RA Meeting 15th February TRANSCRIPT

[symokurka]

Meeting on 2009-02-15 at 09:00
Those present:
Symo Kurka is in the chair.09:00
Symo Kurka: Hello Cindy09:00
Symo Kurka: Hello Soro
Justice Soothsayer has indicated consent to be recorded.09:02
Symo Kurka: Please touch the recorder under the table to indicate your consent to recording.
Rose Springvale has indicated consent to be recorded.
Soro Dagostino has indicated consent to be recorded.
Cindy Ecksol has indicated consent to be recorded.
Sudane Erato has indicated consent to be recorded.09:03
Rose Springvale: afk for a moment09:03
Soro Dagostino: Hello Sudane09:03
Sudane Erato: hi :)09:03
Symo Kurka: Btw i saw CN corner a few minutes ago..09:03
Soro Dagostino: brb -- coffee.09:03
Cindy Ecksol: cute new hair, Sudane09:04
Symo Kurka: great job09:04
Sudane Erato: thx Cindy :)09:04
Justice Soothsayer: It was a nice party there09:04
Symo Kurka: rasta girl09:04
Sudane Erato: )09:05
Symo Kurka: welcome sonja09:05
Sudane Erato: hi :)09:05
Soro Dagostino: Hi Sonja09:05
Symo Kurka: Please touch the recorder under the table to indicate your consent to recording.
Sonja Strom has indicated consent to be recorded.
Pip Torok has indicated consent to be recorded.09:06
Sudane Erato: Sonja is trying to find the softest seat :)09:06
Sonja Strom: :)09:06
Pip Torok: btw rose thanks for the prezzie09:06
Sonja Strom: trying them all09:06
Sudane Erato: hehe09:07
Cindy Ecksol wonders if sonja is testing political positions....09:07
Symo Kurka: Ok I see Solomon approaching09:08
Symo Kurka: Welcome Solomon. Please touch the recorder under the table to indicate your consent to recording.
Solomon Mosely has indicated consent to be recorded.09:08
Solomon Mosely: hi syom , hello everybody09:08
Symo Kurka: I think we can start ...09:08
Sudane Erato: hi :)09:09
Solomon Mosely: \hello sudane09:09
Soro Dagostino: Hello Sol.09:09
Sudane Erato: hi :)09:09
Symo Kurka: Reps and Citizens who wish please do stand up for the prayer please09:09
Solomon Mosely: ...soro09:09
Cindy Ecksol: ?09:09
Sonja Strom: Prayer?09:10
Justice Soothsayer: Huh?09:10
Symo Kurka: Oh Father who art in Heaven09:10
Rose Springvale: back09:10
Soro Dagostino: I don't see my aliens here.09:10
Solomon Mosely: i live in unceasing prayer09:10
Symo Kurka: Give us this Day our daily Dream09:10
Symo Kurka: Help us give a Shape to our Virtual Destiny09:10
Symo Kurka: Let our Citizens live in Harmony09:10
Symo Kurka: And help us find the Right Balance09:10
Symo Kurka: Among our Multiple Lifes09:10
Symo Kurka: And Lead us not into Destruction09:10
Symo Kurka: But Deliver us from Evil and Psychotics09:10
Symo Kurka: Amen09:11
Symo Kurka: thank you all09:11
Symo Kurka: now we can start09:11
Symo Kurka: Please touch the recorder under the table to indicate your consent to recording.09:11
Symo Kurka: I have two updates to propose for agenda. 1) a short presentation on the Monthly Economic Observatory, and 2) Justice "RULES OF PROCEDURE, as in http://forums.slcds.info/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=1701 -
09:12
Symo Kurka: Reps,I ask you, is the proposed agenda acceptable with the update proposals??09:12
Justice Soothsayer: OK with me09:12
Sonja Strom: I'm ok with it09:12
Symo Kurka: cindy?09:13
Symo Kurka: soro?09:13
Symo Kurka: Ok i assume they either agree or crashed09:13
Cindy Ecksol: ok09:13
Cindy Ecksol: sorry...09:13
Symo Kurka: Citizens,
anyone who wants to sign up to speak on any of the agenda items?09:14
Soro Dagostino: Reading rules . . . ok09:14
Symo Kurka: And... 1) a short presentation on the Monthly Economic Observatory09:15
Symo Kurka: Look at the screen please09:15
Symo Kurka: ah09:15
Symo Kurka: and have in mind that who ever has presentations can use it in the future09:15
Symo Kurka: i'll show you 4 slides + a samll comment from Su?dane09:15
Cindy Ecksol sees screen slow to rez.....09:16
Symo Kurka: We decided to start monitoring SL and CDS economy09:16
Symo Kurka: to have more data to decide if it's the right moment to invest09:16
Symo Kurka: SL economic trends09:16
Symo Kurka: and CDS economic trends09:16
Symo Kurka: on a monthly data09:17
Symo Kurka: This is what is available from LL statistics09:17
Symo Kurka: Residents with land for sale09:17
Symo Kurka: Parcels for sale09:17
Symo Kurka: Total sold by residents09:18
Symo Kurka: Average price per SQM of land sold09:18
Symo Kurka: Users logged in09:18
Cindy Ecksol waiting for screen rez....did not see last slide09:18
Symo Kurka: This is an example of how data will appear09:19
Sudane Erato: that slide was a mistake :)09:19
Symo Kurka: Cindy i pass you the slides ok?09:19
Justice Soothsayer: brb09:19
Symo Kurka: Ok sudane it's just a sample to say09:19
Cindy Ecksol: thank you symo....I am probably not the only one having th eprobelm, so please go a bit slower09:19
Symo Kurka: ok09:20
Soro Dagostino: Raises hand09:20
Symo Kurka: Now you got the four slides in the box here09:20
Symo Kurka: Yes Soro?09:21
Soro Dagostino: Econ Trends,09:21
Soro Dagostino: The stat of 100% seems wrong.09:21
Symo Kurka: well09:21
Soro Dagostino: 100% of what?09:21
Symo Kurka: we can have a 100 start based09:21
Cindy Ecksol: :-)09:21
Sudane Erato: yes, there should be no number on that row09:21
Symo Kurka: 6160 = 10009:21
Symo Kurka: oh09:21
Symo Kurka: guys09:22
Soro Dagostino: Understand.09:22
Symo Kurka: it works as a START = 10009:22
Cindy Ecksol: and then the 99% should be -1%09:22
Sudane Erato: since the number is the % of the row above it09:22
Symo Kurka: aah09:22
Symo Kurka: it's the SAME09:22
Symo Kurka: but09:22
Soro Dagostino: 9-1-2009 is the base number.09:22
Symo Kurka: yes soro09:22
Soro Dagostino: TY09:22
Symo Kurka: which helps having a general perspective view of the trend09:22
Sudane Erato: we have no immediate source for prior months09:22
Symo Kurka: rather than % on previous month09:22
Sudane Erato: yes09:23
Sudane Erato: so we have to start here09:23
Symo Kurka: ok09:23
Solomon Mosely: raises hand09:23
Symo Kurka: last slide and then comments from sudane
Cindy Ecksol: so Symo, far right column is intended to be an index?09:23
Symo Kurka: This is what we'll try to get from our own data..09:23
Symo Kurka: Yes Cindy09:23
Symo Kurka: an index based on start = 10009:24
Cindy Ecksol: thank you -- probably best to re-label tha tcolumn then. I was confused09:24
Symo Kurka: ok i suggest comments from Sudane, then questions and answers09:24
Sudane Erato: ok09:24
Sudane Erato: well... we assembled the listed data items09:24
Sudane Erato: because they were what we found available09:25
Sudane Erato: althou... not all the CDS data items are actually available09:25
Soro Dagostino: Hmmmm09:25
Sudane Erato: however... if there are suggestions for additional data items..09:25
Sudane Erato: which people think may be useful09:25
Sudane Erato: please bring them to our attanetion... along with the sources09:25
Soro Dagostino: raises hand09:26
Sudane Erato: yes?09:26
Soro Dagostino: Nonpaying parcels?09:26
Soro Dagostino: #09:26
Sudane Erato: hmmm... ok09:26
Symo Kurka: Well09:26
Sudane Erato: that might be useful for management09:26
Symo Kurka: we have the general data of tier payed09:27
Sudane Erato: yes... total revenue we have listed09:27
Symo Kurka: we should not get too much in detail09:27
Justice Soothsayer: Also, maybe a snapshot of parcels for sale or in govt hands; I know we can get for sale data from the map, but at some point the yellow map will be turned off.09:27
Sudane Erato: Soro, i think we should track that for other purposes...09:27
Sudane Erato: Justice..09:27
Soro Dagostino: I think it a valuable tool.09:27
Sudane Erato: that is a data that we'd like to get09:28
Sudane Erato: number os parcels for sale09:28
Sudane Erato: but... its very hard to collect09:28
Symo Kurka: This data should help us to answer the question: "Is it a good moment to buy a new Sim?"09:28
Justice Soothsayer: I see 5 LA parcels today, and 4 CN parcels on the yellow map.09:28
Sudane Erato: yes09:28
Justice Soothsayer: Not counting the repossessed CN plots being redeveloped09:29
Justice Soothsayer: Oh, and 1 in AM.09:29
Soro Dagostino: How many are in that class?09:29
Sudane Erato: at this moment we can count... but i feel its only useful if we know how many went on sale during the month09:29
Justice Soothsayer: Right, that's why we need a snapshot, so when we run the data points together we can see trends09:29
Pip Torok: agree09:29
Sudane Erato: ok...09:30
Sonja Strom: Maybe there could just be one day each month, as a snapshot.09:30
Sudane Erato: but many parcels might have been bought and sold during the month09:30
Sudane Erato: and we wouild not lnow that09:30
Pip Torok: the same day relative to months end of course!09:30
Sudane Erato: also... i should mention09:31
Sudane Erato: that SIM traffic data... is not really the name09:31
Sonja Strom: Yes Pip, it could be the last day of each month for example.09:31
Sudane Erato: since "traffic" has a particular meaning in SL
Sudane Erato: we want to count the number of unique visitors each month09:32
Sonja Strom: I have an overall question.09:32
Symo Kurka: Ok, guys...09:32
Cindy Ecksol: how can you do that Sudane?09:32
Symo Kurka: Yes Sonja09:32
Sudane Erato: hopefully with a fixed up visitir counter09:32
Sonja Strom: Is this an enjoyable thing for us to do?09:32
Sudane Erato: which references a citizen list09:33
Sonja Strom: If we want to do it, it should be set up so nobody has to keep putting a lot of work into it,09:33
Sudane Erato: hehe09:33
Sonja Strom: unless they find that fun.09:33
Sonja Strom: For example, exactly as Sudane said,09:33
Sudane Erato: i think we want to do it cause the infomation is incredibly valuable09:33
Solomon Mosely: agreed09:33
Symo Kurka: Sure we cannot get MAD collecting data that are hard to collect09:33
Sudane Erato: and we will find a way to get it best we can09:34
Sonja Strom: we could have an automatic visitor counter reference a citizen's list, and things like that.09:34
Soro Dagostino: Agreed09:34
Sudane Erato: yes09:34
Symo Kurka: Ok09:34
Symo Kurka: are we finished?09:34
Sudane Erato: thats all from me i think09:35
Sonja Strom: My concern is if we start doing things that are complex and not enjoyable for us, then that would take away from the vitality of our community.09:35
Symo Kurka: Nothing to approve, nothing to vote ..:)09:35
Sonja Strom: It would not be worth it.09:35
Pip Torok: quite so ...09:35
Symo Kurka: Well Sonja09:35
Symo Kurka: we'll have to keep it simple09:35
Sudane Erato: Sonja, I think that experience has shown in the CDS that no one will do what they don't want to do09:35
Sonja Strom: Right... lol.09:35
Cindy Ecksol smiles09:35
Sudane Erato: :)09:36
Sonja Strom: And, well, I would say rightly so!09:36
Sudane Erato: i actually quite agree09:36
Symo Kurka: Can we proceed to Justice RULES OF PROCEDURE?09:37
Sonja Strom: YES09:37
Sonja Strom: lol09:37
Sudane Erato: sorry... must run09:37
Justice Soothsayer: Ithas been pointed out that it is a little confusing that we are actually governed by two separate sets of rules.09:37
Sonja Strom: Thanks Sudane!09:37
Symo Kurka: Thank you Sudane09:37
Symo Kurka: http://forums.slcds.info/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=170109:37
Soro Dagostino: Move approval of adoption of former rules explained by Jamie09:37
Justice Soothsayer: The first set was adoped some time in the past. the 2nd set in 2008.09:38
Justice Soothsayer: I've tried to prepare a draft that incorporates both, for the sake of some clarity.09:38
Justice Soothsayer: http://forums.slcds.info/viewtopic.php? ... 1297309:39
Sonja Strom: hi Gwyn :-)09:39
Justice Soothsayer: So I would ask that we officially adopt the "reconciled" draft.09:39
Justice Soothsayer: thanks.09:39
Symo Kurka: Justice just a short amendment09:40
Cindy Ecksol waves at gwyn09:40
Symo Kurka: "Every agenda for the RA shall be based on a schedule of 2 hours"... I would suggest of "maximum" 2 hours09:40
Justice Soothsayer: I'll second that.
Cindy Ecksol raises hand09:42
Symo Kurka: Ok i anticipate i'm in favour09:42
Symo Kurka: ... Cindy?09:42
Cindy Ecksol: Symo, I' ma bi tconcerned about all th erule sthat specifiy that this item must take 10 minutes and that will take 15....09:42
Cindy Ecksol: seems too restrictive to me.09:42
Symo Kurka: Yes09:42
Cindy Ecksol: and potentially time-wasting.09:42
Symo Kurka: LKisten to me guys09:42
Symo Kurka: i thank Justice for the job he's done. We all really appreciate it. But please let's keep it as a guideline...09:42
Symo Kurka: a fklexible guide line09:42
Symo Kurka: I want to make clear that I do NOT think RA has to be JUST a perfect bill approval/voting machine, no...09:43
Justice Soothsayer: I agree Cindy, but thatt's the rule we have in place now. In practice, the LRA has been able to let discussion go as needed, but having the club of the rules to enforce if needed.09:43
Pip Torok: (so long as "flexible"remains flexible)09:43
Cindy Ecksol: could we perhaps just say that each item gets a minimum of 10 mintues and can be extended by request of any RA member?09:44
Cindy Ecksol: to 15 that is...09:44
Sonja Strom: As I remember, that concept originally came from a concern that some RA members were trying to crowd out certain topics.09:44
Cindy Ecksol: yes...09:44
Symo Kurka: If an item needs 20 minutes discussion it MUST be ok09:44
Cindy Ecksol: so the min of 10 minutes makes sense....just not all the rest of the silliness09:44
Cindy Ecksol: yes, exactly symo09:45
Symo Kurka: the 10 / 15 minutes is a general guideline09:45
Cindy Ecksol: LRA should be able to set any time with consent of RA09:45
Symo Kurka: and has to be managed alas by the LRA09:45
Symo Kurka: YES09:45
Sonja Strom: I would like some clarification of Symo's request for addition.09:45
Symo Kurka: but we cannot spend our time here asking connsents to evrything09:45
Symo Kurka listens09:45
Sonja Strom: When you say "Every agenda for the RA shall be based on a schedule of 2 hours," this means that only a certain number of topics can be included in the agenda for each session?09:46
Symo Kurka: Flexibility means flexibility09:46
Symo Kurka: ?IF needed09:46
Symo Kurka: *if needed
Brian Livingston has indicated consent to be recorded.09:47
Cindy Ecksol: symo, those consents can be doneat the beginning when you set an agenda for our approval. if anyone wants more time on an item, they can say, and it will be added then./09:47
Symo Kurka: ok09:47
Sonja Strom: Why I ask that is because I think it would be possible to interpret it as that discussions of topics would need to be shortened to fit them all into a 2-hour schedule.09:47
Symo Kurka: The important to me09:48
Symo Kurka: is09:48
Symo Kurka: not to be considered just an approval machine09:48
Sonja Strom: I think we should allow enough time for each topic, and if we come to the end of the two hours, remaining topics should be moved to the beginning of the next meeting's agenda.09:48
Pip Torok: strongly agree
Symo Kurka: Don't you think RA could also be also a "think tank" and an opportunity to involve actively more citizens ?09:49
Symo Kurka: yes agree qith sonja09:49
Sonja Strom: ok09:49
Symo Kurka: And don't forget one more thing09:49
Sonja Strom: thanks09:49
Symo Kurka: how many opportunities do we have to meet alltogether in world to discuss our future?09:49
Justice Soothsayer: Yes, our practice has been to move unfinished items to the top of the following meeting's agenda09:50
Symo Kurka: ok shall we proceed to vote?09:50
Cindy Ecksol: what exactly are we voting on?09:50
Symo Kurka: The "Justice Procedure Paper" with my amendment+09:50
Cindy Ecksol: as it stands or as proposed to be amended?09:51
Justice Soothsayer: My draft of the reconicled rules, as amended by Symo's note that the agenda should be a *max* of 2 hours09:51
Cindy Ecksol: I would also like to propose an amendment: that we eliminate the language that specifices allowcation of time09:51
Cindy Ecksol: or revise it to be less restrictive09:51
Soro Dagostino: raises hand09:52
Symo Kurka: can we just add the adjective "orientitavely" 1o minutes09:52
Symo Kurka: Soro09:52
Cindy Ecksol: ???09:52
Symo Kurka: sorry Gwyn09:52
Symo Kurka: )09:52
Soro Dagostino: Can it be resolved with a call for the question?09:52
Soro Dagostino: Non-debatable.09:53
Symo Kurka: Hey guys09:53
Symo Kurka: we are messing it up here09:53
Justice Soothsayer is unsure of meaning of 'orientatively"09:53
Symo Kurka: so can we please redraft it and vote it next week?09:53
Pip Torok: agree with symo09:53
Soro Dagostino: Move to postpone09:54
Cindy Ecksol: yes, that would be good09:54
Justice Soothsayer: OK with me.09:54
Cindy Ecksol: second soro09:54
Symo Kurka: Great09:54
Soro Dagostino: Call the question09:54
Symo Kurka: we postpone to e second draft approval, necxt RA meeting who votes yes09:54
Soro Dagostino: Aye09:54
Pip Torok: aye09:54
Justice Soothsayer votes aye to postpone to next meeting09:54
Cindy Ecksol: aye09:55
Sonja Strom: I would rather vote on a complete text, and for this vote choose aye.09:55
Symo Kurka: aye09:55
Symo Kurka: Now next Item09:55
Symo Kurka: Hmm09:55
Symo Kurka: we are missing a Chancellor ))09:56
Symo Kurka: he had huge crashes yesterday09:56
Symo Kurka: we maybe need to buy him a new pc??09:56
Symo Kurka: so09:56
Rose Springvale: he's traveling i think.. but know he planned to be here09:56
Justice Soothsayer: Has anyone told Jamie we would like a report on AA, other than making him read the RA transcript?09:56
Rose Springvale: there is bad weather in his part of the world today09:57
Symo Kurka: No monthly report today09:57
Symo Kurka: I'm afraid09:57
Sonja Strom: It's often difficult when traveling in my experience.09:57
Pip Torok: symo would it be fweasible /desirable for Jamie to send in his report as a note if he has problems?09:57
Symo Kurka: Yes Pip09:57
Symo Kurka: good idea09:57
Symo Kurka: though i prefer vis a vis meetings09:58
Symo Kurka: anyway
Symo Kurka: we'll ask him to send a written monthly report to RA09:58
Symo Kurka: (at least for this time)09:58
Pip Torok: i was thinking of a baxkup if he cannot be face2face09:59
Symo Kurka: Next ITEM09:59
Solomon Mosely: hi09:59
Symo Kurka: GMP10:00
Symo Kurka: I think we have to take our tiome on this subject for 3 reasons10:00
Soro Dagostino: Am I the only one who crashed?10:00
Symo Kurka: 1, Guild is working at revision10:00
Sonja Strom: Soro, I think so.10:00
Symo Kurka: 2, Gwyn - Cindy Committe (with my help lol) is working at procedures10:01
Symo Kurka: 3, its not a subject we can debate or "approve" in a hurry10:01
Symo Kurka: listen10:01
Symo Kurka: when we first mentioned GMP one year ago10:01
Symo Kurka: it fell in a Ddeadly silence10:01
Symo Kurka: now evrybody is chewing it10:01
Symo Kurka: which is good10:02
Symo Kurka: when we all will have a shared view of our community's interest we will "approve 2 it10:02
Symo Kurka: not before10:02
Symo Kurka: so10:02
Symo Kurka: i WITHDRAW10:02
Symo Kurka: any "bill for approval" for the moment10:02
Symo Kurka: done10:03
Justice Soothsayer: Symo, that is most sensible.10:03
Symo Kurka: any questions?10:03
Symo Kurka: Ty Justice10:03
Sonja Strom: Thank you Symo.10:04
Symo Kurka: BUT10:04
Symo Kurka: be aware10:04
Symo Kurka: it does not mean i give up having a shared vision of our territorial development10:04
Symo Kurka: so i'll insist in bothering you two girls ok?10:05
Pip Torok: I should hope not, Symo!10:05
Cindy Ecksol: ?10:05
Symo Kurka: yes Cindy-Gwyn committee10:05
Symo Kurka thinks time to adjourn10:05
Rose Springvale: wait!10:05
Rose Springvale: smile10:06
Rose Springvale raises hand to talk under general comments10:06
Symo Kurka: Ms Springvale??10:06
Rose Springvale: thanks :)10:06
Rose Springvale: Wanted to thank everyone for your support of the Grand tour yesterday.. we had good turnout for our events10:06
Rose Springvale: and Arria is conducting a third one now, in the monastery10:06
Symo Kurka: LOL and huge griefers too ..)))10:07
Cindy Ecksol: hey, sign of succes!10:07
Rose Springvale: also, if you didn't get here, go see the ski run, and check out the CDS ski outfits.. you can get special CDS skis for 1 L for the rest of the weekend (maybe longer)10:07
Rose Springvale: and10:07
Sonja Strom: yay!10:07
Sonja Strom: (their cute)10:07
Rose Springvale: Thank Solomon for the GREAT job he did of building us a temporarry temple to Aphrodite in the old Toga space10:07
Rose Springvale: go see that too10:07
Justice Soothsayer dons his CDS goggles10:07
Sonja Strom: YES, Thank You Solomon!10:07
Rose Springvale: and ask someone to tell you what you do when yuo begin an event and the building disappears....10:08
Rose Springvale: smile10:08
Sonja Strom: Great job!10:08
Rose Springvale: it was an EVENTFUL day :)10:08
Sonja Strom: And of course, thank you Rose!!10:08
Rose Springvale: ah, here's arria's announcnemet, good10:08
Symo Kurka: Ok i move to adjourn
Symo Kurka: next RA meeting the 1st of March!!10:09
Symo Kurka: shall we adjourn?10:09
Symo Kurka: vote please10:09
Pip Torok: seconded10:09
Pip Torok: aye10:09
Justice Soothsayer: Ooh, does that mean we will meet on the Ides?10:09
Symo Kurka: yes abit earlier than Ides Justice ...)10:10
Symo Kurka: favoutable to adjour say aye10:10
Justice Soothsayer: aye10:10
Symo Kurka: *favourable10:10
Sonja Strom: aye10:10
Symo Kurka: aye10:10
Symo Kurka: session adjourned10:10
Cindy Ecksol: aye
The meeting closed at 10:10 Linden time.