: As I understand it
Jamie Palisades: Justice - they can - or you can buy separate now
Gwyneth Llewelyn: No, not any more, Justice
Gwyneth Llewelyn: They used to
Justice Soothsayer: OK
Jamie Palisades: 'frankly I had originally thought aabout adding four
Jamie Palisades: there are teh advantages
Jamie Palisades: but
Jamie Palisades: :) economy conservatism
Jamie Palisades: for now
Jamie Palisades: so what's being proposed is in a nutshell for use to do a transaction with Virtus as a developer under the PDP act
Jamie Palisades: but with a void
Jamie Palisades: and with us buyinf the sim and being reimbursed by Virtus
Jamie Palisades: sop the novelty from a CDS law pioint of view is that we take the credit risk of Virtus' obligation to pay
Jamie Palisades: and it is expected that, liek any PDP project defined b that law
Rubaiyat Shatner: and what happens if she defaults or decides to sell?
Arria Perreault: alone I cannot
Jamie Palisades: .... CDS takes title to the sim at the end fo the same period
Jamie Palisades: :D Rubiyat- excellent Q
Jamie Palisades: under Beathen'a bill
Jamie Palisades: what we were expecting is, if they did not finish it or sell ou sufficiently
Jamie Palisades: or just vansihed or defauylts
Jamie Palisades: then CDS' remedy was to never take title to the Sim L:)
Jamie Palisades: a rememdy unavaiable to us if we buy it for them up front
Gwyneth Llewelyn: What means "buy for them"?...
Jamie Palisades: thus ARria and I felt we shoud come get feedvack here fiorst, as a special RA act woudl be required in this case
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I mean, who remains the Estate Owner on that sim?
Jamie Palisades: Gwyn, only owners of existing sims can order coids
Jamie Palisades: voids
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Yes, but once bought,
Jamie Palisades: do today Virtus and ARria cannot GET a void
Jamie Palisades: *s
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok... perhaps I'm just misunderstanding things :)
Jamie Palisades: is it permitted by Linden labs for us to sell a single voice, after ourchase, to a non-sim-owner?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Probably not.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I've never asked :))
Arria Perreault: I don't think
Jamie Palisades: if so we could - but then the would sell it back to us, subbject to a viability condition, once "ready to deliver"
Gwyneth Llewelyn: But in any case, under this model, what IS being proposed?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: That the CDS owns the sim from the beginning and just rents it to the Monsatery group? I'm fine with that.
Arria Perreault: in my opinion, it will be like any other CDS sims
Gwyneth Llewelyn: 'rent' as in: gives a deed to the Monastery NGO to use the space
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok Arria
Gwyneth Llewelyn: That would be my opinion too!
Arria Perreault: but with 6 plots instead of 20-30
Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods* @ Arria
Jamie Palisades: and the plan also permitts us to create another tenancy or two on it if we wish
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ok :) I have no objections at all in that case :D
Arria Perreault: and the Monastery will be a kind of public place
Rubaiyat Shatner: it would seem possible to solve a lot of this through a contract, or to retain some level of ownership while the sim is attached to the CDS. I will have to look through Bethans bill for more info though too.
Jamie Palisades: Correct, Rubaiyat. Have done. but Beathan's bill will not technically apply as no developer is taking to ownership risk.
Justice Soothsayer: It is helpful to think of this as buying a mini-sim for which the lots have already been reserved.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: If it's bought by the CDS... and paid by a group... I don't see any difference from any other sim, except for one thing: there is no need for the usual "public announcement of available plots"
Arria Perreault: it works only with private island
Cindy Ecksol: well....arria is taking the "development risk" no?
Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods* @ Jamie & Arria
Arria Perreault: yes
Cindy Ecksol: or virtus is maybe
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Justice: YES!
Arria Perreault: we can finance it by selling our plot in AM
Jamie Palisades: so it comes down to whether ARris' group can present a rough plan which involves (a) a voice, (b) a few other lots, (c) coordination with Guild, then executive for theme, financial feasibiliuty and land fit, and then (c) RA approval.
Rubaiyat Shatner: I am interested in the idea, and interested in the minimum legislation to accomplish it
Arria Perreault: it's neutral cost
Jamie Palisades: fooey typos - but I think maybe you can reaad what I typed anyway
Jamie Palisades: um
Jamie Palisades: it;s neutral cost IF the tenats materialize and persist, smile
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I don't think there might even be needed any 'additional' legislation actually... like Justice said, this is pretty much like a new sim where all plots are ordered in advance.
Cindy Ecksol nods
Arria Perreault: yes
Jamie Palisades: Gywn, that's option 1 in my old piost - and new sims DO require several steps, oen of which at the end is RA map & price approval :)
Jamie Palisades: so new legislation no, but fiscal approval yes
Arria Perreault: the only thing we would like to ask is a good price for land and fees
Arria Perreault: either LL price or very close
Jamie Palisades: you may recall that with Locus Amoeus, the RA did give a basic assent - and then executive & guild worked out details. I do think we always should have RA assent to at least the act of adding a new sim.
Cindy Ecksol: in other words, on this sim, CDS will not have any "profit" because there is no risk to CDS per se...
Rubaiyat Shatner: How is there no risk?
Cindy Ecksol: CDS does not have to worry about occupying the plots -- virtus will handle that
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ah
Jamie Palisades: ... and so would proceed SORT OF like LA .. except Arris' group acts like the guild to propose plan and polots, then brings it for "it" approval
Arria Perreault: yes, and because we are a NGO
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Jamie, you're right of course.
Cindy Ecksol: virtus will pay "full tier" (whatever we decide) even if plots are not occupied
Jamie Palisades: ...
Cindy Ecksol: so the only risk is that virtus would back out...in which case we could just sell the sim to someone else
Cindy Ecksol: or let it die of course.
Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods* yes, well, basically the same level of risk that teh CDS always has when rolling a new sim out!
Gwyneth Llewelyn: To be honest ? LESS risk.
Jamie Palisades smiles. Ahem ... what I hear CIndy saying is that all rentable land will be rented by Virtus at first, in whatever we we consent to the parcel map ... and then it can sell it off .. is that correctly what both Cindy and Arria understand?
Justice Soothsayer: yes, less risk, becuase tier is lower & acquisition cost is lower.
Cindy Ecksol: no, not really. with LA we priced it so that if some plots were unoccupied the tier could still be paid
Rubaiyat Shatner: if Virtus pays the initial fees and agrees to cover tier I have no problem with passing along costs and basically full privs (and covenant?)
Gwyneth Llewelyn: "it can sell it off" ? who is IT in that sentence, Jamie?
Jamie Palisades: ... I thi what I am sayign is consistent with Rubai's comment also .. Gwyn, if there are 5 plots on VoidFoo ...
Jamie Palisades: monastery plus four ...
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ah....
Jamie Palisades: the Virtus rents all five at first ...
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Wow, I see this starts to get complicated... why are there 5 plots? There is just the Monastery BGO...
Gwyneth Llewelyn: *NGO
Jamie Palisades: .. anmd can sell the rest as it sees fit, like nany otyher CDS landlowner
Rubaiyat Shatner: virtus handles rent as well and is our "tennant" who then sublets?
Jamie Palisades: :) other plots to make it more econmically feasible for the decveloper
Arria Perreault: 6 plots + Monastery
Jamie Palisades: like any development
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ah so it's NOT like any other sim then hmm
Jamie Palisades: :) whatever, sorry, havenm;t seen a nmap yet
Arria Perreault: the idea is to share the fees
Gwyneth Llewelyn: So CDS would be investing in a sim for the Monastery to speculate on the real estate market? :-)
Arria Perreault: there are two ways to do it:
Jamie Palisades: ARria? DO you mena that, once fully sold, the land rents from the 6 'tenat's woudl be split by virtus and CDS?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: ^^
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I'm afraid this needs a bit more discussion, or I have to read the forums better!...
Arria Perreault: 1. people pay directly to CDS and become citizen
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Yes.
Rubaiyat Shatner: agreed more discussion is necessary
Rubaiyat Shatner: but in principle I am in favor of this
Arria Perreault: the arrangement is that I take them all at the beginning to be sure that fees are paid
Pip Torok: as am I
Jamie Palisades agrees - nneds work - but is grateful for this chance to hash out some details and issues
Arria Perreault: 2. Virtus pay as group and make a kind of "renting": in this case no citizenship
Justice Soothsayer thinks this is a very helpful discussion
Gwyneth Llewelyn: I thought it was something completely different and far more easier...
Cindy Ecksol: ah, so the question that arises is how new members of Arria's group would relate to CDS citizenship
Jamie Palisades smiles softly - me too, at first
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Indeed, Cindy, something that I would prefer to avoid :D
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Why so complicated, Arria?
Arria Perreault: I will try to recruit new members outside CDS
Cindy Ecksol: I think I understand that her group is going to own all the "plots"
Jamie Palisades: Tiem to take this to further one on one chats, team?
Arria Perreault: the number of plots/cottage will be fix
Cindy Ecksol: people can become members of the group and contribute tier....but will they be CDS citizens?
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Just let it be a regular sim (even if it's a void) where all plots are pre-owned by CDS citizens, all in the same group. So simple and doesn't require any legislation ? just a pre-approval by the RA & Guild, and we can order the new sim tomorrow :)
Arria Perreault: if we take the first solution, yes
Justice Soothsayer: Looks like once again Jamie and Arria have some drafting work to do.
Arria Perreault: with the second, no
Cindy Ecksol: I like gwyn's solution
Jamie Palisades: I;d like to tha nk Arria and her organization for beingin us this proposal. i think it's a cool idea and might work , even though we need carefully to specify details.
Arria Perreault: yes, it's the easiest way
Jamie Palisades: And Gwyn? Works EXCEPT we need fiscal feasibility study first
Cindy Ecksol: any drawbacks from your point of view Arria?
Jamie Palisades smiles his pennypinching skeptic smile
Arria Perreault: no
Justice Soothsayer: OK gang, we are at 2 hours and counting.
Cindy Ecksol: time to get ready for soccer :-)
Rubaiyat Shatner: I need to go shortly here.
Gwyneth Llewelyn: lol
Pip Torok: and me
Justice Soothsayer: Are you ready for some football?
Cindy Ecksol needs to change and warm up :-)
Jamie Palisades glances over at the flower wearer and wave s- stil some thigns for us to discuss :)
Arria Perreault: ok. we will works into details. thank you anyway for supporting the general idea
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Defenitely! More sims is GOOD :D
Gwyneth Llewelyn: We'll have to catch up with Caledon... hehe
Gwyneth Llewelyn: Ah, how appropriate that the CDS got a plot for Burning Life in a sim called Chaos... :D
Cindy Ecksol wonders if jamie is talking to her about "things to discuss"
Jamie Palisades: mm hmmm :)
Justice Soothsayer: All right, I'm afraid I have to leave soon too, so can we adjourn?
Gwyneth Llewelyn seconds the motion to adjourn :)
Arria Perreault: aye for adjournment
Jamie Palisades: Thanks all :)
Justice Soothsayer: Thanks all, w are adjourned.
The meeting closed at 11:6 Linden time.

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