CN City SE Corner Redeployment - Proposals

[Moon Adamant]

Hello everyone,

as promised in the last Guild meeting, i have drawn a series of proposals based on the discussion and ideas of everyone.
For facility, i made a powerpoint with the proposals that can be seen at:

http://docs.google.com/Presentation?id= ... 31v56zc5d9

The proposals drawn do not exhaust the number of possible solutions, but they are a nice sum up of the kinds of possible solutions.

Feel free to comment and add your own proposal - if necessary, IM me for a clean copy of the city plan.

Next Guild Meeting we will vote on the proposals, so we can move on to budgeting and defining a WG for this project.

EDIT: I also put up the drawings at the School, if it's more convenient

[Claude Desmoulins]

Is the overarching issue a need to go to fewer larger plots?

[Moon Adamant]

Well, if you read the meeting transcript, there was a trend towards having larger plots - the only drawing then present being solution 1, which actually makes the plots a bit smaller. So the other solutions are exploring ways to make larger plots, CN being a single-prim sim - perhaps there is an interest in larger plots due to prim count (though CN has prim lots for sale).

So this is really an exploration of what that urban space can become. At the meeting, these solutions were discussed with worthwhile arguments, so i can best refer people to that transcript.

[Arria Perreault]

Thank you, Moon, for the very good proposals. I am in favour of big plots (proposals 3 or 5). As I have already said, I am ready to buy the plot behind mine (C14) to make the plot C15 as it is in proposals 3 or 5. Since long time, I have the intention to finish my half urban villa by adding a peristyle garden behind the existing building (and to improve the whole). In this villa, I will present textures inspired from Antiquity (mosaics and paintings) and also sell some of them. I will also make this villa "clickable": visitors can get informations about the different rooms and their use.
In mid or long term, I am ready to sell the parcel I have upper in street, when CN is full again, to get one more citizen or one more commercant.

This is a unique chance to improve Colonia nova

[symokurka]

Bigger commercial surfaces are for sure better for selling. But malls contradict the "nature" of CN. Solution 3 maybe is a reasonable compromise.
I would also like to outline that some city textures in CN need possibly a good restyling. The "northern roman city look" is a pure invention ( ) and i think we should test something new and coherent, particularly on the buildings around the Forum.

[solomon mosely]

hi, sorry this sketch is so sloppy. lost of excuses.... i think it gets the point across though. i thought that since this space within the walls seems so valuable we should get the most from in terms of real estate value and cultural interest; help the space add to not only the commercial value of the square frontage and also add to the uniqueness and creativity of our sim. by utilizing the alley as another curious, explorable corner visible from the main street, it helps create more valuable foot traffic frontage (small comapred to the square of course, but its proximity is good) and enhances the overall diversity of the walking experience in cds.

moving the temple seemed appropriate since though it is a beautiful structure and yes another unique feature, it is the pay box. i felt that could live somewhere else since the square footage is so valued within the walls, it is good, valuable real estate and bills can be paid just outside the walls too and can be explored by visitors as the exit the main gate.

i think the plan creates a mix of the debated small vs large parcel debate.

no scale on the sketch though, sorry. if it seems worthy, i will be happy to recreate it in more detail...

[Moon Adamant]

Hello all,

At the last Board meeting, we made a process of iteration on the proposals and approved this proposal:
http://docs.google.com/Presentation?id ... _0fjkkttfd

It is an iteration of the proposal 3 with Solomon's excellent idea to place a city garden in the quadrant. This allows no dead-ends and increases the desirability of the parcels.

For the record, the new parcels and areas are:

C.12 - 816 m2
C.13 - 864 m2
C.14 - 512 m2
C.15 - 576 m2
Temple: 192 m2
Garden and alleyway: 688 m2

[Moon Adamant]

BUDGET for the proposal above:

This is the budget that the Guild is presenting to the Executive for the proposal above:

http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key= ... VwsA1e2Ddw

To note:

We are budgeting terraforming, the creation of the garden and the creation of the two new insulae. The rest of the area of intervention is at a stable condition and needs no intervention from us.
Also to note, we are aiming at a bit of stability of the cardo facades here, so this budget assumes that the two insulae are no mod/no copy/ transfer - which, of course, doesn't invalidate that the owners can dispose of the insulae and build new ones. It also assumes, as usual, that a copy with full perms shall be given to the Content Archivist.

[Rose Springvale]

Thanks for your work Moon.

I am still not sure why the buildings can't be modified. I think new owners should be allowed to join the two parcels, take out the center wall and configure the interior of the resulting space as best works for them. Requiring an owner who wants the prims and space that is there already to delete the build that CDS will pay for and replace it with what may be considered sub standard because they want a larger space seems to defeat the whole upgrade process. Seems to make more sense to sell the parcels empty if we foresee either a take it or leave it approach.

Please consider making the buildings, no copy, no tran, but modifiable. To my knowledge, none of the existing CN buildings were transferable.

[solomon mosely]

i would agree with rose, especially since we are paying builders for the buildings. if there are already issues with cn appearance that are worthy of attention and investment, perhaps we should take steps to get as much mileage out of them as possible.
i am assuming the land fetches a bit more than an open plot of equal size for several reasons, one of which, it comes with a pre made structure built by some of cds's finest prim-crafters.
leaving the new owner the ability to redesign a bit without having to completely rebuild will encourage them to leave the facade of guild-approved design and seems like a simple way to get all parties an appropriate portion of value for hard earned lindens.

[Jamie Palisades]

Could I also ask the Guild for clarification on whether, and why, and by who, any decision was made that new buildings made by Guild craftsmen should be no-mod?

No-copy builds on the in-world site seem perfectly fine to me, as long as CDS has an archival version that can be used to replace it. No-copy protects the artist's economic interest.

But no-mod seems less necessary. That's a common complaint from citizens. It seems particularly odd in the commercial context, where coloring or moving a wall or display window is a constant issue for owners.

Regards Jamie

[Moon Adamant]

I am suggesting no-mod so that we can have a bit of stability in the cardo facades. We have been getting many complaints that the textures used around the cardo and forum are not correct.
We also have precedent in AM where the cottages have this permission set.

In any case, this is a suggestion. The builds can made be mod, but i at least advise the no-copy/transfer permission set.

[symokurka]

Most of people who analized CN historical City focused on TWO main problems, one is "lack of prims" the second is "lack of emotions" and incoherence in textures = we have "brand tidy textures" on one side of Forum square and "urban decayed" on the other side, just to simplify. I suggested to Guild, besides the SE Corner stuff, to call for a texture competition to bring in new ideas and creativity, to find out if we can get a more appealing "look and feel" of CN City. If this principle is accepted we could shortly get a "new look" for CN. I frankly think this Sim deserves it.

IF this principle is accepted i fully understand Moon's proposal for "no mod" textures (we are speaking of HISORICAL centre). I frankly believe that modern buildings in CN City would be another disaster, much better having no mod historical textures at least ON EXTERNAL (walls and facades) textures. I'm not sure but does'nt NFS City work this way too?

On the other subject (lack of prims) i think we maybe have to rediscuss actual limits in nr of plots owned by single owners.

[Cindy Ecksol]

Most of people who analized CN historical City focused on TWO main problems, one is "lack of prims" the second is "lack of emotions" and incoherence in textures = we have "brand tidy textures" on one side of Forum square and "urban decayed" on the other side, just to simplify. I suggested to Guild, besides the SE Corner stuff, to call for a texture competition to bring in new ideas and creativity, to find out if we can get a more appealing "look and feel" of CN City. If this principle is accepted we could shortly get a "new look" for CN. I frankly think this Sim deserves it.

IF this principle is accepted i fully understand Moon's proposal for "no mod" textures (we are speaking of HISORICAL centre). I frankly believe that modern buildings in CN City would be another disaster, much better having no mod historical textures at least ON EXTERNAL (walls and facades) textures. I'm not sure but does'nt NFS City work this way too?

On the other subject (lack of prims) i think we maybe have to rediscuss actual limits in nr of plots owned by single owners.

I'm not sure I understand why we don't just create that set of textures and then specify that they must be used for all external facades. Builds have to be approved by the BAC anyway. What Symo says about wanting to get some coherence in textures in different areas of the city makes sense, but preventing people from modifying structures does not as long as we have some kind of BAC looking at the final product.

Cindy

[Rose Springvale]

I believe BAC only applies to Locus Amoenus. We'd have to amend the covenants of all sims to apply to new construction i think.

I don't have a problem with texture requirements for facades or even exterior walls being no mod. I beleive we have the model for this in the Cardo Plots across from the Amphitheater. The street facing facade is no mod, but the interiors can be remodeled to suit usage.

As for prims, if we were ever out of land for sale, this might make sense. But we have prim lots that are not sold, and i dont' believe we've ever been sold out of prim lots. What people seem to really want is more prims for no more money. And well, this is Second life. Not sure that's even reasonable to consider.As it is, we already have a square meter restriction on the number of parcels anyone can own as well as a limit on how many one can own inside the walls. I'm sure the plan was that many small merchants with just a vendor or two would create a busy roman marketplace, but that kind of commercial district really requires there to be something active going on. Traditionally, Colonia Nova has been a bit sleepy.

And remember too, that what we offer with land ownership that is of most value is citizenship in the political community. MANY people own those small parcels only for that,and have no interest in conducting commercial activities. A law allowing non-citizen rentals might serve them well.