Moderator: SC Moderators
The next CSDF General Meeting will take place on:
Thursday 3 August at 3pm at my new home in Neufreistadt off the Lowlands Road (137, 21, 123)
Agenda
1. Bills for upcoming RA meeting
2. Constitutional Revision Planning Festival
3. Progress on CSDF website
This is an open meeting so all citizens of Neufreistadt are welcome to attend 
[color=Black:1xaehll4][i:1xaehll4]Object-Name: notetaker 2.0.1[/i:1xaehll4][/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Sienna:1xaehll4][i:1xaehll4]Region: Neufreistadt (246528, 249600)[/i:1xaehll4][/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOliveGreen:1xaehll4][i:1xaehll4]Local-Position: (135, 10, 123)[/i:1xaehll4][/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkGreen:1xaehll4][i:1xaehll4]Meeting on 2006-08-03[/i:1xaehll4][/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateBlue:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Those present[/b:1xaehll4]: [/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][i:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami is in the chair.[/i:1xaehll4][/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Indigo:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Ashcroft Burnham[/b:1xaehll4]: /waves[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: thank you Ash [/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: goodnight ash[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: I hope to see you soon![/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: Nice to meet you Ask[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Indigo:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Ashcroft Burnham[/b:1xaehll4]: Likewise [/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][i:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle waves[/i:1xaehll4][/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][i:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn has indicated consent to be recorded.[/i:1xaehll4][/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][i:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle has indicated consent to be recorded.[/i:1xaehll4][/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: kk, did everyone get the agenda from the forums?[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][i:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle looks[/i:1xaehll4][/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: if so, can u remind me of item 1[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: btw pls touch the recorder etc etc...[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: back [/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][i:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant has indicated consent to be recorded.[/i:1xaehll4][/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: 1. Bills for upcoming RA meeting[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: 2. Constitutional Revision Planning Festival[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: 3. Progress on CSDF website[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: ty jon. i suggest we take the bills in this order: 1. Executive 2. Civil Service 3. Referendum and 4. Fundraising (if we need to) then 5. Flag! and 6. Budget (tho i haven't had time toread it)[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: ok?[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][i:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn hasn't read them all yet, sorry.[/i:1xaehll4][/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: So please go ahead.[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: fine for me too [/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: hehe, never mind [/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: so executive, would jon or moon like to begin? (good work by the way)[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: I've not read the budget yet[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: thanks lol[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][i:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn thanks you both for your good work 
[/i:1xaehll4][/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: and me neither[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: Oh, thanks[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: ... I've just read about Executive, I think 
[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: Exec was mainly Moon's work.[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: and Civil Service was Jon's[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: gr8 work on both. they must have taken some time[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: lol, it was interesting [/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: anyway[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: hmm.. civil service was a lot less work. The tricky issues are with the exec.[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: hmmm[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: did you email something about Budget, Pat?[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: or posted?[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: no. but claude has posted the budget proposal on the forum, unfortunately it's in a format i can't read 
[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: ah[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: aw[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: i tell you Gwyn, the alarms in the forums aren't working for me[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: but first, on the executive proposal. is this one u want to propose at the next RA?[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: Ah, what format?[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][i:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn makes notes on forums limitations.[/i:1xaehll4][/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: well...[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: btw, i did get your mail about the amendment/bill question[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: and i am not sure of teh answer there[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: Yes.[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: Perhaps I might give you my thoughts on that...[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: Open office. Hmm..[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: If you don't mind?[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: gwyn would be the expert here[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: Not really, lol,[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][i:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami listens to gwyn[/i:1xaehll4][/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: more likely, a possible strategy [/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: listens to Gwyn[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: Basically, we have two options.[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: Since we know that Claude tends to say that the RA has all executive powers, and can delegate them,[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: this could be a RA bill, plain and simple.[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: It would mean, however, that we assume the Guild and SC never had executive powers.[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: Actually, "traditionally", this is not true,[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: indeed[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: but formally I think it might be correct.[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: nods[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: Ie. there is no explicit telling on the Constitution of what executive powers are distributed among all three branches.[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: Sooo[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: Strategy #1. DPU wants to delegate executive powers into several branches,[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: CSDF proposes this bill instead [/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: Strategy #2: DPU notices that an amendment is required to do so much dramatic changes,[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: we would probably agree, but also agree that *several other things* would need to be amended,[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: sooo: constititunal reform (which Claude is not so fond of )[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: laughs[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: So, the compromise here is: Claude, do you want a *deep* const. reform? The CSDF will back you on that [/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: there is a 3rd alternative, i think[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: Ah![/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: listens[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: Let's hear that.[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: go ahead moon[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: break this doc into 2 docs[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: awww[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: one becomes the amendment, and it is the definition of the Executive, election, etc[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: "divide and conquer" [/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: those are the things that don't change every term[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: and make a Bill passing the Executive Actions for this term[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: what do you think? is this feasible?[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: Right, Moon. I only mentioned the hypothesis of "just a bill",[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: because it would mean that at a later stage, the RA would be able to change it easier,[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: Part of the question, I think, is how to we want this kind of change to work in the future[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: i have to say, i think this kind of change *has* to be a constitutional change[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: i agree with pat[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: while "pressing" for a Const. Amendment, Claude will very likely propose his own alternative instead, and would need an agreement on that.[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: I agree.[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: i'm a stickler for constl niceties[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: but we could present the bill..[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: since we are tinkering with the structure and powers of teh state?[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: in order to force their hand [/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: hehe yes,[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: and finally defining where the executive powers *are*[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: A question. What part of the exec bill would not need an amendment?[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: i think it's important that we have a clear statement that is constitutionally correct. how keen is the dpu on this idea?[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: the listing of Executive actions[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: Yes, those are mostly procedural.[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: So we really have the split allready.[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: The DPU *wants* an executive,[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: but one elected from the population.[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: Yes, US style.. but it is problematic[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: yes, also they can change with time and needs of teh government[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: That's the issue here, Jon.[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: Why should the DPU vote for this bill if it is an amendment against their own ideas? [/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][i:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle nods[/i:1xaehll4][/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: but they could vote for the listing of Executive Actions only, mind you[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: well, i favour a parliament/cabinet system but i can see how a directly elected exec could work. if it's elected at the sam time as the RA the differnce is somehat moot[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: Ok.[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: So is there room for compromise?[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: shall we put the bill forward in order to stimulate debate?[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: I think that's a good idea.[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: well, our Cabinet proposal in campaign did set some minds spinning[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: Aye, hehe[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: I saw Claude positively fuming [/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: But also curious,[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: Pat, my issue it that a direct election for a president or some such might be more of a popularity contest.[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: which is always a good sign.[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: i' say yes too[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: Jon, I totally agree.[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: Claude made it clear that the Executive and the Senate would be "partyless" elections,[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: that worried me, exactly for that reason.[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: exactly, Gwyn[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: yup[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: so it's a Best Avatar in Bikini contest...[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: [/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][i:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle laughs[/i:1xaehll4][/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: Aye, indeed. Perhaps not "yet", but who can tell in a few years?[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: i think that is naive. how could u prevent them from being partyless? even if u mandate that they are nto faction positions., we will 'bless' our preferred candidate[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: Oh. I meant as a question of principle, mostly, Pat.[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: yes, of course Pat, you're 200 % right[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: Also hmm, consider the following...[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: i think that the executive proposal is a 'month to debate and agree' kind of issue[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: NFS was built on the premise that it's rules by ideas[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: ideas are embodied in factions.[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: so that's august sorted[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: Now, Claude's suggesting something slightly different ? that NFS is ruled by single people. Soooo imagine,[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: what would be the Executive's programme,[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: Well, of course. But then people may begin voting for a party based on the popular candidate rather than a slate and platform[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: and what would the parties running for the RA use as their own programme?[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][i:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods* @ Jon[/i:1xaehll4][/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][i:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant nods at Jon and Gwyn[/i:1xaehll4][/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][i:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle agrees with Gwyn[/i:1xaehll4][/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: Whereas our proposed model does fit in the way NFS was thought to work... people have ideas, and naturally, they get voted for their ideas. Sure, some need to lead [/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: i think the bill also lists clearly teh checks and balances...[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: ho would DPU model be checked?[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: That is actually the only reason I have "against" two different types of elections for two bodies, legislative and executive, but if that's all we can compromise on... the DPU *has* a majority...[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: well, we haven't seen the detial of their proposal yet![/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: I am mainly concerned about strategy here.. can we stop a partyless executive, if so, how?[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: Moon, just by the votes on the next term,[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: so, well, since we don't have Claude's proposal...[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: so you're stuck with someone you elected on a bikini contest ... [/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: And Jon, there is still the possibility of feigning that a constitutional revision is needed, and that one should make it an amendment ? and vote against [/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: But that might backfire, actually.[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: if it has to be a constl amendment it puts us in a stronger position[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: hmmmmm[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: our support is needed for it to pass[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: the thing here is[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: What about turning the table on the DPU? Asking them, "we'll go for your model if you explain to us why your model won't be just a 'popularity contest'".[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: the DPU can't also pass their porposal wth a Const amend, i think[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: no moon, they need a 2/3 majority and they only have 60% of the seats in the RA[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: so i agree with pat that we may have a point of stranght here[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: What do we do if the DPU tries to pass without an amendment? I doubt they will do that, but..[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: yes[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: but how can they?[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: they have to remove the Artisan Branch from Const, right?[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: You yell at the forums, asking for the SC to veto it [/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: lol[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: yes[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][i:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle giggles at Gwyn's suggestion[/i:1xaehll4][/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: lol[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: one second.... my apologies for shouting, but...[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: indeed. create a shitstorm around abuse of power, tyranny, coup etc[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: Hello, Rudy![/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: lol Pat[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: Sorry about that. Our newbie professor forgets to check for IMs.[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: [/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: And Pat hehe[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][i:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle smiles[/i:1xaehll4][/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: As said, the problem here is just figuring out if this can't backfire.[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: ie. they might pull that strategy as well.[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: yes.[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: could we present our proposal as an idea for discussion rather than a bill?[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: well, but it's US who wants the Const reform[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: what strategy might they pull gwyn?[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: Well, they might need a constitutional amendment on *their* proposal as well,[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: Gwyn[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: they'll try to pass everything as Bills[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][i:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn listens.[/i:1xaehll4][/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: you heard Claude[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: They'll *try* yes.[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: So you think they're at a diasvantage?[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: Anyway... I'll be back in a minute.[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: 'only minimal changes to Const...'[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: yes, i do[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: yes, and this would be a major one. Ok, I agree with you on that [/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: I think they are stuck with a major change..[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: i think that if teh discussion turns to Const we'll have a strong position[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: Removing one branch of government is not going to me minor[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: well, but we DID try to tell them that they couldn't do it without a rform[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: claude admitted in the debate that they're plans for guild reform would require constl amendment[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][i:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle nods[/i:1xaehll4][/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: *their[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: yes, but minimal amends[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: he said[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: I think we should present this work, pretty much as it is, as a proposal for const reform. But should we wait until they have made their propoal?[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: i think we should make the running[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: get our proposal out first[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: okay. What do you think Moon?[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: hmmm[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: i have no definite opinion yet... on one hand i feel like pushing the reform, lol - because it is obvious that we need it[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: hi yoge. welcom[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: Yoge is here![/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: yea![/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: on the other, i'd like to see their proposal... a cautious thing [/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: Hello[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: namaste, Yoge [/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Olive:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Yogeswari Padar[/b:1xaehll4]: namaste, all! did i miss an email?[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: Ah, did you see the two bill proposals we sent out? Oh, the meeting..[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Olive:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Yogeswari Padar[/b:1xaehll4]: (didn't know this meeting was happening)[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: Sorry, it did not occur to me that you left the last one[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: before we set this one.[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: i didnt' email about the meeting yoge, only posted on the forum. i'll email a reminder in future [/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Olive:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Yogeswari Padar[/b:1xaehll4]: i'm sorry, i've been so busy in RL that i haven't been reading the forum... need to make time for that! [/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: Yes, we should make sure it goes to the email list.[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: Did you see the two proposals (one const. amendment and the other a bill on Civil Service?)[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: the thing is... if we had a third party in RA it would not be such a dilemma, i think[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Olive:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Yogeswari Padar[/b:1xaehll4]: i haven't seen them yet, jon, let me check my gmail...[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Olive:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Yogeswari Padar[/b:1xaehll4]: wow, i've missed a lot this week!![/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: we've spent a lot of time discussing the exec proposal. have we come to a conclusion?[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: shall we move the discussion on and then make a decision when gwyn gets back?[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: I would like to have Gwyn's input too if possible.[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: hmmm, i don't think we have yet Pat[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: yes, please move on[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: ok, we have 8 mins to discuss the civil service bill before we go over to the red house for part 2 of the meeting [/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: over to u[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: This one, I think, does not require a const amendment.[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: yes jon, i agree[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: And it could work with any executive[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: i agree, it's only administrative[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: yes, teh text is very clever in that [/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: is the aim to codify existing practice or enable the future expansion of the civil service? or is this connnected with guild reform? i.e. doing away with it[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: well...[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: Yes, this is replacing the guild[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: the thing is[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: IF you could have a surety of passing the bill of executive actions, you could link this one to that immediately, by saying that the CS has tasks belonging to executive actions delegated on ihem[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: but we want to enable a CS regardless of the executive we end up with[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Green:1xaehll4][i:1xaehll4]*Pose Ball- Meditate 1: Yogeswari Padar, say 'Hide' to hide me, or 'Show' to make me show. Or just right-click and sit on me to use me.[/i:1xaehll4][/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: yes, that is why i think this text is very clever[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: i think that the issue here is[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: i feel happier about putting this one out for discussion as it is[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: this bill may very possible pass as it is - while Executive bill will have the DPU totally against[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: SO[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: Yes, I think this one would get support on their side[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: by that fact only the DPU may pass this one on[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: since they would pulling one dowm, they would feel perhaps more compelled to pass the other [/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: i would put this one too as it is too[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: hmm not sure i follow your reasoning moon but i think we are agreed this can go out for discussion on the forum, yes?[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: yes[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: oh, Pat, is a psychological thing [/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: Sure[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: ok [/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: right, let's close this meeting and head over to the red house for our open public meeiting, as opposed ot our open general meeting![/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Teal:1xaehll4][i:1xaehll4]The meeting closed at 16:2 Linden time.[/i:1xaehll4][/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][i:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle laughs and sometimes wishes avs were more gacefull[/i:1xaehll4][/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Olive:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Yogeswari Padar[/b:1xaehll4]: lol[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: pls touch etc etc[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][i:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant has indicated consent to be recorded.[/i:1xaehll4][/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][i:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle has indicated consent to be recorded.[/i:1xaehll4][/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Olive:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Yogeswari Padar[/b:1xaehll4]: unfortunately, the ungraceful part is much like me in RL [/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Olive:1xaehll4][i:1xaehll4]Yogeswari Padar has indicated consent to be recorded.[/i:1xaehll4][/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: k. i guess we can start where we left off at teh G-M, bills for the next RA meeting[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: oh, here comes gwyn[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Olive:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Yogeswari Padar[/b:1xaehll4]: here's gwyn[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: Sorry, my deepest apologies[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: Hi Gwyn![/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: pfff gwyn[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Olive:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Yogeswari Padar[/b:1xaehll4]: hi gwyn[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: hi hi Yoge [/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Olive:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Yogeswari Padar[/b:1xaehll4]: thanks for the heads up, gwyn[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: ah you're welcome![/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: Do we want to quickly revist strategy on the exec proposal[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: yes, jon[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: If it's only for my benefit... I'm sorry about that [/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: Oh, no, Gwyn, we need your input[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: but thank you nevertheless![/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: One question is if we should go ahaid immedeartly[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: and propose it as a const. amendment.[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: btw this Rudy guy wants to create a revolutionary movement for SL world-wide democracy haha[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle[/b:1xaehll4]: or perhaps, wait for DPU's proposal[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: Ok[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: I think that the last I heard when going away,[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkRed:1xaehll4][i:1xaehll4]Jon Seattle laughs[/i:1xaehll4][/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Olive:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Yogeswari Padar[/b:1xaehll4]: wow, he's jumping right in![/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: Yoge, you should have seen him discussing Esperanto dialects with two other Esperantoists, lol[/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Navy:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1xaehll4]: vive la revolucion![/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: he's cool [/color:1xaehll4]
[color=Olive:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Yogeswari Padar[/b:1xaehll4]: my alt had to help him get a box off of his head this afternoon [/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1xaehll4]: Anyway... expect a Freedomist Party soon [/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkOrange:1xaehll4][b:1xaehll4]Moon Adamant[/b:1xaehll4]: he did seem very nice indeed [/color:1xaehll4]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: yes, he does, and he's quite open as well. Also, great sense of humour [/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkRed:1tw153hy][i:1tw153hy]Jon Seattle thinks a rev. moment may be difficult to do with so many US-style libertarians[/i:1tw153hy][/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: Anywayyyyyyyy[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: oh, i hope so, multipartidarism is more fumn [/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Olive:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Yogeswari Padar[/b:1tw153hy]: we digress [/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: (and lol yes Jon, that's what I told him!)[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: We do indeed, Yoge![/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][i:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami knocks hammer on wood. order, order![/i:1tw153hy][/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Olive:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Yogeswari Padar[/b:1tw153hy]: lol[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: lol[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: jon, u were outlining our options[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: So, as said, the last I "heard" was about publishing the proposed bill and have a one-day public discussion.[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: is that the dpu plan?[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: or ours?[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: I think it was ours?? hehe[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: let me check on history.[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: "Patroklus Murakami: could we present our proposal as an idea for discussion rather than a bill?"[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: sounds like me[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: Aye...[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: lol[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: lol[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: i don't like the idea of presenting a bill but i think we should take the lead on this[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: hmmm,then let's do it?[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkRed:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Jon Seattle[/b:1tw153hy]: That might work. Or otherwise, go directly to the constitutional route and force a debate.[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: moon is more cautious [/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: well, i always like to know what the other is thinking [/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: but here i think[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: this possibly is one stance in which the DPU will not compromise[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: so better perhaps to stirr teh waters[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: i think we should kick off the debate and highlight the fact that there are three issues 1) bill or const amend 2) cabinet or president ...[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkRed:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Jon Seattle[/b:1tw153hy]: Oh, I think we should present it as a potential const. amend from the start.[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkRed:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Jon Seattle[/b:1tw153hy]: We would perhaps. take "bill" reform off the table.[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: i think that since we pressed it so much in campaign[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: well, let's fire it off[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: Pat, I like that.[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: Moon, I totally agree.[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkRed:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Jon Seattle[/b:1tw153hy]: What happened to Pat?[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: oh[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: Oops. His wifi connection might have dropped him![/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: he has been having a lot of issues with his connection[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: wb Pat![/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkRed:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Jon Seattle[/b:1tw153hy]: Oh oh.[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: Welcome back Ruth! I mean Pat.... hehe[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: No. It seems he can't get in properly...[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkRed:1tw153hy][i:1tw153hy]Jon Seattle falls over[/i:1tw153hy][/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: hmmm, not good[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Olive:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Yogeswari Padar[/b:1tw153hy]: lol[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: Perhaps we can wait a bit?[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: And while we wait,[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkRed:1tw153hy][i:1tw153hy]Jon Seattle nods[/i:1tw153hy][/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: Claude has a challenge...[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: [/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: he wants to know what we should call the "cerimony" on Saturday.[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: oh?[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: ah[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: hmmm[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: "Is the ceremonial ready for Saturday? Salzie and I also had a bit of back and forth on the name. Is it an installation, an induction, a seating, etc.?"[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkRed:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Jon Seattle[/b:1tw153hy]: A dancing in ceremony?[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: No![/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: Seating of the RA[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: That's on the 13th, Jon [/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkRed:1tw153hy][i:1tw153hy]Jon Seattle laughs[/i:1tw153hy][/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Olive:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Yogeswari Padar[/b:1tw153hy]: lol[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkRed:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Jon Seattle[/b:1tw153hy]: wb![/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Olive:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Yogeswari Padar[/b:1tw153hy]: in the US we call them "swearing-in" ceremonies[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: wb Pat! [/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Olive:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Yogeswari Padar[/b:1tw153hy]: wb pat[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: not sure what happpend there[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkRed:1tw153hy][i:1tw153hy]Jon Seattle is glad Pat is no longer Ruth, because it was getting him confused[/i:1tw153hy][/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: laptop must be too hot[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][i:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant laughs[/i:1tw153hy][/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: how long was i ruthd?[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: one minute or so[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkRed:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Jon Seattle[/b:1tw153hy]: Just for a moment two times.[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: a few seconds, before you crashed again [/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Olive:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Yogeswari Padar[/b:1tw153hy]: yoge's not confused, all her friends are gender-benders [/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: uugh! did u take pictures?[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: lol Yoge![/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: lol yoge[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: Awww Pat ? the thought did not cross my mind [/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: lol, pat, why would anyone want pictures of Ruth? [/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][i:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami is happy to be a gender-bender[/i:1tw153hy][/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: Pat, we were just briefly discussing something Claude asked:[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: "Is the ceremonial ready for Saturday? Salzie and I also had a bit of back and forth on the name. Is it an installation, an induction, a seating, etc.?"[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: were were we?[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: Yoge suggested "swearing-in" cerimony.[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: sure, whatever u want to call it[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: lol, i think they don't know either[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: better call it the Thingy once and for all[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: have u ever had one before?[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: no, first time[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Olive:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Yogeswari Padar[/b:1tw153hy]: lol, i like "The Thingy"[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: Well, the swearing in is new,[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkRed:1tw153hy][i:1tw153hy]Jon Seattle laughs[/i:1tw153hy][/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: although the first elected LRA was supposed to held a State of Address or something.[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][i:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant laughs, but doesn't think Claude would welcome the 'Thingy at RA' as a viable suggestion[/i:1tw153hy][/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: That was a one-shot tradition, only done once and quickly forgotten...[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkRed:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Jon Seattle[/b:1tw153hy]: how about just a swearing cerimony?[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: haha Moonie 
[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Olive:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Yogeswari Padar[/b:1tw153hy]: oh, that's interesting, does someone do a "state of n'stadt" address?[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: pffft jon!!![/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: rofl[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: lol jon[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Olive:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Yogeswari Padar[/b:1tw153hy]: ha ha ha[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: Yes, Yoge, "traditionally", the LRA should do that.[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][i:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant laughs[/i:1tw153hy][/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: i'll stand there and swear anyway[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: lol[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Olive:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Yogeswari Padar[/b:1tw153hy]: lol[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: did we reach a conclusion on exec?[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: well... anyway[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: lol[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkRed:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Jon Seattle[/b:1tw153hy]: So we are going to present this as an idea for discussion,, perhaps leading to an amendment.[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: cool[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: i think for us to be coherent we must press it as an idea for amend[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: i agree[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkRed:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Jon Seattle[/b:1tw153hy]: I also agree[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: ok[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: now, how much pushing shall we be?[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: Heh.[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: Not enough to the point that Claude gets a nervous breakdown [/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkRed:1tw153hy][i:1tw153hy]Jon Seattle laughs[/i:1tw153hy][/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: well, we're the minority party so we can only push at open doors Depends on the DPU i guess[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: they want an exec too so they shd be up for a discussion at least[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: That's why I think it's not a bad idea to publish it[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Olive:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Yogeswari Padar[/b:1tw153hy]: well, as the minority, we have the benefit of being able to make lots of noise if we want[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: Yes.[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: True, lol[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: indeed Yoge [/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: so let's make noise[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkRed:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Jon Seattle[/b:1tw153hy]: yes[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Olive:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Yogeswari Padar[/b:1tw153hy]: i agree[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: ok, can we move on?[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkRed:1tw153hy][i:1tw153hy]Jon Seattle nods[/i:1tw153hy][/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: just one sec[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Olive:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Yogeswari Padar[/b:1tw153hy]: why not ask for it as an amendment then?[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: we shd yoge[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: what is published then? the text as it is, only changng the title for Proposal for Ammendment?[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkRed:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Jon Seattle[/b:1tw153hy]: Yes, I think that is what we agreed?[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: Aaah yes Moon[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: I agree, certainly.[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkRed:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Jon Seattle[/b:1tw153hy]: Just the title.[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][i:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn *nods*[/i:1tw153hy][/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: yes, a proposal for discusion[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: Ok, 90 minutes to decide on a title [/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: We're good at this![/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: lol[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: hehe[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: uh oh[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkRed:1tw153hy][i:1tw153hy]Jon Seattle lol Gwyn[/i:1tw153hy][/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: Proposal for Amendment to the Conmst...[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkRed:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Jon Seattle[/b:1tw153hy]: proposes that we let Moon decide the title[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: hehe Jon [/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: and let the peopel do the discusion... you know they will anyway[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: yes moon, i'm happy with someting like that[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: Yes, I'm counting on pelanor's criticism [/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: ok, i'll pot in 90 minutes , then [/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: now.... referenda![/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: w00t![/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: has everyone seen the draft constl amend?[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: and perhaps read the thread on this from april?[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: i read your posts in Legislative discussion[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkRed:1tw153hy][i:1tw153hy]Jon Seattle pulls it up[/i:1tw153hy][/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: hmmm, that no, lol[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: s'not that important. are we supportive of the idea?[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Olive:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Yogeswari Padar[/b:1tw153hy]: yes[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: of ratifying the const amends by public referenda? I am, surely[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkRed:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Jon Seattle[/b:1tw153hy]: Yes, me too[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][i:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami waits for gwyn....[/i:1tw153hy][/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][i:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn abstains [/i:1tw153hy][/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: lol[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: [/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: Sorry, I have to be politically consistent [/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: i knew it [/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkRed:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Jon Seattle[/b:1tw153hy]: No opinion?[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: Actually, I should vote "no", but Claude persuaded me a long time ago NOT to vote NO. [/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Olive:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Yogeswari Padar[/b:1tw153hy]: is there anything in current law that requires two (or more) successive RAs to approve the amendment before it goes to public referendum?[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: Sure, should I do a vote declaration?[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: quite right. there are some issues that claude has raised[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: in particular the timing of referenda[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: Basically, I think that the "need" for validating a constitutional amendment comes from a "fear" that a RA, working in tandem with the SC, can approve basically everything without checks,[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: so the citizens should be a last check in this case.[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: IMO, this is to the lack of a "fourth branch",[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: since in the future, with 2 million citizens in Neufreistadt, most people will not really understand the issues about the amendment, they'll very likely abstain from voting on it, raising a question on how valid their vote really is.[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: [/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: i like the fact that it raises the bar on constl amends. they *shd* be hard to make[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: Ok this is not an issue for 2006, though [/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: Yes. I agree, Pat,[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Olive:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Yogeswari Padar[/b:1tw153hy]: kind of like what happens in the US on referenda [/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: that was Claude and Pelanor's argument, and I was actually moved by it.[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: ok...[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: are they opposed to the idea now then?[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: Not at all,[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkRed:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Jon Seattle[/b:1tw153hy]: I like the fact that this is not a legislative but a constitutional refernda[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: I think they would agree with you all that a) Const. amendments should be harder to do[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: b) they should be validated by the citizens.[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: sorry, v tired and not understanding well [/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: Aye, Jon ? I would vote "no" on legislative referenda [/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: what decision do we reach then?[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Olive:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Yogeswari Padar[/b:1tw153hy]: wait -[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Olive:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Yogeswari Padar[/b:1tw153hy]: does the RA have to approve it before it goes to the people for a vote?[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: Yes.[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Olive:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Yogeswari Padar[/b:1tw153hy]: or at least approve it going for a vote?[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: RA introduces it as a regular bill,[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: there are some arguments to have around timing, grouping etc. I suggest we pursue them on the forums (I'm too tired!) as this will take a while to pass/fail[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: discusses it,[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: approves it.[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: sure Pat[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: Right now, all it takes is the SC to see if the const. amendment violates any founding documents, and it goes into effect immediately.[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: And of course, Pat![/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: ty:) do we need to discuss financing expansion or the flag bill?[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkRed:1tw153hy][i:1tw153hy]Jon Seattle nods[/i:1tw153hy][/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: Your text on the forums was excellent, Pat [/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: I just added that tiny comment.[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: Pt, i only have one question about Exec text - and that is i don't think that the listing of Exec actions should be part of the Const text[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkRed:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Jon Seattle[/b:1tw153hy]: /mw wants to ask Moon's opinion of the new flag, not having seen it yet[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: hehe, and i thought *I* was pedantic....[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: I haven't seen it yet, either...[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: i haven't yet seen it either[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][i:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn out-pedants Pat [/i:1tw153hy][/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: Moon, you could post the bill's text and say that...[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: ok[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: ie: "Constitution amendment: powers" and "Bill: actions"[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: or something like that[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkRed:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Jon Seattle[/b:1tw153hy]: Yes, I think that would be fine.[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: kk, i'll do it then[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: yes, i think that works best[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: flag... nobody has seen it yet[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: what was the other? (sorry, i am a bit tired too)[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: But it's somewhere, say the forums.[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: [/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: "If it's on the forums, it's true!"[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: why an owl? a phoenix would be *much* better. isnt' that what we have now?[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: We have a CHICKEN![/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: lol[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkRed:1tw153hy][i:1tw153hy]Jon Seattle laughs[/i:1tw153hy][/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: The Phoenix was Moon's suggestion...[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: well, i was doing a proposal with a phoenix...[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: Indeed, a very good looking one as well.[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: but it's stopped, days only having 24 hours, lol[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkRed:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Jon Seattle[/b:1tw153hy]: How about a phieonix chicken?[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: But you've never finished it, Moon, so there were only two designs to choose....[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: well, with all that avian influenza going round a chicken is a really bad idea![/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: lol[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: .... and yes, Jon [/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkRed:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Jon Seattle[/b:1tw153hy]: that would fit perhaps[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: awww Pat![/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Olive:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Yogeswari Padar[/b:1tw153hy]: ha ha ha[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: let teh neualtenburgers keep the diseased chicken[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: LOL[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: *sniggers*[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkRed:1tw153hy][i:1tw153hy]Jon Seattle laughs[/i:1tw153hy][/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: ... that's generous of us[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: [/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Olive:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Yogeswari Padar[/b:1tw153hy]: oooo, bad [/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkRed:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Jon Seattle[/b:1tw153hy]: We are all getting tired I think..[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: Why the "Plural" in "Neualtenburgers", Pat? There is only one, Kendra... [/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: lol, yes[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: lol, true gwyn[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: [/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: lol Gwyn[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: I hope she'll come to the Ball, mind you. She was invited.[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: Anyway, Moon, would you still submit your flag as a proposal?[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: i hope so as well[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: yes, i'd like to see your design moon[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: impossible til hmmm[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: Ah, forget it then.[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: mid-september[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: Next term [/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: Nah.[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkRed:1tw153hy][i:1tw153hy]Jon Seattle sighs[/i:1tw153hy][/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: The bill is to be voted Saturday, so...[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][i:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn *shrugs*[/i:1tw153hy][/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: We'll have an Owl instead [/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: i can check the heraldic coherence of t though... metals on metals, and so on [/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: Sure, and there is no blazon[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][i:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant is keen on heraldics[/i:1tw153hy][/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: You can write it.[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: Indeed, hehe[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: ok...[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: k, we have ten mins more. is there anything we shd discuss (Pat needs to sleep)[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: i think nothing more[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: I was asking myself the same...[/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: pat can go to sleep [/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][i:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami blows kisses all round[/i:1tw153hy][/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkRed:1tw153hy][i:1tw153hy]Jon Seattle smiles[/i:1tw153hy][/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: sleep well, pat![/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Olive:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Yogeswari Padar[/b:1tw153hy]: [/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkSlateGray:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Gwyneth Llewelyn[/b:1tw153hy]: Sleep tight [/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Navy:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Patroklus Murakami[/b:1tw153hy]: k, i call this meeting to a close, i'm packing up my notetaker and going to bed. gnight all [/color:1tw153hy]
[color=DarkOrange:1tw153hy][b:1tw153hy]Moon Adamant[/b:1tw153hy]: night![/color:1tw153hy]
[color=Teal:1tw153hy][i:1tw153hy]The meeting closed at 16:53 Linden time.[/i:1tw153hy][/color:1tw153hy]