Next meeting of the Portal/Forum Workgroup

[Keila Forager]

Will be on Friday the 19th at 1pm slt. I'll post a location when I get home this evening. You really want to be there !! http://slurl.com/secondlife/Al%20Andalu ... e/240/16/2

[Jamie Palisades]

There's a notice In Arria's latest RA agenda about a new portal workgroup chair. Did you resign, Keila?
Regards JP

[Keila Forager]

Yes Jamie, I resigned. Soro , when he was acting LRA, appointed me as chair, to look at the problems , difficulties navigating and incorrect info in the portal and forums. Seems the powers that be, have a different idea what the group should be doing. And adding info to the portal without fixing it...that just adds to the problem.
[2010/03/19 14:19] Pip Torok: meantime we need to settle 1) who has access to what and 2) whose is which job..
[2010/03/19 14:19] Arria Perreault: the problem is not the tool, Pip, but the mix of site that are under the responsibility of two branches and the adminsitration of it too
The problem is exactly the tool and the info it contains. The problem is not who as access and whose job. That is secondary. So I quit.. You can read the rest of the transcript here.

[2010/03/19 13:15] Keila Forager: I guess we will start and I'll post the transcript on the forums for those that couldn't make it
[2010/03/19 13:16] Arria Perreault: ok
[2010/03/19 13:16] StuiChicanne Darkstone: it's not impossible to believe that we can make money from retailing quality products that fund the sims
[2010/03/19 13:16] Keila Forager: I hope you are all here for the Portal Workgroup meeting..hehe This is the biggest turn out so far..
[2010/03/19 13:16] StuiChicanne Darkstone: like postcards or something
[2010/03/19 13:16] StuiChicanne Darkstone: images
[2010/03/19 13:16] Keila Forager: ok stui..we are on to the next meeting...LOL
[2010/03/19 13:18] Keila Forager: Let me start by saying , most everyone agrees we need to update the portal..
[2010/03/19 13:18] Arria Perreault: well ... the portal was updated
[2010/03/19 13:18] Arria Perreault: it's not yet perfect
[2010/03/19 13:18] Keila Forager: and have a place to archive our info and a place for residents to post and a place for all to see what we are about
[2010/03/19 13:19] Arria Perreault: but let's see: http://portal.slcds.info/
[2010/03/19 13:19] Keila Forager: And no Arria , it hasn't been updated, it has been added to
[2010/03/19 13:19] Arria Perreault: what is the difference?
[2010/03/19 13:19] Arria Perreault: the first page was improved
[2010/03/19 13:20] Keila Forager: the difference is, it's still difficult to navigatae, more cluttered, less info, slurls with no infor to sims
[2010/03/19 13:20] Keila Forager: and who is updating? I've mentioned this a few times and have had no contact with whoever it is
[2010/03/19 13:21] Arria Perreault: info about the sims are not yet done
[2010/03/19 13:21] Keila Forager: so who is doing it?
2010/03/19 13:21] Arria Perreault: this persons sits beside you
[2010/03/19 13:21] Rose Springvale raises hand
[2010/03/19 13:21] Keila Forager: you or Pip?
[2010/03/19 13:21] Arria Perreault: I do some modest work on the Portal, always after telling Sonja
[2010/03/19 13:22] Pip Torok: (not me, Keila
[2010/03/19 13:22] Keila Forager: So then why , if I'm an appointed chair, do I not know about it??
[2010/03/19 13:22] Keila Forager: After commenting 3 times I knkow about
[2010/03/19 13:22] Arria Perreault: you know, now
[2010/03/19 13:22] Keila Forager: weeks later Arria...
[2010/03/19 13:23] Arria Perreault: but ... there are things I did not do
[2010/03/19 13:23] Keila Forager: who did?
[2010/03/19 13:23] Arria Perreault: like the SLURL of the sims
[2010/03/19 13:23] Arria Perreault: I have no idea who did this
[2010/03/19 13:24] Pip Torok: perhaps keila should know the list of those who can update the Portal
[2010/03/19 13:25] Keila Forager: Well, considering there is lots of interest in updating the portal and making it more user friendly, it's very frustrating that things are done behind my back and the only person to have come to me to assist with this, "we" drove out of CDS
[2010/03/19 13:25] Keila Forager: I have to say I'm very glad a few have decided to come to this meeting though..
[2010/03/19 13:26] Keila Forager: So I will share something a computer dummy like me has been working on....
[2010/03/19 13:26] Keila Forager: http://slcdsportal.ning.com/
[2010/03/19 13:26] Keila Forager: And if everyone is so resistant to change, why are we even here??
[2010/03/19 13:26] Arria Perreault: Keila, you are chair of a working group thinking about the portal. You are not in charge of this update. But you can volunteer for this and ask SOnja
[2010/03/19 13:26] Pip Torok: (sorry folks, Naf is skyping)
[2010/03/19 13:27] Arria Perreault: then you get an access and you are even paid for this work
[2010/03/19 13:27] Rose Springvale: keila this is great
[2010/03/19 13:27] Keila Forager: True arria, but with everyone going off on their own and doing there own thing, then why have a group
[2010/03/19 13:27] Rose Springvale: it is very frustrating to have the people with access so limited
[2010/03/19 13:27] Keila Forager: Sorry Rose, you wanted to say something earlier
[2010/03/19 13:28] Arria Perreault: no, I don't agree. Everything was clear: portal and forums
[2010/03/19 13:28] Rose Springvale: what was clear?
[2010/03/19 13:28] Rose Springvale: sorry, maybe i should wait while Arria explains
[2010/03/19 13:28] Keila Forager: I'm waiting to hear too
[2010/03/19 13:29] Arria Perreault: the forum is under the responsibility of the SC and the portal under the responsibility of the Exec
[2010/03/19 13:29] Arria Perreault: your proposal mixe the two things, which doesn't work
[2010/03/19 13:30] Keila Forager: Then we can propose to change it
[2010/03/19 13:30] Rose Springvale: i guess it would make sense for reps from those groups to be here.but none have been at any of these meetings, have they?
[2010/03/19 13:30] Arria Perreault: on the current page of the portal, there is now a link to the forums. it was missing
[2010/03/19 13:30] Keila Forager: yep, more links and less info
2010/03/19 13:30] Keila Forager: more clutter and more difficulty navigating
[2010/03/19 13:30] Rose Springvale: one thing i want to mention is how hard it is to get access to the forums. i've had people from AA try 5 and 6 times.. most give up
[2010/03/19 13:31] Arria Perreault: Keila, did you contact the responsibles of these two sites?
[2010/03/19 13:31] Keila Forager: that is what this group is about , to present the info in an easy to use and simple manner
[2010/03/19 13:31] Arria Perreault: but we have to respect the rules of CDS
[2010/03/19 13:32] Keila Forager: No I didn't, still trying to come up with an idea, but no one seems to want to let go of the "old ways"
[2010/03/19 13:32] Rose Springvale: Arria, you still have access to the portal correct?
[2010/03/19 13:32] Rose Springvale: yet not part of Exec or SC?
[2010/03/19 13:32] Rose Springvale: i've never had access, despite years of service
2010/03/19 13:32] Keila Forager: And that is a problem, quite a few citizens want access
[2010/03/19 13:32] Arria Perreault: and the forums cannot be under the responsibility of the Exec
[2010/03/19 13:32] Arria Perreault: Rose, I will answer you. I need more sentences
[2010/03/19 13:32] Keila Forager: Why Not???
[2010/03/19 13:33] Arria Perreault: I have an acces to the portal since the beginning as I was part of the team who made it
2010/03/19 13:33] Rose Springvale: but you haven't been responsible for it for at least two terms, correct?
[2010/03/19 13:33] Rose Springvale: if we are gong to follow the rules, they should apply to all
[2010/03/19 13:34] Arria Perreault: when I leaved my office (I was PIO at that time), I did not use it
[2010/03/19 13:34] Keila Forager: absolutely
[2010/03/19 13:34] Keila Forager: Then why are you using it now?
[2010/03/19 13:34] Arria Perreault: (excpet maybe for the pages of the Faculty), but never the core information
[2010/03/19 13:34] Rose Springvale: you were pio for one term three terms ago i think. I"ve served in that office for five terms and never given access
[2010/03/19 13:34] Arria Perreault: we have made sure that Brian got an access
[2010/03/19 13:34] Keila Forager: Access should be transfered to the proper parties if you aren't one of them.
[2010/03/19 13:34] Rose Springvale: who is we/?
[2010/03/19 13:35] Arria Perreault: when Brian leaved his office (I did not realized immediately he did), it was the responsibility of Jamie to organize new accesses, not mine
2010/03/19 13:35] Arria Perreault: we= the Exec team of Alex
[2010/03/19 13:35] Pip Torok: may I make a suggestion: agree if possible on acccess to Portal and Forums , then make a recommendation to the Chancellor?
[2010/03/19 13:36] Rose Springvale: i think everyone should have access
[2010/03/19 13:36] Rose Springvale: period. we all pay for it
[2010/03/19 13:36] Pip Torok: _everyone_??
[2010/03/19 13:36] Keila Forager: Yes, that is what the citizens want
[2010/03/19 13:36] Keila Forager: yes everyone
[2010/03/19 13:36] Rose Springvale: absolutely
[2010/03/19 13:36] Arria Perreault: our idea was to give access to any citizen who need it, for example to the responsible of a NGO
[2010/03/19 13:36] Keila Forager: with limited access to certain areas
[2010/03/19 13:36] Rose Springvale: if it is our communication tool, why should some get to gate keep
[2010/03/19 13:36] Arria Perreault: yes, of course
[2010/03/19 13:37] Arria Perreault: it was seen so, but the exec team changed
[2010/03/19 13:37] Keila Forager: No, to all citizens, we all NEED it
[2010/03/19 13:37] Pip Torok: imo someone/people need to gate-keep
[2010/03/19 13:37] Rose Springvale: pip
[2010/03/19 13:37] Rose Springvale: when that happens, we have the fourm, which is dreadfully unbalanced
[2010/03/19 13:37] Rose Springvale: and new people just wont' keep getting turned down and come back
[2010/03/19 13:37] Keila Forager: I wouldn't never send a potential citizen to the present forum
[2010/03/19 13:37] Arria Perreault: now I just volunteer to do some work to help the community
[2010/03/19 13:37] Rose Springvale: but our portal does
[2010/03/19 13:38] Keila Forager: and wouldn't send them to the portal either
[2010/03/19 13:38] Rose Springvale: we are all here as volunteers Arria... why is yours with access but not mine?
[2010/03/19 13:38] Arria Perreault: I am surprised to hear you don't have access, as former PIO
[2010/03/19 13:39] Rose Springvale: i've never had access
[2010/03/19 13:39] Rose Springvale: i have begged for places to post specific things, and they are always ignored
[2010/03/19 13:39] Arria Perreault: when you where in office, you should have an access
[2010/03/19 13:39] Rose Springvale: we don't have a lsnd threat.
[2010/03/19 13:39] Keila Forager: Communication sucks in CDS,,, so why is anyone surprised.
[2010/03/19 13:39] Rose Springvale: land thread. I agree, i should have had, and you should not have, per your definitions. but that's not the case
[2010/03/19 13:39] Arria Perreault: in my opinion, it was under the responsibility of Jamie, sorry to say that again.
[2010/03/19 13:40] Rose Springvale: could he have taken away your access?
[2010/03/19 13:40] Pip Torok: Communication was behind my suggestion to talk to the Chancellor
[2010/03/19 13:40] Arria Perreault: he was responsible to get an access for you
[2010/03/19 13:40] Keila Forager: Was Jamie in the SC?
[2010/03/19 13:40] Arria Perreault: yes, he could
[2010/03/19 13:40] Arria Perreault: Jamie was Chancellor
[2010/03/19 13:40] Keila Forager: Does that mean he was in SC?
[2010/03/19 13:40] Arria Perreault: but the tradition in CDS is not this one. we trust each oher
[2010/03/19 13:40] Rose Springvale: what about the forum threads? seems to me that Gwyn is the only one with power there, and she's not SC
[2010/03/19 13:40] Rose Springvale: smiles
[2010/03/19 13:41] Arria Perreault: http://portal.slcds.info/index.php?id=sc0
[2010/03/19 13:41] Keila Forager: [13:40] Arria Perreault: but the tradition in CDS is not this one. we trust each oher---I haven't seen that since I've become involved..(
[2010/03/19 13:41] Arria Perreault: here you have information about the Scientific council
[2010/03/19 13:41] Rose Springvale: they don't even report for elections, let alone forum moderation
[2010/03/19 13:42] Rose Springvale: and i bet none of them can add threads on the forum
[2010/03/19 13:42] Keila Forager: Why is it that everyone posts links? Does no one really know the answer?
[2010/03/19 13:42] Arria Perreault: Keila, you are currently chairing a consultative WG that has to report to the RA
[2010/03/19 13:42] Keila Forager: Not anymore I'm not.
[2010/03/19 13:42] Keila Forager: Pip is now chair..
[2010/03/19 13:42] Arria Perreault: if you were member of the Exec team, you would get one
[2010/03/19 13:42] Rose Springvale: he is?
[2010/03/19 13:43] Arria Perreault: ok
[2010/03/19 13:43] Pip Torok: ??
[2010/03/19 13:43] Rose Springvale: exec team does not get power to post threads, not true
[2010/03/19 13:43] Keila Forager: Yep, I quit, no one wants to hear anything constructive..because that's not the way it's done.
[2010/03/19 13:43] Keila Forager: so I'm done
[2010/03/19 13:43] Arria Perreault: Abot trust: all former PIO have still their rights:Events Calender, Group (to send notice), ...
[2010/03/19 13:43] Rose Springvale: lol
[2010/03/19 13:43] Rose Springvale: that's not trust
[2010/03/19 13:44] Arria Perreault: the different CDS groups are so too
[2010/03/19 13:44] Rose Springvale: and lots of people have those rights. But the forums are the subject here, and no one but gwyn has control of them
[2010/03/19 13:45] Arria Perreault: Gwyn, but under the control of the SC
[2010/03/19 13:45] Rose Springvale: then why do we never hear from the SC
[2010/03/19 13:45] Rose Springvale: Gwyn only says that when she disagrees with a request!
[2010/03/19 13:45] Pip Torok: well then .. if im chair then first we need to contact the SC to clear up this matter of communications and who does what
[2010/03/19 13:45] Rose Springvale: smile
[2010/03/19 13:45] Rose Springvale: Pip
[2010/03/19 13:45] Arria Perreault: it is important that forums are separated from the official information that comes from the Exec
[2010/03/19 13:46] Rose Springvale: this work group was created to address disatisfaction of the citizens with the tools
[2010/03/19 13:46] Arria Perreault: it would good to invite the SC here
[2010/03/19 13:46] Keila Forager: I've invited everyone in CDS..
[2010/03/19 13:46] Rose Springvale: if all it is going to do is deal with hierarchy, we are wasting our time ...a gain
[2010/03/19 13:46] Arria Perreault: I cannot speak for them
[2010/03/19 13:46] Pip Torok: in which case "official info" comes from where IYO?
[2010/03/19 13:46] Rose Springvale: and why should a chair have to beg the people responsibel to come
[2010/03/19 13:46] Rose Springvale: she's a volunteer too!
[2010/03/19 13:46] Rose Springvale: she's held half a dozen meetings already
[2010/03/19 13:46] Arria Perreault: official info comes from the exec
[2010/03/19 13:46] Keila Forager: Yes we are since that is not why the group was created, so Pip can change the group to whatever he wants it to be now..
[2010/03/19 13:47] Pip Torok: ok ... but ill need to lok at this, then think, then come back to you all
[2010/03/19 13:47] Rose Springvale: Keila, i suggest we have a maverick info site
[2010/03/19 13:47] Arria Perreault: I really understand the needs
[2010/03/19 13:47] Rose Springvale: no one needs to have control for communication, and there will be no change from the old guard
[2010/03/19 13:47] Arria Perreault: it's just a question of work
[2010/03/19 13:47] Pip Torok: thanks ill be consulting you then Arria!
[2010/03/19 13:48] Arria Perreault: I have a question for you, Rose
[2010/03/19 13:48] Keila Forager: This group was unofficial to look at how to fix the portal and forums, update the info...so far, no one wanted to help do that, except one, and everyone ran her out of CDS
[2010/03/19 13:48] Arria Perreault: I was ready to teach her how to use Typo3
[2010/03/19 13:49] StuiChicanne Darkstone: it's a shame that people leave CDS
[2010/03/19 13:49] Keila Forager: Well, non involvement seems the way to keep themm
[2010/03/19 13:49] Rose Springvale: listening is pretty important too,
[2010/03/19 13:49] Pip Torok: well ppl come AND go for their own particular reasons imho
[2010/03/19 13:50] Arria Perreault: that's what I am doing and I have started to improve the portal
[2010/03/19 13:50] Keila Forager: Yes, but most don't, I get ignored more than not, but then I ask the questions most won't
[2010/03/19 13:50] StuiChicanne Darkstone: I think Pip that people can't really be written off quite so easily
[2010/03/19 13:50] Keila Forager: and why wasn't I or the group involved then??
[2010/03/19 13:50] Pip Torok: in that case, Keila ... ask ME
[2010/03/19 13:50] StuiChicanne Darkstone: does CDS want the reputation of being awkward and exclusive and a club ?
[2010/03/19 13:51] Keila Forager: True Pip, you Rose and Jamie and Cindy are about the only ones
[2010/03/19 13:51] Rose Springvale: stui
[2010/03/19 13:51] StuiChicanne Darkstone: when CDS seeks to expand as a form of mission statement
[2010/03/19 13:51] StuiChicanne Darkstone: you can't really afford to consider a loss as a matter of routine
[2010/03/19 13:52] Pip Torok: anyway, my first job will be to research the present position and how we got heren ...
[2010/03/19 13:52] Pip Torok: *here
[2010/03/19 13:52] StuiChicanne Darkstone: without seeming unmoved
[2010/03/19 13:52] Rose Springvale: i hope you read the transcripts of the prior meetings. I dont' plan to spend more time re educating
[2010/03/19 13:52] Rose Springvale: in fact, is this meeting adjourned
[2010/03/19 13:52] Rose Springvale: ?
[2010/03/19 13:53] Pip Torok: yes ... i adjourn and will call the next meeting
[2010/03/19 13:53] Rose Springvale: actually
[2010/03/19 13:53] Rose Springvale: for the record
[2010/03/19 13:53] Rose Springvale: i don't think you can just Be the successor
[2010/03/19 13:53] Rose Springvale: as Keila was an RA appointee
[2010/03/19 13:53] Rose Springvale: i suspect the RA has to reappoint
[2010/03/19 13:53] Rose Springvale: since we are a community of ruiles
[2010/03/19 13:53] Rose Springvale: rules
[2010/03/19 13:54] Arria Perreault: ok. I can put this in the agenda for sunday
[2010/03/19 13:54] Pip Torok: in which case Keila can bring this up ... or we can talk to Madame LRA!!
[2010/03/19 13:54] Rose Springvale: i thought Keila did a brilliant job, thanks for trying keila
[2010/03/19 13:54] Pip Torok: agree!
[2010/03/19 13:54] Rose Springvale: sigh. pip
[2010/03/19 13:54] Keila Forager: No Pip, you can bring it up, Soro appointed you, me and Arria
[2010/03/19 13:54] Rose Springvale: if you agree
[2010/03/19 13:54] Rose Springvale: stand with her to make this change.
[2010/03/19 13:55] Callipygian Christensen: May I make an observation..that can be passed along to RA SC..whomever?
[2010/03/19 13:55] Rose Springvale: we can't just keep defending a non working solution
[2010/03/19 13:55] Pip Torok: sounds about right ... till then, then
[2010/03/19 13:55] Keila Forager: Too bad that is what is happening (
[2010/03/19 13:55] Rose Springvale: i know
[2010/03/19 13:55] Rose Springvale: it is not democracy. its "we did this so it has to stay this way"
[2010/03/19 13:56] StuiChicanne Darkstone: I wonder if this objectionable manner of approaching things in a conservative "i worked up to now" attitude is yet another piece of ego driven administration
[2010/03/19 13:56] Keila Forager: LOL
[2010/03/19 13:56] Callipygian Christensen: I have now atteneded a number of RA meetings, and a few workinggroups like this. I did not get involved in the elections quite purposely because I dont know enough about here to do so...
[2010/03/19 13:56] Callipygian Christensen: (Ill just mkae the observation anyway)
[2010/03/19 13:56] Rose Springvale: thanks calli
[2010/03/19 13:56] Keila Forager: Reminds me of a group dictatorship..LOL
[2010/03/19 13:56] Pip Torok: fair enough Calli
[2010/03/19 13:56] Arria Perreault: Rose, the update of the portal has been neglected for many months. I think it is correct to try to improve it first before to have an other solution
[2010/03/19 13:56] Keila Forager: Please Calli
[2010/03/19 13:56] Rose Springvale: i disagree
[2010/03/19 13:57] Rose Springvale: i think we should admit that its clunky and awful
[2010/03/19 13:57] Rose Springvale: and move forward
[2010/03/19 13:57] StuiChicanne Darkstone: well I know that Soaper tried to learn the constitution thru the correct channels
[2010/03/19 13:57] StuiChicanne Darkstone: and he failed
[2010/03/19 13:57] Keila Forager: Well, no one is improving it, just adding more info
[2010/03/19 13:57] StuiChicanne Darkstone: and he's a clever bloke
[2010/03/19 13:57] StuiChicanne Darkstone: god help the stupid
[2010/03/19 13:57] Rose Springvale: a splash page full of slurls? awful
[2010/03/19 13:57] Callipygian Christensen: but my perception is that for whatever reason many of those who are acrtive in this *combined* CDS are carrying a lot of baggage, are mistrustful, uncommunicative, and to be honest at times rather underhanded.
[2010/03/19 13:57] Pip Torok: Soaper??
[2010/03/19 13:57] StuiChicanne Darkstone: yes Pip
[2010/03/19 13:57] StuiChicanne Darkstone: Soaper
[2010/03/19 13:57] Callipygian Christensen: It isnt attractive to a potential resident
[2010/03/19 13:57] Keila Forager: I agree Calli
[2010/03/19 13:58] Rose Springvale: smiles. sorry Calli, there IS a lot of baggage. I apologize for contributing to that
[2010/03/19 13:58] Pip Torok: is he/she an avi or an expression?
[2010/03/19 13:58] StuiChicanne Darkstone: well there's a lot of backbiting that's for sure
[2010/03/19 13:58] Rose Springvale: ariel feden , pip
[2010/03/19 13:58] Pip Torok: ah ...
[2010/03/19 13:58] StuiChicanne Darkstone: it's ok PIP ! Young PIP !
[2010/03/19 13:58] Rose Springvale: sadly, change just doesn't happen in CDS
[2010/03/19 13:58] StuiChicanne Darkstone: it's a one of my many nicknames
[2010/03/19 13:58] Callipygian Christensen: I wont say where I feel I see it the most, but its clearly there and i suspect there are people actively working towards demerging the two groups.
[2010/03/19 13:58] StuiChicanne Darkstone: I think that perhaps
[2010/03/19 13:59] Pip Torok: ill never be the "Elder Pip" it seems!
[2010/03/19 13:59] StuiChicanne Darkstone: we all need to attend the trustworthy space meetings again
[2010/03/19 13:59] Arria Perreault: It's not my opinion
[2010/03/19 13:59] Keila Forager: I feel the same way Calli, I liked it so much better the 2 years I lived here as a non citizen )
[2010/03/19 13:59] StuiChicanne Darkstone: Pip who wants to be old ?
[2010/03/19 13:59] Arria Perreault: I try to make both community closer
[2010/03/19 13:59] StuiChicanne Darkstone: what is age but a number ?
[2010/03/19 13:59] Pip Torok: true ....
[2010/03/19 13:59] Rose Springvale: really? i guess it works for you Arria. but i think Calli is right
[2010/03/19 13:59] StuiChicanne Darkstone: besides
[2010/03/19 13:59] Callipygian Christensen: If that happens matters little to me, but i think should probably matter to those who have built both groups..so, keep gioing how you are going and I think you'll be back pre-merger, but wiht a lot of bad feelings aquired along the way.
[2010/03/19 14:00] Callipygian Christensen: and that isnt a 'you' of those of you here in the meeting..its a global 'you' of the groups
[2010/03/19 14:00] StuiChicanne Darkstone: PIP ! YOUNG PIP ! is my approved nickname for you
[2010/03/19 14:00] Arria Perreault: well, I was in a minority group at the RA for a term
[2010/03/19 14:00] Pip Torok: thank you young Stui!
[2010/03/19 14:00] Keila Forager: Scares mme to think that July could bring the separation of CDS
[2010/03/19 14:00] StuiChicanne Darkstone: well Keila if it's the will of the people
[2010/03/19 14:00] Arria Perreault: but it did not make me desperating
[2010/03/19 14:00] StuiChicanne Darkstone: and AA knows it can run either way
[2010/03/19 14:01] Callipygian Christensen: ok..I am done
[2010/03/19 14:01] StuiChicanne Darkstone: don't know which way it goes
[2010/03/19 14:01] Pip Torok: i'm going to say something controversial ...
[2010/03/19 14:01] StuiChicanne Darkstone: it's not my place to influence it
[2010/03/19 14:01] StuiChicanne Darkstone: BREAKING NEWS !
[2010/03/19 14:01] Keila Forager: go for it, I've been controvesial since I became a citizen..hehe
[2010/03/19 14:01] Arria Perreault: I know the community life is important and it would be nce to be cool for everything
[2010/03/19 14:02] Pip Torok: ... that the people who say 2you/they backbite" are possibly the backbiters (now Fire away!:)
[2010/03/19 14:02] StuiChicanne Darkstone: I doubt it Pip
[2010/03/19 14:02] Keila Forager: Not me, I'll tell you to your face..LOL
[2010/03/19 14:02] StuiChicanne Darkstone: I think
[2010/03/19 14:02] Rose Springvale: you think CALLI? is lol
[2010/03/19 14:02] Arria Perreault: in the same time, we have some requierements like our laws or the need to finance the community
[2010/03/19 14:02] StuiChicanne Darkstone: there is backbiting across the board
[2010/03/19 14:02] Rose Springvale: smiles at calli. you little back biter you!
[2010/03/19 14:03] Keila Forager: True Arria, but that seems to have taken precedence over the citizens and the community
[2010/03/19 14:03] Arria Perreault: Calli, we could try to explane you how work CDS
[2010/03/19 14:03] Pip Torok: she says the nicest things!
[2010/03/19 14:03] Arria Perreault: and maybe you will change your minde
[2010/03/19 14:03] Arria Perreault: mind*
[2010/03/19 14:03] Rose Springvale: hehe
[2010/03/19 14:03] Rose Springvale: Calli is the most observant person i know
[2010/03/19 14:03] Rose Springvale: she doesn't need us to explain anything
[2010/03/19 14:03] Callipygian Christensen: Arria..with all respect, attending meetings that deicde how a place runs gives a very good measure of the place
[2010/03/19 14:03] Rose Springvale: she watchs and forms her own conclusions
[2010/03/19 14:04] Arria Perreault: it took me several months to undertand how CDS works
[2010/03/19 14:04] Pip Torok: yes ... very true Calli
[2010/03/19 14:04] Rose Springvale: well, i've been here three years and still clearly don't get it
[2010/03/19 14:04] Callipygian Christensen: and Pip - I don't take that commen6t personally, since I dont know enough people or their history to particpate in back or front biting for that matter I can only say 'this is how it appears to me'
[2010/03/19 14:04] Keila Forager: I agree Calli, which is why I think I will skip most meetings from now on..to the delight I'm sure of the RA and everyone else
[2010/03/19 14:05] Pip Torok: I think Naf has the best idea, to decamp suddenly to Ghent for a series of concerts!
[2010/03/19 14:05] Arria Perreault: Calli, I don't now about which decision you are talking, but the RA does its job
[2010/03/19 14:05] StuiChicanne Darkstone: not to my delight Keila
[2010/03/19 14:05] Arria Perreault: in the same time, RA members are elected
[2010/03/19 14:05] Keila Forager: I will come to your talking hour maybe stui
[2010/03/19 14:05] StuiChicanne Darkstone:
[2010/03/19 14:05] Rose Springvale: STH and maverick website!
[2010/03/19 14:05] Arria Perreault: so if you don't like some of the them, you don't vote for them the next time
[2010/03/19 14:06] Arria Perreault: this is the balance
[2010/03/19 14:06] StuiChicanne Darkstone: perhaps we should organise a blood donor programme
[2010/03/19 14:06] Callipygian Christensen: Arria, I am not talking about any particular decision, although in the meetings I attended very few decissions were actaully made.
[2010/03/19 14:06] Arria Perreault: and this is why we have to listen people
[2010/03/19 14:06] Arria Perreault: so ...
[2010/03/19 14:06] Keila Forager: ROFLMAO
[2010/03/19 14:06] Rose Springvale: do you think you have listened to us at this group Arria?
[2010/03/19 14:06] StuiChicanne Darkstone: and throw blood at the praetorium
[2010/03/19 14:06] Callipygian Christensen: I was observing more the practises and interactions among the members *shrug*
[2010/03/19 14:06] Arria Perreault: I am here to listen to you now
[2010/03/19 14:06] Rose Springvale: no, you seem to be here to defend the portal and forums and cast blame on Jamie
[2010/03/19 14:07] Arria Perreault: I think I have understand the needs for a better communication in CDS
[2010/03/19 14:07] Rose Springvale: you said you'd look at ning sites.. did you?
[2010/03/19 14:07] Rose Springvale: are some citizens opinions more important than others?
[2010/03/19 14:07] Rose Springvale: if not, and i beleive they are not, why do some get to control what is posted where?
[2010/03/19 14:07] Arria Perreault: I have looked all ning sites people have done: Aida's, yours for AA and noe the one of KEila
[2010/03/19 14:08] Rose Springvale: i haven't done one for AA!
[2010/03/19 14:08] Keila Forager: yes Rose, you started one
[2010/03/19 14:08] Rose Springvale: i started one, but certainly nothing for public!
[2010/03/19 14:08] Rose Springvale: it was just to see how it worked lol
[2010/03/19 14:08] Arria Perreault: there was an URL in the last transcript
[2010/03/19 14:08] Keila Forager: errrr...it was in the last transcript..LOL
[2010/03/19 14:08] Rose Springvale: okay,
[2010/03/19 14:08] Keila Forager: So did you look at the one I did??
[2010/03/19 14:08] Arria Perreault: so I have seen it
[2010/03/19 14:08] Rose Springvale: i've not looked at it since
[2010/03/19 14:08] Keila Forager: Did any of you?
[2010/03/19 14:08] Arria Perreault: yes, of course
[2010/03/19 14:08] Arria Perreault: it is on my screen now
[2010/03/19 14:09] Arria Perreault: and the one of Aida
[2010/03/19 14:09] StuiChicanne Darkstone: I think the best of the truth is that even well meaning volunteers sponsored and supported by RA can't get the communities support enough to solve issues from whatever section of the community from governing bodies down
[2010/03/19 14:09] StuiChicanne Darkstone: (or citizens up)
[2010/03/19 14:09] Arria Perreault: and the one of new babage
[2010/03/19 14:09] Rose Springvale: but your reply is that the portal and forums are still the best solution?
[2010/03/19 14:09] Rose Springvale: and that you will teach typo3 to someone?
[2010/03/19 14:09] StuiChicanne Darkstone: and that apathy is the next biggest issues we face
[2010/03/19 14:09] Arria Perreault: not exactly
[2010/03/19 14:09] Jamie Palisades is Online
[2010/03/19 14:10] Arria Perreault: I think we should not consider the portal as so bad as you say, as it was not updated since a long time
[2010/03/19 14:10] Arria Perreault: let's see how it is when the information is updated
[2010/03/19 14:10] Rose Springvale: but it was bad to start with, i'm sorry. it looks like a tombstone
[2010/03/19 14:10] Keila Forager: OMG, it's awful, that is why this group was created
[2010/03/19 14:11] Rose Springvale: and if EVErYONE can't use it, it is not a community tool
[2010/03/19 14:11] Rose Springvale: its a vanity page
[2010/03/19 14:11] Arria Perreault: I have also realized that the structured I had in my concept is not the one which was implemented
[2010/03/19 14:11] Keila Forager: It's not just the info, it's finding it6
[2010/03/19 14:11] StuiChicanne Darkstone: Soaper couldn't follow it
[2010/03/19 14:11] StuiChicanne Darkstone: and he's a PHD
[2010/03/19 14:11] Rose Springvale: it has BAD data
[2010/03/19 14:11] Arria Perreault: I stil have my structure
[2010/03/19 14:11] Keila Forager: the home page is full of links and no info
[2010/03/19 14:11] Arria Perreault: so I can also change the navigation to make it beter
[2010/03/19 14:12] Arria Perreault: better*
[2010/03/19 14:12] Rose Springvale: but it isn't your job
[2010/03/19 14:12] Callipygian Christensen: careful Stui, that might not prove anythng about the portal but a lot about higher education *grin*
[2010/03/19 14:12] Rose Springvale: Can sonja? can anyone she appoints?
[2010/03/19 14:12] Pip Torok: >>
[2010/03/19 14:12] Pip Torok: ??
[2010/03/19 14:12] StuiChicanne Darkstone: Calli ha
[2010/03/19 14:12] Arria Perreault: I do only what SOnja approuves
[2010/03/19 14:12] Arria Perreault: I am only a executant
[2010/03/19 14:12] StuiChicanne Darkstone: well I'm not academic
[2010/03/19 14:13] Keila Forager: nvm
[2010/03/19 14:13] Rose Springvale: but you shouldn't even have access!
[2010/03/19 14:13] StuiChicanne Darkstone: I'm just not quite dim either
[2010/03/19 14:13] Rose Springvale: anyway, thanks for trying Keila, this is clearly going no where
[2010/03/19 14:13] Arria Perreault: well ... I am member of the founding team
[2010/03/19 14:13] Keila Forager: No Stui, you aren't and thank goodness for that
[2010/03/19 14:13] StuiChicanne Darkstone: I think it probably annoys the more academic
[2010/03/19 14:13] Rose Springvale: but that means you hsould have turned off your access
[2010/03/19 14:13] Poe Pevensey is Offline
[2010/03/19 14:13] Arria Perreault: creating team*
[2010/03/19 14:13] Rose Springvale: sorry, this is the same old same old
[2010/03/19 14:13] Pip Torok: rose its no longer possible to say whose job it is and who has accesss ... thats for the future
[2010/03/19 14:13] Rose Springvale: gwyn created the forumns
[2010/03/19 14:13] Rose Springvale: so she is the oen who controls that
[2010/03/19 14:14] Arria Perreault: like you should have anymore today, if you had
[2010/03/19 14:14] Rose Springvale: you created the portal, and you control it
[2010/03/19 14:14] Keila Forager: What does being a memeber of the founding team have to do with anything, I can transfer my site to anyone
[2010/03/19 14:14] Rose Springvale: what?
[2010/03/19 14:14] Keila Forager: That is what she is saying Rose
[2010/03/19 14:14] Arria Perreault: during the time Jamie was Chancellor, I have never many changes (except for the Faculty page)
[2010/03/19 14:14] Rose Springvale: what faculty page lol
[2010/03/19 14:14] Rose Springvale: what faculty? what guild for that matter
[2010/03/19 14:15] Arria Perreault: there is a page about that in the portal
[2010/03/19 14:15] Rose Springvale: sorry, i'm tired .. .going to go now
[2010/03/19 14:15] Rose Springvale: sure
[2010/03/19 14:15] Rose Springvale: and so we have a page, but no action. ever
[2010/03/19 14:15] Arria Perreault: any NGO could have one and an acces
[2010/03/19 14:15] Callipygian Christensen: I have to head to another meeting..enjoy your day everyone
[2010/03/19 14:15] Pip Torok: cheers calli
[2010/03/19 14:15] StuiChicanne Darkstone: I think that it could be said that any form of disatisfaction must be taken seriously
[2010/03/19 14:15] Arria Perreault: bye Calli
[2010/03/19 14:15] Keila Forager: Bye Calli, thanks for coming..sorry
[2010/03/19 14:16] Rose Springvale: off to ischia
[2010/03/19 14:16] Callipygian Christensen: no apologies needed
[2010/03/19 14:16] StuiChicanne Darkstone: and that the level of disatisfaction is such
[2010/03/19 14:16] StuiChicanne Darkstone: that it would have to be addressed as a matter of urgency
[2010/03/19 14:16] StuiChicanne Darkstone: or else the confidence and success of the whole governing body is undermined
[2010/03/19 14:17] Arria Perreault: if we launch this ning website, who will manage it?
[2010/03/19 14:17] Pip Torok: keila ... can you and me stand together at the next RA and put the issue?
[2010/03/19 14:17] StuiChicanne Darkstone: what good is an RA that exists because the members are the only ones with the knowledge to stand on the body ?
[2010/03/19 14:17] Pip Torok: good question (I dont even know what a "ning" site is)
[2010/03/19 14:17] Arria Perreault: I mean the main administrator (I know that everyone could post on it with an account?
[2010/03/19 14:18] Arria Perreault: a ning site is a kind of social network with many functionnalities
[2010/03/19 14:19] Pip Torok: meantime we need to settle 1) who has access to what and 2) whose is which job..
[2010/03/19 14:19] Arria Perreault: the problem is not the tool, Pip, but the mix of site that are under the responsibility of two branches and the adminsitration of it too
[2010/03/19 14:19] Pip Torok: and thatll be from the SC imho ... tho i need to research this
[2010/03/19 14:20] Pip Torok: agree Arria!
[2010/03/19 14:20] Arria Perreault: Pip, I am not happy to update the portal currently. I really would like we have a webpublisher
[2010/03/19 14:20] StuiChicanne Darkstone: is it impossible to trial something ?
[2010/03/19 14:20] Pip Torok: yes ... who do we know who is? ... or shall we advertise for one?
[2010/03/19 14:21] Keila Forager: I'll think about it Pip
[2010/03/19 14:21] Arria Perreault: Sonja has tried
[2010/03/19 14:21] StuiChicanne Darkstone: and to work out issues as it is working?
[2010/03/19 14:21] Keila Forager: I did start to trial something, but seems Arria doesn't like it
[2010/03/19 14:21] Pip Torok: tks ... as it happens, my neighbour is a webdesigner (neighbour in RL)
[2010/03/19 14:21] StuiChicanne Darkstone: as far as I can see there's no constitutional reason why we can't try things
[2010/03/19 14:21] Arria Perreault: Keila, it's not a question of like it or not
[2010/03/19 14:22] StuiChicanne Darkstone: after all if the trial doesn't work
[2010/03/19 14:22] Arria Perreault: it's a question of requierement
[2010/03/19 14:22] Pip Torok: ?
[2010/03/19 14:22] StuiChicanne Darkstone: you can fall back on the old set up
[2010/03/19 14:22] Arria Perreault: in your proposal, I see a mix between the portal and the forum
[2010/03/19 14:22] Keila Forager: It does everything we need it to
[2010/03/19 14:22] Arria Perreault: it must e separated
[2010/03/19 14:22] Keila Forager: Why msut it?
[2010/03/19 14:22] Keila Forager: must
[2010/03/19 14:22] Pip Torok: I agree Arria
[2010/03/19 14:22] Arria Perreault: the forums is a tool for debates
[2010/03/19 14:22] StuiChicanne Darkstone: who says it must ?
[2010/03/19 14:23] Arria Perreault: it has to be independnt from RA and Exec
[2010/03/19 14:23] Keila Forager: no , the forum is a tool for information
[2010/03/19 14:23] Pip Torok: me for starters stui!
[2010/03/19 14:23] Keila Forager: and if it's not, it needs to be
[2010/03/19 14:23] StuiChicanne Darkstone: you are a starter Pip not the meal
[2010/03/19 14:23] Arria Perreault: in my opinion, it is een wrong to use the debate to disseminate information about events
[2010/03/19 14:23] Pip Torok: ok then keila ... if the Forum is for info, then what is the portal for?
[2010/03/19 14:23] StuiChicanne Darkstone: the truth is that in my experience
[2010/03/19 14:23] Arria Perreault: the portal has to be used for the information
[2010/03/19 14:24] StuiChicanne Darkstone: I find that you have too many vehicles for information
[2010/03/19 14:24] Pip Torok: agree arria ... and the forum for debates and events
[2010/03/19 14:24] Arria Perreault: and we have also an event googlecalendar,
[2010/03/19 14:24] Keila Forager: Information about meetings, and events and transcripts and a place to get to know your fellow neighbours
[2010/03/19 14:24] StuiChicanne Darkstone: then people start reading only the format that suits
[2010/03/19 14:24] StuiChicanne Darkstone: or time constraints mean people don't read all of it
[2010/03/19 14:24] StuiChicanne Darkstone: for instance
[2010/03/19 14:24] StuiChicanne Darkstone: in work
[2010/03/19 14:24] StuiChicanne Darkstone: we have conference calls
[2010/03/19 14:24] Keila Forager: The forum is basically backbiting and ugly
[2010/03/19 14:24] Arria Perreault: we need a place for the laws and the official information
[2010/03/19 14:24] StuiChicanne Darkstone: and we have team briefs
[2010/03/19 14:24] StuiChicanne Darkstone: management meetings
[2010/03/19 14:25] Keila Forager: and where to the citizens get to go to just post about anything..
[2010/03/19 14:25] StuiChicanne Darkstone: we have Workplanner (a data transfer and logging thing)
[2010/03/19 14:25] StuiChicanne Darkstone: an Email
[2010/03/19 14:25] Keila Forager: forget it, you guys do what you want..
[2010/03/19 14:25] StuiChicanne Darkstone: and we have written packs
[2010/03/19 14:25] StuiChicanne Darkstone: and a intranet
[2010/03/19 14:25] Pip Torok: but the Forum IS for debates ... and if they are backbiting thats the nature of our debates and discussions!
[2010/03/19 14:25] StuiChicanne Darkstone: if you can imagine having to read all those things
[2010/03/19 14:25] StuiChicanne Darkstone: just to make sure you do the job correctly
[2010/03/19 14:25] StuiChicanne Darkstone: why not have one?
[2010/03/19 14:26] Keila Forager: but they are ugly and when potential citizens read it, yay, we lost another one
[2010/03/19 14:26] StuiChicanne Darkstone: and the forums is a bitching session too
[2010/03/19 14:26] Pip Torok: well then Stui ... tell the ppl that they are not doing the CDS any good by backbiting
[2010/03/19 14:26] Arria Perreault: historically, the portal was an attempt to make more order in our infor
[2010/03/19 14:26] Arria Perreault: before it was worde
[2010/03/19 14:26] StuiChicanne Darkstone: Pip
[2010/03/19 14:26] Keila Forager: makes us meaning CDS sound like no one likes each other
[2010/03/19 14:26] Arria Perreault: worse*
[2010/03/19 14:26] StuiChicanne Darkstone: I cannot tell the whole group to stop backbiting
[2010/03/19 14:26] StuiChicanne Darkstone: I am not a bailiff
[2010/03/19 14:26] Arria Perreault: we had different blogs, wiki, websites
[2010/03/19 14:27] Pip Torok: but I do like other people ... and i post as well!
[2010/03/19 14:27] Arria Perreault: we put all these informations in the portal
[2010/03/19 14:27] Pip Torok: yes you can Stui ... you write in the Forums
[2010/03/19 14:27] Arria Perreault: it was a huge work
[2010/03/19 14:27] Pip Torok: after all its for _discussion_
[2010/03/19 14:27] StuiChicanne Darkstone: I refuse to contribute to the forums
[2010/03/19 14:27] Pip Torok: then you gog yourself
[2010/03/19 14:27] StuiChicanne Darkstone: I refuse to dignify them
[2010/03/19 14:28] Pip Torok: *gag
[2010/03/19 14:28] StuiChicanne Darkstone: they are beneath me
[2010/03/19 14:28] StuiChicanne Darkstone: I am not gagged
[2010/03/19 14:28] Keila Forager: Too bad Stui, we need you there..maybe someone might see it and think we are a nice place to live
[2010/03/19 14:28] StuiChicanne Darkstone: infact there are those in CDS who probably wish I were
[2010/03/19 14:28] StuiChicanne Darkstone: esp. within RA
[2010/03/19 14:28] Pip Torok: then you are as if you are deaf and dumb ... which is a shame imho
[2010/03/19 14:28] StuiChicanne Darkstone: I speak too much truth and highlight issues that people don't want to face
[2010/03/19 14:29] StuiChicanne Darkstone: I'm not
[2010/03/19 14:29] StuiChicanne Darkstone: I think there's not a person in CDS who knows of me
[2010/03/19 14:29] Keila Forager smiles Me too
[