Libraries in Al Andalus

[Rose Springvale]

The library projects in Al Andalus have been going on for over two years now, with various people leading the different groups, and with varying results. The ongoing project was complicated when the library located in Al Garnata was brought to AA from Illumination Island, with the understanding that we were "saving" that library and that it would cease to exist otherwise. That turned out not to be true, but the ability of the Illumination library, renamed Tesoro Liberia de La Ahlambra, to serve as a transition building between the Colonia Nova sim and the Al Andalus sims, due to its architecture, was thought to be an appropriate use of space.

The Librarian/owner was not able to work as a team member under the CDS system, and chose to leave shortly after the move. Since then, several issues with El Tesory Liberia have arisen. It is time to both address those issues as well as get the Al Andalus library back on track.

Fern Leissa, who has significant professional and personal skills in this area, and I, are meeting on Monday January 11 at 10am slt to discuss the logistical issues and our thoughts on the future of the projects. If you have comments, you are welcome to attend or send your thoughts to me before Monday.

Thanks,
Rose

[Cindy Ecksol]

Fern Leissa, who has significant professional and personal skills in this area, and I, are meeting on Monday January 11 at 10am slt to discuss the logistical issues and our thoughts on the future of the projects. If you have comments, you are welcome to attend or send your thoughts to me before Monday.

Thanks,
Rose

Hmmm. Being interested in the subject myself, I took Rose up on her offer only to be told that it was a private meeting. So sorry to see that we're now doing so much out of the public eye....

Cindy

[Rose Springvale]

Thanks for this Cindy. As I explained in world, it is clear there are many misunderstandings regarding the status of the library project. Sometimes meeting dates and times change due to changes of circumstances. This is the case with the meeting today. My meeting today was with the past and future chairs of what is presently a private project. Due to the limited time of the people who are involved in this, and have been, for going on two years, i chose not to take time from our meeting to re educate those with casual interest.

Your name is on the list of people to invite to the group when we form it and there will be many opportunities for you to volunteer then. If you find my actions inappropriate regarding notice, i suggest we establish some rules on this. I don't appreciate the innuendo, particularly when our government holds private meetings to a standard higher than they apply to public ones.

[Gwyneth Llewelyn]

I think that the misunderstanding came from a lack of knowledge on the actual status of the Library. I admit I was utterly unaware of its status — but that's my problem for not being informed, not anyone else's. So I worried that for some reason the "logistical issues and our thoughts on the future of the projects" might mean... that the Library would disappear!! Thus my interest in participating; the Library is an amazing project and it would be a huge loss if it were gone, for lack of funding, interest, or volunteers, and possibly we could get some governmental help in aiding it?

Thankfully I seem to have misunderstood everything and not only the project is alive and kicking, but it seems that there is a team ready to tackle it! I'm looking forward to more information, but the meeting today was definitely productive and encouraging — at least from the PoV of someone who had little information about its current status.

I wonder if a transcript could be posted? I understand that this remains a private project, even though it welcomes public contributions, so perhaps posting the meeting transcript would not be appropriate...

[Cindy Ecksol]

Thanks for this Cindy. As I explained in world, it is clear there are many misunderstandings regarding the status of the library project. Sometimes meeting dates and times change due to changes of circumstances. This is the case with the meeting today. My meeting today was with the past and future chairs of what is presently a private project. Due to the limited time of the people who are involved in this, and have been, for going on two years, i chose not to take time from our meeting to re educate those with casual interest.

Your name is on the list of people to invite to the group when we form it and there will be many opportunities for you to volunteer then. If you find my actions inappropriate regarding notice, i suggest we establish some rules on this. I don't appreciate the innuendo, particularly when our government holds private meetings to a standard higher than they apply to public ones.

*Shrug* I was not the only one who assumed from your posting that this was a meeting to which any interested person was invited and was then turned away. That "turning away" included an interesting "game" of TP tag played across the CDS sims wherein those who were interested in the meeting and arrived late had to look around to find the meeting and were eventually abandoned for yet another location. We've each drawn our own conclusions, and I'm sure the others will speak for themselves.

BTW, it might be helpful to the entire community if you would post the transcript of Stui's gathering last week where so many people had their interest piqued in the project. He solicited our permission to re-post at the meeting and said he was going to ask you to help, and I heard him confirm that permission on Sunday at the RA meeting, so I know this was his intention. About that meeting, I'll just comment that Fern had a particularly interesting vision for what the library could be, and hearing more about that was what got me interested enough to show up for a meeting. If those with such "casual" interest are not welcome even to listen in to meetings, I'm not sure how you expect them to become more knowledgeable. I'll also remind you that at one time at least myself and Delia were far more than "casually" interested. But as you say, the project didn't move forward for a variety of reasons. That's ok, but why you'd do your best to discourage us from participating today when our interest has once again been piqued I truly don't understand.

Cindy

[Rose Springvale]

Thanks for your support Gwyn.

[Gwyneth Llewelyn]

Yes, it would also be nice if Stui would be willing to post transcripts on the forums as well. I know... people should simply *be in-world and attend*... but sadly for me, this totally overlaps one thingy I have iRL, always at the same time

It's quite encouraging to know that those meetings are very productive and get people to plan all sorts of things for the CDS

[Carolyn Saarinen]

After what happened yesterday, regarding my motion to alter the constitution in respect of Factions, I am impressed indeed that Cindy and Gwyn have the nerve to question the motives and behaviour of others when it comes to meetings.

[Delia Lake]

I'm delighted that the Library project is getting a new push. I know it takes some dedicated work to bring a project like this to fruition and I'm glad to hear of Fern's interest. Our CDS sims are inspired by some rich and very interesting RL cultures and times. And our virtual democracy work-in-progress is a most important undertaking also. To have a functional library as part of this would be excellent. I'd like to help with the Library if I can.

[Jamie Palisades]

A game of tag over several sims? To repeat Carolyn's point, CDS PUBLIC meetings, including governments and NGOs, have an obligation to give advance notice.

They often don't. CDS might consider creating stronger consequences when they don't.

But PERSONAL non-government projects do not have an obligation to hold public meetings. They can ask for volunteers! If they want. When they want. Or not. If Cindy chooses to do what Rose, Delia & Arria generously have done -- rent an entire sim from CDS, and then choose to host resources on it -- I am sure that she, too, would feel that she is free to hold meetings about its design and use, public or not, as she sees fit, without being jeered.

Would everyone please check to see that they personally are spending more of their time in CDS creating than attacking? Thank you. JP

[Sudane Erato]

I'm not following this at all??!! In the post heading up this thread, Rose says

If you have comments, you are welcome to attend or send your thoughts to me before Monday.

We now have a new dispute over this?

[Timo Gufler]

I am not sure, if I read this thread too quickly, or it's expected that you have attended to a meeting, before understanding the big picture. What would be the function of the library? Is it an archive for the CDS history? Having history elsewhere than in the chat log dumps in the forums, would be really cool. Whatever this project is about, it sounds interesting for me.

[Gwyneth Llewelyn]

Yes, like Sudane said, I guess I also misunderstood the meaning of "If you have comments, you are welcome to attend or send your thoughts to me before Monday." I was unable to send any thoughts — because I didn't really know the current status of the project — so I took the opportunity to attend, at least to understand what the issue was about, and eventually offer any suggestions as appropriate.

I don't understand either why we should have a "dispute" about that at all

[Rose Springvale]

I guess my real mistake was posting on the forums at all. No location was set for the meeting here, and no announcement was made in world. I honestly forgot that I'd included an option to attend the meeting, as cindy knows, because i told her when she showed up.

I also am very curious why my little group was stalked all over the sims for a meeting no one replied to about, that no one imed me about, nor that anyone asked for information on. Yet though we were in three different places, people kept showing up for the "meeting". And they didn't come at the beginning of the meeting... other than cindy... who i offered to meet with at another time to bring her up to date.

Out of courtesy, couldn't you just have asked me, rather than try to make some big deal on the forums? I have nothing to hide.

[Jamie Palisades]

Gwyneth, Rose: anyone who invites people to meetings should not be surprised if people show up.

Sudane: personally I don't think anything about that exchange has to do with CDS, and would rather let it drop.

Timo: we have had several "library" projects informally bouncing around CDS. I'd like to see something happen also.
-- Al-Andalus had one interest group, but the workgroup waned, long before the AA-CDS merger.
-- Satir & Rose attracted a second one to AA (the Xinoxi Han library on Al Garnata) just before the merger, so we inherited it as a tenant, but those original instigators drifted away and cloned their work elsewhere.
Neither of those projects became an NGO or used CDS funds. The theme of Al Andalus and its public buildings would make a library very welcome and suitable, but, as often is the case, we do not yet have committed volunteers who can make that project their primary point of contribution. Rose has been looking for some, because the current library at Al Garnata is dormant, and she is the owner of (pays tier to CDS for) it. As such, it's her project, and she has the right to decide who works with it.