The Fairground Project

[Tanoujin Milestone]

1. Background

We had a discussion about Bagheera's proposed amendment to the covenants:
http://forums.slcds.info/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=4037

to grant every parcel a single temporary covenant variance for special events which could be held during a 15 days period once every 6 month on an as-claimed basis under governmental oversight, combined with the obligation to announce the event in the forums 3 days in advance.

I understood that as a suggestion to limit the traditional procedure of setting up an event in cooperation with the Chancellor with several "necessary" conditions and opposed it.

Calli presented a compromise proposal:
http://forums.slcds.info/viewtopic.php? ... 037#p20506

I would personally prefer that the RA ask the Chancellor to designate public fair grounds in a couple of sims. These can be lovely park spaces when not in use for an event. If citizens wish to hold events that require objects that are glaringly out-of-covenant for longer than a few hours, they can be directed to use the fairgrounds. The tradition of fairs goes back many centuries - the Romans held them, and they became a crucial aspect of trade and commerce in medieval Europe. This would allow citizens to have fun events that are anachronistic, while actually incorporating a tradition that fits with the themes of all of our sims (including Monastery, since many medieval fairs were held in church yards and grounds).

The RA discussed this on 5th of May.
http://forums.slcds.info/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=4042

Bags withdrew her proposal in favor of Calli's fairground proposal, and all present were in favor, but the RA did not reach a consensus which area should be dedicated to that purpose.

Bags suggested the area between the city wall and the theatre. I felt this was not part of the compromise proposal and blocked it. The decision was tabled and will therefore appear on the agenda of the new RA (Nolligan, Razzy, Ranma, Shep, Tan)

2. Let us get it done

I post this to make sure the new representatives can catch up with the discussion. And I would be happy if we could find a majority for the fairground proposal again to focus on the choice of suitable parcels. Calli's proposal switches a debate on procedures to the question where to install one or more tangible structures that will enhance the experience of every citizen.

3. Personal opinion

Let us have at least one fairground - but a really good one. In my opinion the area at the theatre doesn't do (but of course I will give in to the majority). There are plans to rebuild the theatre which might conflict. Also the aqueduct is, albeit outdated in design, a vital part of the roman theme. We should not trash it in favor of another park.

"But there is no other public space available". Let us look deeper into that. Let us say we agree on Colonia Nova. There is the Villa of the Pines: a New Guild resource. That group is gone. The parcel was locked since I rejoined. And there is the Gypsy parcel. It is for sale since I gave it up.

Sudane once said to me we still have too much of public ground. Parcels and activities should be privately sponsored no matter wether they are set to Landverwaltung or not. The School in NFS is an example: it is set to Landverwaltung, but tier is paid. And should be paid!

Let us have that for the fairground as well. Are you afraid no one will pay for it? Then you are misinformed. Do you want to avoid risk of dependency? Draw up a contract. I am ready to stand surtey. And I am not alone.

[Callipygian]

Just to clarify a little - my proposal was not intended to be a motion for RA to vote on, but a suggestion that a request be made to the Chancellor to designate such space.

My belief is still that 'use of land' in CDS is the responsibility of the Chancellor. He or she might certainly ask for input, discuss ratios of public/private land with Sudane, present some options and ask for the citizens' preferences. He or she might also just identify the lands and declare them 'the fairgrounds'. In either case he or she is acting within their powers.

It appears to me that for a number of terms the roles and responsibilities of the arms of government seem to be getting blurred, and maybe it is just my perception and no one else's. The RA, imo, should deal in law, constitutional issues and issues impacting CDS as a whole eg. buying a sim, selling a sim etc. These major issues usually require a law and amendment for them to be implemented.

All matters relating to land use fall to the office of Chancellor, as does advertising, promotion etc. because the role of Chancellor is, in effect, one of property or estate management. While LL requires that Sudane be listed as 'estate manager' CDS has chosen to move the day to day tasks of that job to the Chancellor.

Personally I feel that even the 'we should rebuild/redesign the outhouses' projects should go through the Chancellor first, and be presented to RA by him or her as an oversight matter, not a voting issue.

I have digressed from the original reply here, so back on topic.

I am glad people like the idea of fairgrounds for major or out-of-covenant events, and I hope that the incoming Chancellor will be asked to identify suitable space/s and designate them as such

Calli

[Bagheera]

Just to clarify, I did not suggest abolishing the aqueduct; I did suggest rebuilding it.

The current aqueduct makes a 32x32m run from the north side of the sim, making a 45-degree angle into the Thermae. It's one function seems to be segregating a 32x32 patch of land into a lonely stepchild that is just part of the 52x126m parcel that contains the amphitheater and aqueduct. I don't believe I've ever seen anyone over there, not even as a lover's corner. In my opinion, it is hard to appreciate the aqueduct in its current location and badly takes advantage of the space.

One idea I had would be to rebuild the aqueduct to extend the full length parallel to the road, extending to the East edge of the sim. It would both allow citizens to appreciate we HAVE an aqueduct and also serve as a semi-wall/buffer between any out-of-covenant events...still clearly visible through its arches but with a distinct "feel" of separation and excitement/adventure on the other side.

my thoughts, fwiw.

[Rosie Gray]

When the ampthitheatre is rebuilt I really do think that the aquaduct should be redone as well, and I think that it should be another Artisan Guild project. The existing aquaduct is far too primmy and very outdated for building techniques now - in fact to call it an aquaduct at all is quite fanciful as it doesn't originate anywhere in particular and doesn't go anywhere in particular, and there's no place for water. Some months ago I placed a footing under the piece nearest the sim edge because it didn't even come down to touch the ground.

Sorry that this isn't about the proposed fairground project. I'll start another thread about it.

As for a designated fairground site if we are to have one; in my opinion the most useful place for 'out of covenant' events would be a spot that doesn't have a permanent building of any kind. That way if bumper cars or massive techno-stages need to be put down, they can be placed without worrying about obliterating an existing building.

[Rosie Gray]

My belief is still that 'use of land' in CDS is the responsibility of the Chancellor. He or she might certainly ask for input, discuss ratios of public/private land with Sudane, present some options and ask for the citizens' preferences. He or she might also just identify the lands and declare them 'the fairgrounds'. In either case he or she is acting within their powers.

It appears to me that for a number of terms the roles and responsibilities of the arms of government seem to be getting blurred, and maybe it is just my perception and no one else's. The RA, imo, should deal in law, constitutional issues and issues impacting CDS as a whole eg. buying a sim, selling a sim etc. These major issues usually require a law and amendment for them to be implemented.

All matters relating to land use fall to the office of Chancellor, as does advertising, promotion etc. because the role of Chancellor is, in effect, one of property or estate management. While LL requires that Sudane be listed as 'estate manager' CDS has chosen to move the day to day tasks of that job to the Chancellor.

Personally I feel that even the 'we should rebuild/redesign the outhouses' projects should go through the Chancellor first, and be presented to RA by him or her as an oversight matter, not a voting issue.Calli

I do agree with you Calli regarding the roles of the Chancellor and the RA.

CDS Constitution:

Section 1 – The Chancellor

The Chancellor will serve as the executive of CDS, working to coordinate and plan community projects.

Section 2 – Powers of the Chancellor

The Chancellor of CDS shall, subject to the laws of CDS, have the power:
(a) to determine the use to which any and all land in CDS shall be put;
(b) to expend monies held by the Office of the Chancellor of CDS for the administration and management of public facilities (including, but not limited to, roadways, signage, public buildings, public events and similar), and to discharge any other duties or powers of the Office of the Chancellor conferred by this Act or any other Act of the Representative Assembly.

This seems to be quite clear. If we don't agree that the Chancellor should have these powers, then the Constitution needs to be amended!

[Tanoujin Milestone]

I very much agree with Calli too.

Nevertheless the Representatives need to be up to date with the current issues of estate management to make sure the Chancellor acts within the rule of law on the one hand (this delivers not only a check, but transparency as well) and see if these issues need further legislation to mainly *support* effective governance on the other. I personally think the latter does not apply in this case.

In my opinion a Representative really should try to represent what considerable segments of the citizenry want (out of covenant events vs unspoiled sim themes) and try to find a way (e.g. on designated spaces) to make it possible in close cooperation with the *elected* head of the executive, who will have the final say here.

As a side note: if we want to amend the constitution, we should first of all erase the historical special provision for the elections of the 16th RA in section 1. As long as we fail to address the plain and simple jobs, we should refrain from democratic rocket science. In my humble opinion.